What should be next for Hart? -- Latest: Platoon seems to be working (reply #137ish)

[chadomac]

I was at the exhibition game Friday and I'm pretty sure Hart got booed.

 

I have a feeling he and Edmonds are going to split time with the better man getting more starts as time goes on. I'm okay with that.

[Baldkin]

Hart got booed today during pregame introductions.

 

I was pretty shocked. It's opening day, give the guy a chance.

[rluzinski]

Hart got booed today during pregame introductions.

 

I was pretty shocked. It's opening day, give the guy a chance.

I'm not shocked anymore. It's been like this in Milwaukee for the last five years or so.

[logan82]

It could be a matter where Melvin simply called Dye's agent, found out

he was asking a crazy amount for his services, and then passed.

Implying a guy is "crazy" because he would rather do other things with his time than work for the league minimum is fair? I guess I disagree with your concept of fair. Dye may be asking for what seems to be an unrealistic amount but maybe he's decided it's not worth it for him to play unless he gets a certain amount of money. He's only making the same kind of calculation that everybody in the world makes every day but he's singled out as being off his nut? I don't get that.

Where did anybody imply Dye was crazy? They described the amount as crazy. I also missed the player/agent bashing against anybody besides Hart.

 

Hart's WAR over the last 3 years, 4.5, 1.1, 0.8

Dye's WAR over the last 3 years -0.6, 1.8, -0.2

[jhart05]

Hart got booed today during pregame introductions.

 

I was pretty shocked. It's opening day, give the guy a chance.

 

I don't know what you expect from a bunch of drunken idiots. Especially on opening day. I stay as far away from the park as I can on that day.

[sheethead]

Hart got booed today during pregame introductions.

 

I was pretty shocked. It's opening day, give the guy a chance.

I'm not shocked anymore. It's been like this in Milwaukee for the last five years or so.

I think it has a lot to do with the way he has been portrayed by the media (JS writers especially).

[Crew2323]

I would say that the cheers for Hart far outweighed the boos. I was specifically listening for it, and the boo's weren't anything that bad. It wasn't anywhere near the Wes Helms level. Now, I couldn't tell if Suppan was being booed or the fans were just saying "SOUP." But I would say the cheers for Hart made the boo's almost inaudible.

[FVBrewerFan]

Not that I agree with it, but a case can be made to boo Hart based on his arby situation. Suppan did get boo'd, those were not "soup" At least not most of them. That does bother me, because Soupan has been a lightening rod for criticism. That's fine, he's overpaid...I get it. But I didn't like hearing him get boo'd. At the time he signed here, it was a big deal. Whether we agreed with it or not. It's not his fault the Brwers gave him the contract. He's handled himself well, and takes the ball and does his best. I don't think that's worth booing.

[TooLiveBrew]

He's handled himself well, and takes the ball and does his best. I don't think that's worth booing.

 

You can make the exact same case for Corey Hart. It's just fans being vindictive & having ridiculously short memories in his case. I mean, people were incensed that Hart went to arby, because 'how dare he!', and he was stupid for going to arby... he'd never win. And then he won. And then people got even more mad. All over $750K that means next to nothing to the Brewers. Hart has been open & honest about the arby process, and every report I've read is that he's a great guy & his teammates love him. I don't believe anyone who says he/she wouldn't have gone after the extra $750K in his position. It's the way the system works, and Hart got good advice from his representation.

 

If I haven't stated this publicly, I just want to be clear -- I really am not a Hart fanboy. I like him as a Brewer, but I know that unless he returns to his earlier form he's not that rare of a talent. I just can't stand how fickle & vindictive many fans are being about this guy. He doesn't owe you anything, played by the rules, and was awarded this salary. If you want to be mad, be mad that MLB uses archaic methods to award player contracts in arbitration. Or you can just think of the $4.8M as back-pay for his awesome 2007 when he played for the league minimum. Not because I think it's perfectly accurate (or that I expect everyone to agree with it), but because it provides a frame of reference for how good his '07 was, FanGraphs has its estimated dollar value at $18.5M.

[rluzinski]

Hart's CHONE Projection: .271 / .333 / .456 / .789

 

Hart, May 16th: .258 / .346 / .462 / .808

 

To be fair, he's been platooned a little, so that has helped him somewhat. Still, he's he's slightly beating his projected offensive performance, which completely ignores spring training. He might not be worth what he's getting paid but he still has value and will be in the league for awhile, most likely.

 

Whatever scout told Bill Micheals that Hart was "done" (based off what he was doing in spring training) should be fired. And Dye is STILL asking for more money than he's worth.

[bobskube]

Hart's CHONE Projection: .271 / .333 / .456 / .789

 

Hart, May 16th: .258 / .346 / .462 / .808

 

To be fair, he's been platooned a little, so that has helped him somewhat. Still, he's he's slightly beating his projected offensive performance, which completely ignores spring training. He might not be worth what he's getting paid but he still has value and will be in the league for awhile, most likely.

 

Whatever scout told Bill Micheals that Hart was "done" (based off what he was doing in spring training) should be fired. And Dye is STILL asking for more money than he's worth.

