Weeks Fielding Re-visited (New article says hes awful)

[logan82]

The way I see it (and I'm not a metrics guy, but appreciate the value) is that if you take into account the players offense and defense to composite some type of overall metric (which I'm sure exists) you get the true value.

 

They have something called WAR(wins above replacement) that does just that. Weeks can play a passable 2B, Braun was historically bad at 3B. What you want to do is move your players around to get the best defense out of them that you can. Braun might have stayed at 3B but we signed Cameron and it set off a domino effect Hall to 3B Braun to LF.

[thebruce44]

I said at the end of last season we should resign Lopez and move Weeks to the OF. A lineup with Lopez, Weeks 1-2 would look very nice

Lopez's defense may actually be worse than Weeks though.

[JJHardy7]

They have something called WAR(wins above replacement) that does just that. Weeks can play a passable 2B, Braun was historically bad at 3B. What you want to do is move your players around to get the best defense out of them that you can. Braun might have stayed at 3B but we signed Cameron and it set off a domino effect Hall to 3B Braun to LF.

 

Fair enough...I get that. I just have a hard time comparing a very objective stat (batting) to somewhat of a subjective stat (fielding). Braun was terrible at 3B, but does that mean he would have been terrible forever? I don't want to go on and on about this, but Braun would have had the chance to improve. It's not like he played 3B since he was 4. That is more or less my point. If you can get a guy like Braun to stick at 3B, that helps your team. Again, not saying he should be at 3B. I'm saying there is a value measure we need to take into account....and WAR does do that, but I still think defense is subjective. Braun did stink at 3B...that is not subjective. He could've improved or what not, but looking at Weeks now Weeks isn't in the same boat as Braun. He can field his position. The question is whether or not we'll see improvement and he's been playing 2B for awhile now.

[logan82]

No I really don't expect Weeks to get much better on defense. I expect him to be about average going forward. With his hitting ability that makes Weeks a very valuable player at 2B. One of our positions of strength on the team.

 

I didn't want to move Braun off of 3B. I wanted them to give him at least a couple more years there to see if he would improve. In hindsight, I think they made the right choice.

 

The defensive metrics are as objective as they can be. They are much less subjective than scouting reports. There is no way a scout will see every ball hit to every fielder at any given position. Scouting reports used in conjunction with metrics are best. That way you get a good feel for what a player could potentially do.

[JJHardy7]

No I really don't expect Weeks to get much better on defense. I expect him to be about average going forward. With his hitting ability that makes Weeks a very valuable player at 2B. One of our positions of strength on the team.

 

I agree 100%.

 

I didn't want to move Braun off of 3B. I wanted them to give him at least a couple more years there to see if he would improve. In hindsight, I think they made the right choice.

 

I somewhat agree. I'm not saying I was right with Braun (most likely wrong), but I really wish the coaching staff would've at least moved him before the bigs or given him some more time for growth. I'm not saying it would've worked. I think it will be interesting to see what happens with Gamel...it looks like he's making large strides, but he also didn't get the job and tear the cover off the ball either.

 

I also agree with you on the scout issue. I'm not an expert by an means, but if you actually watch some of these minor league guys play and talk to the staff you get a much better idea of where they will land. I've said for a long time Gamel could stick at 3B...and I think he will if he can stay healthy for awhile and produce.

 

Is there any way McGehee could play 2B long-term? My guess is he is somewhat limited there?

[rluzinski]

Braun doesn't seem to be a particularly good defender in LF, so it would be surprising if he would have developed into a better defender at a harder position.

 

I

[logan82]

Is there any way McGehee could play 2B long-term? My guess is he is somewhat limited there?

I think no way. He barely plays passable defense at 3B.

 

I somewhat agree. I'm not saying I was right with Braun (most likely

wrong), but I really wish the coaching staff would've at least moved him

before the bigs or given him some more time for growth.

It would have been nice to get him in the outfield but it is really in the teams best interest to give their players every possible chance to succeed at the toughest possible position.

 

Braun is still a bad defender in LF but at least he has some physical ability that can make up for those shortcomings in LF. I think he has poor defensive instincts and at least in LF he has a little time to use his speed to make up for that.

[Fatter than Joey]

Braun doesn't seem to be a particularly good defender in LF, so it would be surprising if he would have developed into a better defender at a harder position.

 

I agree -- and it didn't seem like the scouts thought Braun was going to get better either.

