Reds Sign Orlando Cabrera, 1yr/$3MM

[crewcrazy]

According to Tim Brown of Yahoo Sports, Cabrera signs a 1 year deal for $3 million with the Reds, with a $3 million option for a second year. Cabrera's decision came down to Cincy and Colorado, but chose the Reds because the Rockies would have asked him to move from shortstop.

Looks like a pretty solid deal for the Reds. They'd probably be better off defensively with Janish, but he can still hit a little bit and the contract is hardly a killer.

[RockCoCougars]

According to Tim Brown of Yahoo Sports, Cabrera signs a 1 year deal for $3 million with the Reds, with a $3 million option for a second year. Cabrera's decision came down to Cincy and Colorado, but chose the Reds because the Rockies would have asked him to move from shortstop.

Looks like a pretty solid deal for the Reds. They'd probably be better off defensively with Janish, but he can still hit a little bit and the contract is hardly a killer.

Nice deal for Cincy. I'm thinking if Votto can get his head together this year and the pitching comes through, the Reds are going to be a strong contender for the division.

[TooLiveBrew]

Solid pickup for Cincy. They're definitely a (pesky) force to be reckoned with in 2010. We'll just have to hope for some Dusty Baker magic to help neutralize their talent.

[Ennder]

Not sure I can say he is an upgrade over Janish at this point. His glove has slipped and is probably average at best at this point and he put up a .316 OBP last year. Last year by WAR he was worth $2.9M so it seems like a fair deal but I think Janish probably would have been just as valuable since he is a plus defensively at least.

[JohnBriggs12]

Not sure I can say he is an upgrade over Janish at this point. His glove has slipped and is probably average at best at this point and he put up a .316 OBP last year. Last year by WAR he was worth $2.9M so it seems like a fair deal but I think Janish probably would have been just as valuable since he is a plus defensively at least.

The offensive difference between Cabrera and Janish is considerable. Cabrera is a run producer. He has more RBI over the last 3 seasons than Mike Cameron, including last year when he had 77, which would have been 3rd on the Brewers. Janish had just 16 in over 250 AB's. Janish can now be used as late inning defensive replacement.

 

This is a great deal for the Reds. They got a starting SS and upgrade to their lineup for barely more than the Brewers are paying their utility infielder.

 

 

[Ennder]

He has more RBI over the last 3 seasons than Mike Cameron, including last year when he had 77, which would have been 3rd on the Brewers. Janish had just 16 in over 250 AB's. Janish can now be used as late inning defensive replacement.

 

Sure if the Reds bat him 2nd or 3rd (where he hit in 2007/2009) then yeah he might get 77 RBI playing every single day. Of course that total is not impressive at all for a 2nd or 3rd hitter and he'll give you a mediocre OBP and likely average or below average defense to go with it. Almost any player in baseball can get 75 RBI batting 2nd or 3rd every day. My guess is this is a deal where if they pick up the option it is to keep Cabrera as a utility infielder for 2011 because I doubt he is a full time player for more than next year.

 

Again I said it is probably a fair deal, I just don't think it helps the team all that much. The defensive difference between the two is about the same as the offensive difference. There is more certainty in Cabrera so maybe that was part of the reasoning.

[Invader3K]

Seems like a pretty good deal for the Reds.

[endaround]

CHONE projections: 0.5 for Cabrera, 1.3 for Janish (playing part time)

[Funketown]

A projection around .275/.325/.375/.700 is pretty reasonable for Cabrera, probably something like .225/.300/.350/.650. When defense is added into the equation, I'm hard-pressed to believe Cabrera will provide even near $3MM in excess value over Janish. I could well be missing something here, as I don't follow the Reds very closely, but on the surface, I'm not sure I see the point of this deal. It's hard to be too critical of, given the value, but still...

 

 

Although, to be fair, Janish did have another -.12 WAR from his pitching. That should really hurt his value going forward. (This should be in blue, I'm too lazy to hit blue).

[thebruce44]

Not sure I can say he is an upgrade over Janish at this point. His glove has slipped and is probably average at best at this point and he put up a .316 OBP last year. Last year by WAR he was worth $2.9M so it seems like a fair deal but I think Janish probably would have been just as valuable since he is a plus defensively at least.

The offensive difference between Cabrera and Janish is considerable. Cabrera is a run producer. He has more RBI over the last 3 seasons than Mike Cameron, including last year when he had 77, which would have been 3rd on the Brewers. Janish had just 16 in over 250 AB's. Janish can now be used as late inning defensive replacement.

 

This is a great deal for the Reds. They got a starting SS and upgrade to their lineup for barely more than the Brewers are paying their utility infielder.

Thats like judging a pitcher based on wins.

[JohnBriggs12]

"That's like judging a pitcher based on wins.

 

Last time I looked, all pitchers with 300 wins are in the Hall of Fame.

 

Producing runs consistently over time (like winning games for pitchers) isn't due to luck. For a guy who doesn't hit a lot of HR, or normally hit in an RBI spot in the order, Cabrera has driven in a lot of runs over time. Cabrera has 377 plate appearances in his career with a man on 3rd and less than 2 outs. In those 377 appearances, Cabrera has hit .362/339/.481, with 77 sacrifice flies, and just 18 K's. That is great situational hitting and not luck.

[RobertR]

It's not all luck, but opportunity plays a huge role in RBIs. As does playing in the AL with the DH turning the lineup over. And 700+ PAs the last couple of seasons doesn't hurt.

 

Cabrera was a good player, but I think it's fair to question how much he has left in the tank. And how much of an improvement he'll be.

 

Robert

[Funketown]

"That's like judging a pitcher based on wins.

 

Last time I looked, all pitchers with 300 wins are in the Hall of Fame.

This doesn't justify the notion that wins should be used to judge pitchers, it justifies the notion that wins are used to judge pitchers in Hall of Fame voting.

 

Both RBI's and wins are highly dependent on opportunity. Braden Looper went 14-7 last year, while Yovani Gallardo went 13-12. Likewise, David Ortiz (.238/.332/..462/.794) had 99 RBI's last year while Ben Zobrist (.297/.405/.543/.948) only had 91. If Ben Zobrist and David Ortiz were both given the same opportunities to drive in runs, Zobrist would have crushed Ortiz's total.

[strawbossisevil]

This doesn't justify the notion that wins should be used to judge pitchers, it justifies the notion that wins are used to judge pitchers in Hall of Fame voting.

 

Both RBI's and wins are highly dependent on opportunity. Braden Looper went 14-7 last year, while Yovani Gallardo went 13-12. Likewise, David Ortiz (.238/.332/..462/.794) had 99 RBI's last year while Ben Zobrist (.297/.405/.543/.948) only had 91. If Ben Zobrist and David Ortiz were both given the same opportunities to drive in runs, Zobrist would have crushed Ortiz's total.

If you´ve been around here long enough, you´ll know that JohnBriggs has had this argument made in his direction probably a hundred times. At this point it´s just not worth arguing with him on the point.

 

Stats show that RBI and Wins are pointless when looking at a player´s production and worth to a team. If he wants to ignore that and continue to overvalue counting stats that´s his choice, I doubt there is anything we could say to change his mind.