anyone else seeing big changes ahead? Latest: Mark A says Melvin is going to be here a long time, Macha will not be fired Monday

[TCSM]

No, not really...he is here for a charity event.

[paul253]

Maybe Macha and Melvin will look at today at get the idea. Go with the young guys, particularly the pitchers. It looks like Axford is the real deal. Braddock certainly could be as well. I'd rather see Marco Estrada in the pen than Vargas or Suppan. Now that there's a day off and we can get the bullpen straight, Parra can go back to starting. Gallardo, Wolf, Narveson, Bush and Parra in the rotation, and if Bush keeps struggling I wouldn't mind seeing Estrada or Loe given a chance. Or even Rivas. I'm just really sick of seeing guys like Davis and Suppan pitch.

[brewmann04]

Bush is the next to be in line to be replaced.

[RockCoCougars]

SoCal Brew Crew Fan]

edit: add: Not retaining Sheets? Like we needed another injured pitcher last year and another one this year with an ERA above 6? Give Melvin credit here for not biting. They had no chance to sign CC...a franchise like this can't afford a contract like that.

Benny just tossed another gem today. 8 K's in 6 innings with only four baserunners allowed. Not bad for a guy still working off some rust. His ERA now stands a bit over 5- better than Randy Wolf. Who would you rather have? It's an easy answer for me. In 10 years, I think Sheets is going to be linked with Melvin as Molitor is to Bando.

[JJHardy7]

I really hope we go on a winning streak so this thread can calm down a bit...but I digress. I know the season hasn't gone our way so far, but baseball is a long, long season. Things will work out. If the 'kids' in the bullpen get to stay, that should shore up that area. Where is the Prince Fielder sucks threads? Obviously I'm not saying he sucks, but if we want to pile on and complain about everything his slugging and OPS is way down from last year. Why haven't we DFA'd him yet? I kid...I kid.

 

I think the thing to remember is that we can play Monday morning QB all day long. I just kind of think it is a waste of time. All the Sheets talk...would he have even come back to the Brewers? I haven't seen a clear answer to that. And it is May...it is May. It's not like Sheets stunk up the joint in Milwaukee...he was fabulous when healthy. So I'm not going to worry about that right now.

 

Mark A is the man first and foremost. Honestly...where would we be without him? Out of Milwaukee? You can look down a few miles to the Bucks and see how crappy an organization can be and the such in terms of management and franchise value. Things haven't gone perfectly now, but I don't want to turn into some fan that demands playoffs every year or this or that. The economies of baseball make that next to impossible for the Brewers. I hate that part of the game, but I'm not going to throw an owner under the bus who has drastically improved payroll and taken a genuine interest as a fan and business person. Things could be much worse long-term...hopefully we turn things around.

 

The season hasn't gone the way we wanted...but how many thought we'd make the playoffs? Go to the WS? I didn't see a ton of people thinking that...and again it is May...

[jeffy]

Sheets turned down arbitration when he was injured and ended up not pitching for a year. I don't think he had any interest in staying with the Brewers.

[PeaveyFury]

and ended up not pitching for a year.

 

Yeah, this really can't be overlooked. If the Brewers had re-signed Sheets and paid him 10-15 million last season while injured the whole time, Melvin would have taken more heat than he already is.

[RockCoCougars]

I've argued this many times before, but would you rather have had Sheets extended for 3.5 years (the first of which he would have been hurt) than sign Suppan for 4 years after 2006? I'm not Monday morning QBing either- I felt at the time that the Suppan signing would likely lead to the loss of Sheets. Say what you want about him, but Sheets was a once in a decade (generation for the Brewers) pitching talent for a franchise, and you don't let guys like that walk. I blame Melvin for the 'ice bridge' that formed between the team and Sheets. Losing Maddux probably didn't help matters either, and really hurt the team in other ways. I think we've seen the value in a good pitching coach the past few years.

[davego]

That's a good point. Ben knew he was hurt to some degree and he still turned down Arby. Granted he might not have assumed that he would sit a year, but shows that he wanted out.

