Big Ten Expansion

[JoeHova]

Iowa State, Kansas, Kansas St., Missouri, Baylor and either Texas Tech or A&M as your conference?

 

Tech is going to the Pac regardless, A&M is either going to the Pac or SEC, so neither will be left in the Big 12. I agree that the Big 12 is on borrowed time, barring some late change of heart by the Longhorns or Sooners.

I really, really doubt that Tech will get to go to the Pac-10 if A&M and OU go to the SEC and Texas goes independent. The only reason to invite Tech would be to bring along one or more of the bigger Texas schools (or possibly Oklahoma). If people joke about AZ State being a garbage school, what will they say about Tech? I'm surprised the Pac-10 would take them at all but without at least one of the 3 prizes from the Big 12 South, they really have no reason to let Texas Tech get a cut of their pie.

[craigharmann]

One of the big things going on that I'm trying to figure out is that there has been a very strong rivalry between Texas A&M and Texas. The two schools even discussed their plans apparently, so that whatever happens, they stay together. Now A&M is talking SEC, SEC, SEC (which is where the best fit for Texas would be in my opinion), and all the talk with Texas is Pac-10. So either there's something fishy, A&M is blowing smoke to get a better deal with the Pac-10, or Texas is blowing smoke. As for Texas Tech, yes, I don't think they go without Texas or possibly Oklahoma. They're not a prize in all of this.

[PeaveyFury]

I really, really doubt that Tech will get to go to the Pac-10 if A&M and OU go to the SEC and Texas goes independent.

 

That's probably correct. I was responding to craig's scenario where he had Texas, Oklahoma, and Oklahoma State already going to the Pac when I made that statement.

 

So either there's something fishy, A&M is blowing smoke to get a

better deal with the Pac-10, or Texas is blowing smoke.

 

I agree that this seems really odd. I guess it's possible that despite the joint meetings and such, A&M is sick of being the 'little brother' in all of this. Still, why in the world isn't Texas talking with the SEC? If the SEC is trying to expand their brand into Texas, you'd think the only way that they'd pursue A&M to do so would be if Texas shunned them.

[sbrylski]

SEC is a terrible academic conference. I don't think Texas would consider going there.

 

If A&M and Oklahoma bolt for the SEC, I think at that point Texas pulls the plug on the Pac-10 and leans back to the Big 10, which is what I'm pulling for.

[endaround]

Yep the SEC is terrible academically. There are some good schools, some decent schools and then Florida, Alabama, Mississippi, and LSU.

 

The Pac-10 has Standford, Cal and UCLA while the Big 10 may not be as top heavy as the Pac 10 its worst school is now Nebraska and each of its member schools aside from maybe Penn State and Nebraska have top of the line areas.

If teams keep getting pouched I could see the Big East offering a slot to Memphis to replace a Syracuse or Pitt.

[craigharmann]

OK, newest bit is this: The Big 12 commissioner is trying to keep who is left together. It would be $17 million going to each school yearly, each school could come up with their own network, and no Championship game. This seems to be enticing for Texas. If you want more info, check out orangebloods.com

[PeaveyFury]

Interesting that they project Texas' TV intake even with their own network to be in the 20-22 million range in a few years, which is less than they'd make in the Big Ten.

 

Also, getting rid of the championship game even temporarily will certainly hurt revenues, as that cash cow is one of the main reasons the Big Ten was looking to add that 12th team. That's in addition to the revenue generating capacity losses from Nebraska and Colorado.

 

Maybe what Beebe is promising is plausible (though I guess it's his job to try and keep the league together even if not plausible), but I just can't see that being the most attractive/lucrative offer that is going to be out there for Texas to consider.

[logan82]

I had heard that each Big Ten team received $20M per year from the BTN. On top of that I would think each team received a pretty penny each year for bowl games as I believe that money all gets split up evenly. Sorry, no reference links for that.