 

The other reason for moving Braun off of 3rd, was that he was going to be taken out of late/close games, and you don't ever want to have to take Braun's bat out of the lineup.

[JJHardy7]

It would have been nice to get him in the outfield but it is really in the teams best interest to give their players every possible chance to succeed at the toughest possible position.

 

I agree 100%...and that is why I wanted Braun to try and stick at 3B. I just don't like guys learning/moving positions at the MLB level if we can avoid it. The Brewers were willing to move Hart several times in the minors, but for some reason kept Braun at 3B the entire time.

 

Is this at all going to be a Weeks vs. Lawrie at 2B decision? Obviously you don't have to trade one of the two, but if Weeks is kept and Lawrie continues to develop a decision will have to be made at some point.

[logan82]

From what I am hearing over in the Minor League Forum, Weeks is probably the better option at 2B.

[Invader3K]

Right now I'm more worried about Weeks' hitting than his fielding: .236/.338/.374 this year so far in nearly 182 ABs. Macha really needs to give him an off day once in a while (hey, off day today!), or move him away from batting lead-off.

[TuesdaysWithRillo]

Perhaps Weeks will move to the OF after one of Ferris/Lawrie are ready from the minor leagues in 2011 or 2012. Hopefully Lawrie can stick at 2B because his bat would play nicely there. And possibly Ferris could turn out to be a starting 2B in the Bigs. He has little power, but he does carry a decent OBP for Nashville.

[joepepsi]

Obviously Rickie is in a slump right now, but I beginning to think this is what Weeks is, an average defensive 2B with good on base skills, low batting average and occasional pop.

 

He's approaching 2300 plate appearances with a career OPS of .762. That makes him an average to slightly above major league starting 2B. There's nothing wrong with that, but there are probably better or cheaper options for 2B going forward.

[TooLiveBrew]

Everything I read & hear about Lawrie is that there's basically no way he sticks at 2B. He's probably going to be the RF of the future.

[TuesdaysWithRillo]

Everything I read & hear about Lawrie is that there's basically no way he sticks at 2B. He's probably going to be the RF of the future.

I agree with that assessment as I saw him play 2B a few times for the TRats, but it's ok to dream isn't it? http://forum.brewerfan.net/images/smilies/smile.gif

[Gobias Industries]

Right now I'm more worried about Weeks' hitting than his fielding: .236/.338/.374 this year so far in nearly 182 ABs. Macha really needs to give him an off day once in a while (hey, off day today!), or move him away from batting lead-off.

I agree with everything you have stated here, invader. I have to believe that he's probably been the worst hitter in MLB the last month.

 

One thing that's killing Weeks at the plate (besides being behind 0-2 or 1-2 nearly every ab) is his inability to turn on the inside fastball, and it's something that has just started this year. It's become a huge hole in his swing, and pitchers have been attacking it the past month or so. He hasn't ripped a inside corner/just off the plate fastball down the LF line once this year.

 

If he's showing no signs of getting out of it by the ASB, I think we should move on and see what we have in a guy like Heether.

[TooLiveBrew]

He hasn't ripped a inside corner/just off the plate fastball down the LF line once this year.

 

I believe he did that earlier this season against the Cubs... I had his reaction to ripping (iirc) a fastball down the LF line at Wrigley as my avatar for a while.

[FVBrewerFan]

I have no idea why Macha hasn't moved Weeks down in the line-up while he's struggling. Why wouldn't you put Gomez/Escobar in the top two spots? Escobar hit very well in the #2 hole while he was there. Gomez needs to walk more if he's going to lead-off, but it's worth a shot at this point. Put Weeks down in 7th or 8th hole and let him get his swing back.

[Gobias Industries]

I believe he did that earlier this season against the Cubs... I had his reaction to ripping (iirc) a fastball down the LF line at Wrigley as my avatar for a while.

That was a great AB by Weeks, but the pitch he lined down the line was a changeup off of Wells. He's had several hits down the line this year, but they've all been on offspeed pitches.

[TooLiveBrew]

We were both wrong, at least according to MLB Gameday. It had that pitch as a slider in the upper right quadrant of the strike zone. Ah, human memory http://forum.brewerfan.net/images/smilies/smile.gif

 

http://mlb.mlb.com/mlb/ga...lb_chnmlb_1&mode=gameday (at-bat was in the 5th inning)

 

Man, Gameday is so sweet.