[logan82]

He was on the verge of signing a contract with Texas but couldn't pass the physical before he missed the whole year.

 

Some things to keep in mind with Tampa Bay is that they have been drafting since 1996. So in reality it took them 11 years to build up to where they are now.

[BREWCREW5]

Who would you rather have? It's an easy answer for me. In 10 years, I think Sheets is going to be linked with Melvin as Molitor is to Bando.

Wow. People act like Sheets wanted to resign here and Melvin showed him the door. Sheets did not want to play here anymore. He wanted to go out and get the huge contract. If Melvin would have resigned him when some on here were saying, he would have been payed last year by the Crew to rehab.

 

Sheets may end up having a nice career from here on out but they would have had to waaaaay overpay for him to stay here. And let's be honest, Sheets could go down with a season ending injury next week and no one would be surprised.

[TooLiveBrew]

I have no problem with people disagreeing with Melvin on fundamental strategy issues, or faulting him for not spending money efficiently on certain FAs & re-signings. But the revisionist history of, 'He should have known player X would fall off & sell high on him before that'**, & esp. the Sheets nonsense has to stop imo. If we're going to be critical, let's at least be objective.

 

BREWCREW5 nailed it. Sheets did not want to re-sign here since the Brewers weren't willing to offer a multi-year deal (just like the rest of MLB). Melvin didn't miss the boat there, he made a wise decision on an oft-injured pitcher, and Sheets decided (because of that) that he wouldn't come back. Like PeavyFury said, if Melvin signs Sheets to, say, a 5-year extension, he gets slammed on here non-stop in 2009 (& if/whenever Ben goes down again with injury).

 

 

** Criticism of not selling high on players doesn't inherently bother me, but it's gotten to be a bit much lately it seems. Melvin doesn't have a crystal ball & cannot reasonably predict every player that will stay in top form & every one that will fall off, nor can any GM.

[wibadgers23]

How did this turn into a Ben Sheets thread? Anyway, I can see them DFA Suppan or Vargas in the next few days to make room for Capuano. Not really a big change, but a change nonetheless.

[RobertR]

Maybe we should wait until Ben Sheets has an actual good year, instead of a good 4 starts in a row, before we lump that in as a mistake on Melvin's part. (Really, there's not much difference between Wolf and Sheets on the year. Wolf 80 ERA+, averaging 6.0 IP/start. Sheets 82 ERA+, averaging 5.5 IP/start.) Especially since Ben Sheets certainly didn't seem eager to come back.

 

Melvin certainly hasn't been perfect, but not signing a pitcher that didn't want to come back and hasn't been much better than his de facto replacement doesn't seem to be one of the issues. Pitcher drafting and development is a much bigger issue than Ben Sheets. Heck, given recent results, perhaps not willing to go with Braddock and Axford initially rather than going with "proven" veterans could be laid at Melvin's door.

 

Robert

[Tbadder]

Not signing Benny was brilliant! Next to his curve ball getting hurt is what he does best. Don't worry. He's going down again this year.

[jimmyjeromehardy7]

Macha - from USA today article on Braun -

 

"I didn't really get to know Braun until this spring," second-year manager Ken Macha says. "I sat down with all of the veterans to get to know everyone's personalities. With most, it took about 15 minutes. With Ryan, it lasted an hour, 15 minutes."

 

So you waited a whole year to sit down with the veterans to get to know them. Glad you waited to invest that 15 minutes of time for each player. Reason 873 that I am sick of you as the Brewers manager.

[lcbj68c]

Is it still early?

[zzzmanwitz]

Ben Sheets has a 5.04 ERA, a 1.50 WHIP, and 4.6 BB/9. He didn't pitch all of last season. Why are people so upset we didn't sign him?