[sbrylski]

Chip Brown is now writing that the Big 12 might survive with Texas supposedly changing their minds about the Pac 10. (Though as I said earlier, I was never convinced they wanted to go there anyway.) LINK

 

It'll all depend on Texas A&M now, who still could bolt to the SEC, leaving the Big 12 with just nine teams and probably the final dagger.

 

And in terms of my Texas to the Big 10 prediction, I'm now thinking Oklahoma would have to go the SEC as well for it to happen. As long as Texas can stay with Oklahoma (or A&M), I think they will if it means the Pac 10 - but definitely not the academically non-existent SEC.

[craigharmann]

Good God, will this soap opera never end? ESPN.com has that Texas is "imminently" going to the Pac-10, while Orangebloods.com says they're "imminently" committing to what's left of the Big 12! Sounds like a woman that won't make up her mind!

[I Heart Brewers]

I wish the Pac-10 would call Texas bluff because that is certainly what it feels like at this point. It sounds like they are attempting to squeeze as much money out of the Pac-10 in these negotiations as possible. Texas really wants to stay in that 10 (or could be 9 if Texas Tech leaves for the SEC) team conference? I'm not buying it. Hopefully that is just the cynic in me.

[MJLiverock]

I have heard it mentioned that there is some rule or law in Texas that wherever Texas goes, Texas Tech also has to go. I have't been able to find a concrete source on that one yet. Texas A&M is free to go wherever, which is why they are the ones most often mentioned going to the SEC, especially if the PAC 10 added Colorado bringing them up to 11, then if they grabbed Texas, forced to take Texas Tech, and Oklahoma followed brining that conference to 14.

[craigharmann]

I don't think there's a rule or a law regarding Texas Tech......Texas and Texas A&M have had a rivalry that has gone on forever, and the two teams have discussed moving together to another conference. It seems like the package deal is Oklahoma and Oklahoma St (with their rivalry) and Texas and Texas A&M (with their rivalry), however, A&M seems to really want to go to the SEC.....whether they're invited or not may be up for discussion.

[sbrylski]

I wish the Pac-10 would call Texas bluff because that is certainly what it feels like at this point. It sounds like they are attempting to squeeze as much money out of the Pac-10 in these negotiations as possible. Texas really wants to stay in that 10 (or could be 9 if Texas Tech leaves for the SEC) team conference? I'm not buying it. Hopefully that is just the cynic in me.

I think Texas is just stalling. Either they don't want to go to the Pac-10, or they don't know what they want. They know the Big 12 will be done for as soon as A&M goes to the SEC, so all they are doing here is buying a week or two, or however long it takes for A&M to bolt.

[craigharmann]

I think Texas is just stalling. Either they don't want to go to the Pac-10, or they don't know what they want. They know the Big 12 will be done for as soon as A&M goes to the SEC, so all they are doing here is buying a week or two, or however long it takes for A&M to bolt.

I don't know. The regents meet tomorrow and they have a press conference scheduled for tomorrow afternoon.

[JoeHova]

As long as the Big Ten doesn't end up taking the Big 12 leftovers after the Pac-10 destroys that conference, I'll be happy. Unfortunately, I feel like Delany will panic once the Pac gets to 16 teams. If the Big Ten, supposedly the strongest conference overall, ends up having to take the 8th and/or 9th most desirable school(s) from a collapsed conference, I will look on that as a massive failure on the part of Big Ten leadership. I hope they just stay at 12 for a few years if they can't get a game-changing school.

[davego]

I'd assume the Big 10 would stay at 12. Going to 14 should (IMO) include ND. If not, why bother?

[JoeHova]

I'd assume the Big 10 would stay at 12. Going to 14 should (IMO) include ND. If not, why bother?

That's exactly my question.

[sbrylski]

I think Texas is just stalling. Either they don't want to go to the Pac-10, or they don't know what they want. They know the Big 12 will be done for as soon as A&M goes to the SEC, so all they are doing here is buying a week or two, or however long it takes for A&M to bolt.

I don't know. The regents meet tomorrow and they have a press conference scheduled for tomorrow afternoon.

