What's up with Corey Hart? Latest: Hart wins arbitration hearing (post # 190)

[I Heart Brewers]

The more important question is how much value does the Corey Hart jersey I received 2 years ago have? I'm almost embarassed to wear it this season.

 

Unless he mashes... http://forum.brewerfan.net/images/smilies/smile.gif

[TooLiveBrew]

So Xavier Nady, the only one listed comparable to Hart, got $3m despite not even playing last season and we're supposed to be incredibly upset that Hart got $4.8m? $700K makes no difference to the Brewers

 

This. I think the upset fans need to get over this in a hurry -- there's really no sense in getting caught up over money that doesn't impact the Brewers' ability to do business or contend. Hopefully Corey comes out of the gates hot this season just like he did in '09. If he doesn't, the booing is probably inevitable.

[sheethead]

Liberals are experts at giving away other peoples money.

 

Conversely, conservatives are experts at spending my money on war games. Precisely why I can't stand either one. I HIGHLY doubt a liberal agenda played into this ruling, and I know plenty of female conservatives. Turning to politics here seems like a huge stretch to me.

[JohnBriggs12]

So Xavier Nady, the only one listed comparable to Hart, got $3m despite not even playing last season and we're supposed to be incredibly upset that Hart got $4.8m? $700K makes no difference to the Brewers

 

This. I think the upset fans need to get over this in a hurry -- there's really no sense in getting caught up over money that doesn't impact the Brewers' ability to do business or contend. Hopefully Corey comes out of the gates hot this season just like he did in '09. If he doesn't, the booing is probably inevitable.

$700K makes a difference to every business TooLiveBrew. I work for a company in credit with revenues comparable to a major league franchise. Believe me when I tell you senior management would not take kindly to a $700K bad debt.

[sheethead]

Believe me when I tell you senior management would not take kindly to a $700K bad debt.

 

How would they react to $14 million worth of bad (Suppan) debt?

[Flood Pants]

This will sound sexist but I knew the Brewers were in trouble when I saw 2 of the 3 on the panel were women and therefore more likely liberal leaning. Liberals are experts at giving away other peoples money.

Wow... do you have any more stereotypes to throw out there?

[brewcrew7]

I cannot believe this is getting this much of a reaction. It's not a ton of money and don't really care what he gets paid. He had a bad year. Move on. JJ Hardy was a complete joke last year and people used every excuse and gave him every chance possible. Even when he was traded there was still a group that was upset we cut ties. And JJ will make 4.6 this year. What's the difference? Hart isn't the heart throb JJ is? Hart can at least run a bit and create something if allowed to. Again, I can't understand the outrage for a small amount of money that is not yours.

[monty57]

While this is surprising, it appears Hart played his hand wisely. I doubt he gets cut this season, as the Brewers would still need to pay him nearly $1MM and then sign someone else to play the position, or leave it in the hands of Gerut/Edmonds, which bears some risk.

 

I do think this will increase the likelihood that Hart isn't offered arby next season, as he will now probably make close to $7MM in 2011. Even if he hits at the .785 OPS the projection systems are calling for, he is not worth that price. If he does play well, and hits for an .800+ OPS, he will probably shoot for $8-9MM if offered arby. I just hope some of our minor league OFs take big strides forward this season so they'll be ready to replace Hart next year. Maybe he'll get off to a hot start and someone like Cain is playing well at AAA, and the Brewers will be able to trade Hart for something useful at the deadline.

[Invader3K]

Wow... do you have any more stereotypes to throw out there?

Maybe the females on the panel were overcome by Hart's lanky frame and gawky looks?

[Brew City]

I have to agree with Monty. Corey played his hand and came up big. Lucky? maybe, but it sure worked out to the tune of almost double the Brewer's offer.

Here's hoping he can at least produce enough to hold his spot, or he will really hear it.

[Mike2k33]

I don't get the anger towards Hart. Everyone here would do the same as him if given the opportunity. We shouldn't let ourselves get jealous over the money they make, it's just part of the game. I certainly won't boo him just because he won his case. That would make me look foolish.

 

Also, as a Liberal I only enjoy spending conservatives money. I frugally keep mine hidden next to pictures of Chairman Mao in a bus I have buried in the back yard.

[TooLiveBrew]

$700K makes a difference to every business TooLiveBrew. I work for a company in credit with revenues comparable to a major league franchise. Believe me when I tell you senior management would not take kindly to a $700K bad debt.

$700K is not going to hamper the Brewers in any way this season, not to mention the fact that it's entirely plausible that Hart is worth the $4.8M. Maybe not likely, but certainly not unrealistic. Would the Brewers liked to have saved that $700K? Yes. Is it going to hurt them this season? No.

brewcrew7]JJ will make 4.6 this year. What's the difference?

Defensive position... though I get the general point you're making in the comparison.

[pogokat]

to me, the biggest issue is how much hart will make in arby next year...considering this, he's at a minimum of 6 next year even if he doesn't improve...that means there is 0 chance he's with the brewers next year because they will surely non-tender him

[lcbj68c]

Congrats to Corey for sticking to his guns.

 

Conversely, conservatives are experts at spending my money on war games. Precisely why I can't stand either one. I HIGHLY doubt a liberal agenda played into this ruling, and I know plenty of female conservatives. Turning to politics here seems like a huge stretch to me.

 

Big Time Stretch!

 

 

I think it was the JS that reported what the historical percentages are for players winning their cases. It is definitely in the clubs favor, and I think that DM has never lost an arby case, IIRC? There must have been some compelling arguments out there for Corey, despite what a majority on here think, which to be honest, seemed to be a due in large part because he was upset about fans booing. Here's hoping he has a great year, stays healthy, and we aren't even debating his Arby request next season.