[RockCoCougars]

Why is this a Sheets discussion? Because Melvin made absolutely no attempt to extend his contract before or during his all-star season, thus creating the 'Sheets didn't want to play here' situation. Instead, he paid 40-some million for a pitcher better suited as waiver wire fodder.Wouldn't you be upset if your workplace brought in an incompetent with a lesser resume than you and then paid him more than you make right from the get go, without a willingness to negotiate a future pay raise? Heck I'd want to leave too. Again, this isn't revisionist history, lots of people knew that the Suppan signing was a mistake when it happened.

 

I have a feeling that a lot of the Sheets bashers/Melvin supporters here would have been on the 'just a DH Bando-wagon' back in '93 for Molitor, especially when he started slowly. You would have been crowing about that and how the Brewers were able to use the money they would have had to give Molitor to pick up a left handed power bat with Kevin Reimer, and other solid veterans such as Tom Brunansky (coming off a 117 OPS+), Dickie Thon, and Bill Doran. After all, Molitor was undependable and hurt all the time anyway, missing almost 500 games with injuries!

 

Now, the starting rotation has been terrible for two seasons, and that's not Melvin's fault somehow. I guess that replacing Sheets and Sabathia with Braden Looper was a deft move. This isn't even getting into the ridiculous signings of Hall (which I admit that I was in favor of), Gagne (questionable, but I was semi-OK until the steroid news broke like two days later, then I wondered why Melvin hadn't done his homework) and David Riske (stupid from the get go). That's not even mentioning the off season signings, extensions and trades from this past off-season- all of which are looking dicey at best at this point.

 

At what point should Melvin be held accountable for these mistakes?

[logan82]

Suppan never made more than Sheets in any year Sheets was playing for us and the contract was only for $6M more over the duration including the buyout.

[sheethead]

While that is true, the Brewers gave Suppan 4/$42M, and they gave Sheets 4/$38.5M two years earlier. Needless to say, Suppan has been a colossal bust.

[zzzmanwitz]

At what point should Melvin be held accountable for these mistakes?

 

Melvin is being held accountable for these mistakes, but he should also be credited for his successes. All GMs make good and bad moves, some teams are just able to cover the mistakes better because of money. The Brewers, and Melvin, don't have this luxury. Suppan, while I don't agree with it, was a move to get this team closer to a playoff birth. It looks bad now, but 7 of the 8 seasons prior to becoming a Suppan had over 100 ERA+, Averaged 32 games started with a 4.42 ERA and a 1.398 WHIP. At the time of the deal, it was a fair price. He would have been a great 3/4 pitcher if we had someone other than Ben Sheets pitching well that season (and Sheets only pitched in 24 games). His first two seasons with the Brewers, he was slightly below average (96, 85).

While that is true, the Brewers gave Suppan 4/$42M, and they gave Sheets 4/$38.5M two years earlier. [/i]

Sheets was not a FA when he signed his deal. 2 years of Arbitration were bought out with his deal. It may not be fair, but that is how baseball works. Is it fair that Corey Hart makes almost 4x what Ryan Braun makes? No. Its all about when you sign your contract.

[sheethead]

Melvin is being held accountable for these mistakes, but he should also be credited for his successes.

 

Like plucking Axford out of thin air. Granted there is risk with Axford, but its looking like a great minor league signing right now.

[Invader3K]

Melvin wanted to see if Sheets could stay healthy for the majority of a season after missing large portions of 2005, 2006, and 2007 with injuries (at least that is what I suspect). It's not like Sheets was getting younger. Committing to a large $60 million+ contract (as many here were advocating) with such a player would have been highly risky for a small market team. And I also recall Melvin and Co. did meet with Sheets and Casey Close the past two off-seasons, so it's not like they didn't test the waters.

[TooLiveBrew]

I'm curious to get others' takes on what Melvin's success with so-called scrap-heap guys is worth. He essentially picks these players up for free. This is just a list of guys off the top of my head:

 

Axford

McGehee

Kottaras

Estrada (Marco)

Coffey

Narveson

Davis (first go-round)

Podsednik (only on here bc he helped get Carlos Lee)

Turnbow

Clark

Kolb

Wise

EDIT: added Coffey & Narveson