Yeah, but that was the exact reason we were supposed to believe the Pac-10 deal was done, because there was an upcoming meeting and press conference. But now it means they're announcing they will hold the Big 12 together, and that this decision would be final?

 

By stalling, I mean Texas gets everyone to say they'll work together on a new Big 12, and that removes all pressure for them to do anything right away. It will also move the blame for the breakup of the Big 12 to A&M, as they will be the ones to leave, cutting the league to nine and killing the conference.

[PKBadger]

Unfortunately, I feel like Delany will panic once the Pac gets to 16 teams. If the Big Ten, supposedly the strongest conference overall, ends up having to take the 8th and/or 9th most desirable school(s) from a collapsed conference, I will look on that as a massive failure on the part of Big Ten leadership. I hope they just stay at 12 for a few years if they can't get a game-changing school.

Why do you think that Delany would panic? He started this chess match in the first place. If the Big Ten hadn't announced that they were "exploring expansion" months ago, none of this would be happening.

The Pac-16 doesn't really threaten any of the Big Ten's interests. In any case, there is zero chance that the Big Ten takes an undesirable school. I don't see any scenario that they would even need to "panic" about. They are dealing from a position of strength.

[JoeHova]

Why do you think that Delany would panic? He started this chess match in the first place. If the Big Ten hadn't announced that they were "exploring expansion" months ago, none of this would be happening.

The Pac-16 doesn't really threaten any of the Big Ten's interests. In any case, there is zero chance that the Big Ten takes an undesirable school. I don't see any scenario that they would even need to "panic" about. They are dealing from a position of strength.

I think he'll panic because the Pac-10 took the wheel and is now steering this (if Texas goes there). The Pac-10 is threatening the Big Ten's interests, imo. If this expansion goes through they've hooked the biggest fish out there and would have a significant presence in the Central time zone whereas before they only had 2 schools even in the Mountain time zone. There could be a lot more head to head TV competition between the two conferences.

 

I think there is a significant chance that the Big Ten gets stuck with a couple of booby prizes if the Big 12 collapses. Probably nothing as outlandish as Iowa State but probably not much better either. I hope I'm wrong and just being pessimistic but I'll feel a lot better when this is over and there are no more Big 12 schools in the Big Ten.

[MJLiverock]

I don't think there's a rule or a law regarding Texas Tech......Texas and Texas A&M have had a rivalry that has gone on forever, and the two teams have discussed moving together to another conference. It seems like the package deal is Oklahoma and Oklahoma St (with their rivalry) and Texas and Texas A&M (with their rivalry), however, A&M seems to really want to go to the SEC.....whether they're invited or not may be up for discussion.

The closest thing I could find to a rule tethering Texas and Texas Tech is in this SI article - - http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2010/writers/andy_staples/06/13/expansion.sunday/index.html?xid=cnnbin

 

Basically, back when the SWC realigned the Texas government pressured the Texas and Texas A&M to remain in the same conference as the other Texas schools. That is probably where the rumors I heard of Texas and Texas Tech being tethered together come from.

 

I would imagine Texas would keep A&M as a non conference rival based on that history. I know of two friends who went to Texas A&M, netiher are big football fans but they get fired up and talk about that game every year.

 

 

 

 

[T B0NE 10]

I wonder what Colorado is thinking now that the Big 12 could stay together.

[JoeHova]

I wonder what Colorado is thinking now that the Big 12 could stay together.

I'm sure they're quite pleased they were able to leverage the uncertainty into an invite to the Pac-10.

[RockCoCougars]

I wonder what Colorado is thinking now that the Big 12 could stay together.

I'm sure they're quite pleased they were able to leverage the uncertainty into an invite to the Pac-10.

Maybe it's just me, but I always considered the Big 12 a much stronger conference in football and even stronger in basketball for the past several years. This is all about money, both the Big Ten Network and the Pac 10 (through Fox Sports Net) serve much larger markets than the Big 12, which covers a lot of 'flyover country'. May as well start paying the players.