I like that you brought up the point about his platoon. It definitely has helped the numbers a bit. I think Corey is a player that when the pressure is on, he crumbles. However, when he is patient and relaxed he seems to be fine. He is you prototypical average #7 hitter who is nothing special but probably will last in this league about 12 years because he does enough things good enough.

[JJHardy7]

Would anyone prefer to have Cole Gillespie back? I know most here thought he was a 'throw-in' in the Lopez trade last year, but I was not one of them. I'm not saying he's going to be a stud or anything like that, but Gillespie might have had a role with this team (maybe a small role).

 

I think it would've been nice to have Cole in the organization and if Hart struggles or needs a platoon of some sorts Cole would be a cheap, young option.

[endaround]

Cole can't play RF by all accounts.

[topper09er]

Split	G	GS	PA	AB	R	H	2B	3B	HR	RBI	SB	CS	BB	SO	BA	OBP	SLG	OPS	TB	GDP	HBP	SH	SF	IBB	ROE	BAbip	tOPS+	sOPS+
vs RHP as RHB	27		68	60		13	2	1	2	10	2	1	8	16	.217	.309	.383	.692	23	3	0	0	0	0	1	.262	72	91
vs LHP as RHB	16		39	33		11	3	0	2	6	1	0	5	3	.333	.410	.606	1.016	20	1	0	0	1	1	1	.310	150	174

The platoon is the only reason he is in the majors, if he would be playing every day he'd have disgusting numbers. He should be platooned exclusively, including when he starts against a LH starter and then has to face a RHP in the later inning. But Macha cant pinch hit in the middle of the game because "its Corey's day to start"

[monty57]

Someone should change the thread title. When this thread got brought back up I thought the Brewers were going after Dye now that Edmonds & Gomez are hurt :-)

 

Good post Topper09er. As a full-time player with 80% of his PAs against righties, Hart's numbers would likely be right around where they've been the past few years. Much like Wes Helms, he has a place on a team when used correctly, but like Helms, we're paying too much for the RH part of a platoon. To Macha's credit, he has platooned Hart and it has played out fairly well so far. We'll see what happens with the injuries kicking in, as Macha really doesn't seem to like playing Gerut.

[1992casey]

The topic title raised my eye, too. What should it be? http://forum.brewerfan.net/images/smilies/smile.gif

[JJHardy7]

Cole can't play RF by all accounts.

 

I've made my modest opinion about that before so I won't go into that. I guess you could maybe move Braun to RF if Cole can hit, but again that isn't a slam dunk. I guess I don't like the fact that he was a 'throw in' according to some when he was traded. He was among the top 10 or top 15 prospects for awhile according to bf.net. I guess my point is...he had/has value. I don't think he's going to be a stud, but I think he can be a MLB player. The Brewers could use help in the OF now, but you are right...if he can't play RF it makes it a bit more difficult. Again, I'm not expert, but I think the jury is still out on Cole's spot. He played 15 games in LF, 8 in CF, and 19 in RF with Arizona in AAA last year. I find that interesting since the Brewers used him exclusively in LF last year. Again, maybe there is no way he has the arm to play RF. I'm not saying he does. It also would be nice if he can play all 3 OF positions, but I'm not sure that he can at the MLB level.

[TheCrew]

3rd straight multi-hit game and a HR in all 3 games - Is Hart finally turning it around?

[dlk9s]

It might be a nice 3 games, it might be a turn around. Who knows?

[davemakovec]

He's just getting lucky swinging at everything. DFA.

[monty57]

I'd be really happy to eat crow if Hart has actually made the adjustment and can be a good hitter again. Personally, I'd use a hot year hitting mostly against lefties as a springboard to trade him. GM's were apparently looking to trade for him not too long ago, so an .800+OPS line with a year of control could give him some trade value.

[rluzinski]

Mostly against lefties? 62% of his PA have come against righties. That's less than average for an everyday starter but it's a pretty soft platoon. It would have taken you 30 seconds to look that up, BTW.

[1992casey]

monty57 said, "I'd use a hot year hitting mostly against lefties…" To me, that doesn't necessarily imply that Hart is actually hitting mostly against lefties at this point. Also, I don't see the need for scolding monty57 for not looking up the stat; methinks the evidence in this topic is sufficient for him make his point: if Hart establishes himself in a suitable role, it might be wise to trade him while he has value.

[rluzinski]

If I misunderstood Monty, I apologize. I just think that even the title of this thread (which I presume you edited) is somewhat misleading. Hart has had more starts against RH starters than lefties, so he's barely barely being platooned. Am I being overly defensive? Probably. I can just see, however, all the "he's done!" commentors pointing to his supposed platoon role as the only reason he's having even modest success. I don't think that would be fair.

[MJLiverock]

His success this year is due to absolutely killing LH pitching to a tune of an OPS of 1.2. Against RHers he is about normal for his career, a mid .700 OPS. But as so many are fond of saying, it is a small sample thus far and I wouldn't count on his continued 1.20+ OPS against LHers.