Rangers sign Harden

[jjkoestler]

Per NBC Sports

The Rangers signed Rich Harden to a 1 year, 7.5 m deal with a club option for 2011. No word on incentives yet.

 

Edit: The club option is for 11.5 m

[RockCoCougars]

Wow. This makes the Wolf deal look really bad.

[Ennder]

I disagree with that. Harden was not all that good last year, he struggles to throw strikes or get past the 5th inning at this point. He can't throw his slider or split finger anymore so he is a 2 pitch guy at this point. I think his arm is still messed up personally.

[Invader3K]

Seems about right. I agree with Ennder...Harden isn't someone you can count on at this point, unlike Wolf.

[The Truth]

Harden is a much bigger injury risk than Wolf. That said, glad to see him out of the NL

[PeaveyFury]

Wow, that signing was sure out of the blue.

 

And looks like 1 year, 7.5 million is the going rate for pitchers with serious injury issues and good upside.

[Ennder]

Harden/Sheets types are the guys you want to sign to help you get to a playoff game. They will put up decent stats for half a year, get you a few extra wins and hopefully push you into the playoffs. That is great and I'd love for the Brewers to sign one of those guys, but they fill a very different need than what we were doing with Wolf. This team needs a reliable pitcher to plug into the rotation every day for the next few years while we rebuild our pitching depth in the minors. Wolf fills that role a lot better than Harden.

[homer]

I don't think it's worse than Wolf at all, but Harden is worth a one year flier. He still K's a ton of guys.

[Mr QL]

I would of much rather had Harden than Wolf. b

[Invader3K]

I doubt the Rangers sign Sheets now. Plus it's worth noting they cleared room for him by trading Millwood.

[RockCoCougars]

I disagree. Harden and Wolf are not even in the same league. Wolf struggles to break 90 mph, while Harden can throw mid 90's. If (and granted that's a big if) healthy, Harden is a legitimate #1 starter. Sometimes you have to take a chance, and the fact is that the Rangers only committed about 1/4 the cash that the Brewers gave Wolf to Harden(only twice as much as this team gave Hawkins). It makes me kind of sick to my stomach to be honest with you. The fact that Macha and Peterson both have experience with this guy makes things more perplexing. Now we have to hope that the crafty lefty doesn't lose his mojo from last year, which is a dicey proposition considering he has had TJ surgery and is going to be 34 years old.

[Invader3K]

This may not be a done deal yet. ESPN Radio is saying he's close to signing with the Mariners!

[danzig6767]

I disagree with that. Harden was not all that good last year, he struggles to throw strikes or get past the 5th inning at this point. He can't throw his slider or split finger anymore so he is a 2 pitch guy at this point. I think his arm is still messed up personally.

Yea, he averaged 5 1/3 innings per start last year

 

Harden generally gives quality innings, but puts stress on bullpens by his fragile arm

[Invader3K]

Now they're saying he's a Ranger, "officially." Funny.

[jjkoestler]

This may not be a done deal yet. ESPN Radio is saying he's close to signing with the Mariners!

 

ESPN made a mistake. Its the Rangers

[burnzy24]

I doubt the Rangers sign Sheets now. Plus it's worth noting they cleared room for him by trading Millwood.

Yea I thinking the exact same thing about Sheets. I had read that the Rangers had met with his agent to see how his injury was doing. They must have really soured on Sheets since they had a deal in place last year before they found out he was hurt and probably could have gotten him cheaper than what they paid for Harden.

[Invader3K]

Supposedly Sheets is demanding $12 million for a one year deal and refusing to do a public work out for anyone. Yeah, good luck with that, Benny. If that is the case, it makes sense that the Rangers went with Harden instead.

[fondybrewfan]

Not a bad deal for a $ standpoint.

 

If Harden gets 7.5 guaranteed I would think we could get Duchsherer for around $5 million since he didn't pitch at all in 2009. I would be for that, although I guess I would prefer it to be like $3 Million guaranteed with escalators for starts bring it up to $5-6 million.