[Funketown]

Gotta reiterate what people have been saying about how this will likely (surely, given the system) increase Hart's salary next year. The $615,000 is certainly a nuisance this year, but assuming a 35% increase for Hart (should be reasonable if he has a mediocre year) next year he's looking at $6.5MM rather than $5.6MM.

 

As for arguing that $700,000 doesn't matter for the Brewers, I don't understand this. Sure, $615,000 in additional costs does less to hamper an MLB franchise than a Taco Bell, but if the Brewers were not affected by this, they would not have invested their time and money into this arbitration hearing, and would have simply settled closer to the $4.8MM.

[clancyphile]

to me, the biggest issue is how much hart will make in arby next year...considering this, he's at a minimum of 6 next year even if he doesn't improve...that means there is 0 chance he's with the brewers next year because they will surely non-tender him

Depends on how Gomez, Gamel, Schaefer, and Cain, among others, do this year.

 

If Hart puts down a .800 OPS, and his improved OBP skills from 2009 indicate it may not be out of the realm of possibility, then maybe it might not be a bad idea to plop down the cash. His walks were a career high in `09 despite 180 fewer PAs than 2008.

[joepepsi]

Gotta reiterate what people have been saying about how this will likely (surely, given the system) increase Hart's salary next year. The $615,000 is certainly a nuisance this year, but assuming a 35% increase for Hart (should be reasonable if he has a mediocre year) next year he's looking at $6.5MM rather than $5.6MM.

Players can only be compared in arbitration to other players within one year of service time. This means a 3rd year arbitration player can compare himself to players who have signed their first free agency contract. So, you're right; he'll get a hefty raise next year. If he has a big season in 2010, and I'm hoping he does, he could file an $8 million figure for 2011. The Brewers may be forced to cut him at the end of the year, or trade him for prospects at the deadline if things are going well for the team this year.

[sheethead]

Hart thought he lost.

 

I don't have any ill will toward Hart. He will need to have a great year this year in order to hit the payday. This win increases the chance for him to be non-tendered next year. If that happens, he will need to have a really good year under his belt to get the money he wants.

[brewtank34]

As much as I can't believe he won his case, this is not going to stop me for cheering for him and our Crew. And I am definitely not going to boo him. We need a healthy and productive OF and to me, Hart is a better option than Gerut and Edmonds. If we're going to do anything in the NL central, Hart will need to be a major player. I for one am hopeful that this will motivate him to win some of the bandwagon fans back and to prove to the league that he can still produce to All-Star levels. If he gets off to a good start, how many posters here are you going to see calling him out. Not many.

GO CREW!!!

[strawbossisevil]

There must have been some compelling arguments out there for Corey, despite what a majority on here think, which to be honest, seemed to be a due in large part because he was upset about fans booing.

Wow, one poster brought this up in the thread, and suddenly it´s the "large part" of why the majority in this thread think he wasn´t due the raise that he got. Can you try any harder to misrepresent the viewpoints of those in this thread?

 

All I will say is this, Hart better earn that extra money he got, or else he will be booed mercilessly, and he will have no one to blame but himself for it. I am normally not one to boo a player, but if he plays horribly again this season I will join my voice to the chorus.

 

Part of me hopes the Brewers cut him on the spot, right now. Sign Dye for 3.5 million or so, and use it as an example for those players who demand a raise they know full well they did not deserve. The message being, if you try to game the system, you´ll end up on the street looking for a job that pays far less. To be quite honest, I expect that if given the full time starting role Gerut will put up far better numbers this season.

 

As far as what Hart must have done to earn his salary bump, the only thing I can figure is he must have flashed his newly formed six pack (since he just lost 20lbs) at the two female arbiters.

 

One other question I had about the process. Can we even be sure the arbitrators even fully understand baseball statistics?

[PlayerHader]

Anyone who boos a player for going to arbitration and winning is a tool.

 

Now if he doesn't perform decently...

[hawing]

I see no valid reason to bring the gender of arbitration panelists into the discussion - in either black or blue text - so let's not anymore. Thanks.

[sheethead]

Anyone who boos a player for going to arbitration and winning is a tool.

 

Now if he doesn't perform decently...

I think a combination of the two would result in the proposed booing.

 

I see no valid reason to bring the gender of arbitration panelists into

the discussion - in either black or blue text - so let's not anymore.

Thanks.

 

Another liberal agenda http://forum.brewerfan.net/images/smilies/wink.gif

[yoshii8]

Congrats Corey, now go play like we know you can.

 

I'm not sure why so many people are taking this so hard, its part of the game, he got his money fair and square. Its not like that 650k is going to hurt the Brewers franchise in the long run. I've already said this, but I really hope Brewers fans don't overreact and boo him for this.

[TooLiveBrew]

Hart said he had some trepidation entering the hearing because he feared getting taken apart by the club when it presented its case. But he said it wasn't as ugly as he anticipated.

 

"It wasn't as bad as I thought," he said. "You hear a lot of horror stories, that you won't like your team after it's done. I talked with (assistant GM) Gord (Ash) before the hearing and told him there would be no hard feelings, that I wasn't going to be mad if I lost.

 

"The way I looked at it, my dad was such a harsh critic when I was growing up, it couldn't be any worse than that. I know he did it to motivate me but I said no way (the hearing) would be as harsh as that.

Seems like 'Hart won't be able to take the criticism in the hearing' was just nonsense