 

MLBtraderumors had a piece up that Sheets is looking for the same salary he had in 2008 ($12 Million) Good luck with that Ben. If that is his asking price, he is still going to be looking for a team in late January

[RockCoCougars]

Melvin and Attanansio had better swallow their pride, get on the phone and make amends with Sheets at this point, provided the reports are true that he will be ready to go. Sheets may be miffed at the team, but money generally allows people to get past such issues. If Harden went for 7.5, I would guess that Sheets would command about the same amount. If the "two starting pitchers" end up being Wolf and Davis/Washburn, or even worse, Mark Mulder, this team can be written off before the season starts. I don't want to hear anything about Jason Jennings either. Roll the dice for once on someone with upside.

[Invader3K]

Yes, but who knows if Sheets is really worth even that much at this point? He hasn't pitched in over a year. He could be a very different pitcher than the one we remember from the summer of '08.

[Ennder]

We could sign Doug Davis tomorrow and would have to be considered in the playoff hunt imo. I sure hope we don't sign Doug Davis tomorrow btw, just saying. I don't think Ben Sheets is likely to outpitch Doug Davis though so I don't want to sign him either.

 

For sake of ease our CHONE for the rotation would be...

 

Gallardo 3.60

Bush - 4.64

Parra - 4.75

Wolf - 4.42 (maybe a bit higher as that is not modified for park)

Davis - 4.69

 

Not a great rotation by any means but enough to keep us in the race in what shouldn't be a stellar division. I'll take the under on Wolf and the over on Davis in that list for what it is worth.

[valpocrewsader]

Definitely makes the Wolf deal look bad. One year commitment, only $7.5 million, and Harden is a special pitcher. Instead, we took on 3 years, $30 million of someone very unspectacular. Ouch.

[jjfanec]

Definitely makes the Wolf deal look bad. One year commitment, only $7.5 million, and Harden is a special pitcher. Instead, we took on 3 years, $30 million of someone very unspectacular. Ouch.

What is with the love for Rich Harden? The guy has been special one of that last 4 years and even in that year he did not have more that 25 or 26 starts. He kills your bullpen. He will be on the DL at least once, probably, more during the season. Even if he does well he cannot finish a season strong because his arm wears down. His velocity was down at least part of last year. Cubs fans i know were happy to see him go.

 

With the state of our rotation, ie lack of depth, we cannot afford a guy who more than likely with miss a good chunk of time with injuries. He has great stuff, no doubting but how can a guy who averages 6 innings or less per start, who wears down easily, and who will be on the DL at least once be considered special or the guy this rotation needed. I just do not see it. Plus stuff is great when you can stay healthy but he is lucky to be the later years version of Ben Sheets and could easily miss a lot of time.

[Ennder]

I think you need to look at team needs and not just the pitcher as well. Let's say there were 2 Rich Hardens and 2 Randy Wolfs. If I could only sign one of these guys to the Brewers this season and then the off season was done I'd take Wolf every time. We need those innings so bad at this point that it is totally worth it. If I got to sign two of these guys to the Brewers for this season I'd probably go with 1 Wolf and 1 Harden. Once you have the innings covered I'd rather go with the shorter commitment and higher upside.

 

For some teams Wolf would make more sense, for some Harden would. The Rangers have a lot of pitching waiting in AAA so for them I think Harden makes more sense. Half a season of Harden and half a season of some scrub out of our AAA system isn't likely to match a full season of Wolf and that is what it comes down to. We have that same black hole in the minors next year too so we are covered for 2 years. The 3rd year I'm not crazy about but oh well.

[valpocrewsader]

What is with the love for Rich Harden?

I'm fond of the career 3.39 ERA and 1.24 WHIP. Spectacular pitcher.

 

The difference between a special player (Harden) at a team-friendly contract (1 year, $7.5 per) and a pedestrian player (Wolf) at 3 years, $9 per is such a monumental difference. It's like the deals happened in two totally different environments, yet they happened on the same day. I can't fathom it.

Paying a premium for 200 innings of merely average/good pitching instead of much, much less money for 140 innings of very good pitching makes no sense to me. We'd be far better off right now if we had Harden at 2 years, $14 million than we are with Wolf at 3 years, $30 million. It's heartbreaking.