JJ Hardy to Twins for Carlos Gomez

[thebruce44]

Wow, so you can already say that Melvin has mis-projected Gomez for this year.

 

Since you can see the future maybe you should be the GM.

I think X has made it pretty apparent that he feels Gomez is huge downgrade from Cameron, and overpaying for SP in free agency hardly ever works. I have no idea why he's taking so much heat in this thread.

 

The reason I am singling him out isn't so much his stance as the fact that he has already decided that Gomez will suck this year and that he knows more than Melvin. He is saying it as though its not his opinion and that he knows more than DM does.

 

Melvin has simply mis-projected a player, and the results will severely hurt our team.

 

A definitive statement like that about a 24 year old player's next season when it is November seems way harsh. If X feels that way now, I have the feeling he will never give Gomez a chance.

 

It is easy to sit back on a message board and question a move like this, but we don't know the entire situation. Maybe this was the best DM could have done. Maybe he and his scouts see something in Gomez us fans and the Twins don't. DM has gone on record as saying speed guys develop slower. To write off Gomez's 2010 season and say you know more than DM right now is just not a smart position to take even if you are correct in the end.

 

X, have you seen Gomez play a lot or are you basing your opinion entirely off of WAR?

[Fatter than Joey]

Again, Gomez is the best defensive CF in baseball.

 

I think people are just casually saying this -- I have no doubts he is good, maybe better than Cameron -- I do(EDIT: I Don't) believe he is an elite CF though.

[trwi7]

Again, Gomez is the best defensive CF in baseball.

 

No he's not. Franklin Gutierrez is. And all Gomez is doing is replacing a good defender who's also a good hitter. That's a complete downgrade.

 

Who could the brewers have replaced in CF next year?

 

I'd prefer Gerut to Gomez. Gomez is just terrible. He should be in the minors.

 

He still not developted yet on offense. If he can learn to take a walk once in awhile, we all of a sudden have an elite player.

 

His offensive track record in the majors and minors speaks for itself. He's just not a good offensive player and I doubt he ever will be. Over 1,000 at bats in the majors and he can't even crack a .300 OBP. He is awful.

[fondybrewfan]

Melvin said that he is expecting Weeks to bat leadoff next year. It will probably either be Gomez or Escobar in the 2 hole with the other in the 7 or 8.

 

I still think this is a pretty solid trade and just from looking around the world wide web, most non-brewer and non-twins fans think this is a fairly even trade considering the cost savings for the Brewers

[DuWayne Steurer]

Sick. As. A. Dog.

 

This is like getting a call from home telling me my dog died.

 

Way to sell as low as you possibly could Doug.

 

2010 = punt.

[Mr QL]

Are you freaking kidding?

 

Is there like another piece to this trade that I don't know about?

 

Carlos Gomez, outfield Jason Kendall?

 

I have absolutely 0 confidence in Doug Melvin. Please don't make any other trades, you hurt this team enough.

[YoungGeezy]

That is because Brewer fans over value Hardy way way way to much

[fondybrewfan]

When we supplement this move with Davis and Washburn we will really be a bad team.

how many posts can one make in a single thread saying we are going to be bad before one gets sick of posting?

 

It is November 6th for gosh sakes, Melvin now has $15M+ to spend on pitching, lets wait until Spring Training before declaring that we are going to suck.

[bklynbrewcrew]

Bruce, Gomez has not shown any ability to hit major league pitching whatsoever and he rarely walks as well. Its nice that he plays great defense but adding him to the bottom of the lineup with Escobar, most likely Kendall and the pitchers spot means we will most likely have an awful lineup once you get past the 5 hole.

 

Is it possible that Gomez gets better; yes it is but banking on a player that has never hit well wo do just that is not a formula for success. How many runs have we lost replacing Hardy and Cameron with Gomez and Escobar. I think we have just turned an above average NL offense into a pedestrian one and without top notch pitching we are now a bad team.

[SoCalBrewfan]

The defense is a big deal, to be sure. Melvin didn't seem to care about defense a while back but seems to have seen the light in that respect...Cameron was a great asset with the glove, and if the team had decided to move on Gomez is one of the few guys who can step in to Cameron's shoes defensively. It's just hard to feel good about a guy with that offensive profile...and particularly it's hard to construct a lineup with offensive players who have a lot of improving yet to do while another year of Fielder's contract ticks away.

 

It also seems a bit early in the offseason to conclude that Hardy would not bring a pitcher of any value. Has the world series ended yet?

[Oldcity]

14 million bucks. When people analyze this trade, can we please stop forgetting the 14 million the Brewers saved?

[yoshii8]

One other aspect that saving the salary might enable us to do would be something like Suppan and Riske for Lowe.

I will give you a lot of money if that ever happens. Although I wouldn't count on it.

[Fatter than Joey]

That is because Brewer fans over value Hardy way way way to much

 

Brewer fans probably overvalue all of their players. That said, would you have traded JJ Hardy for Gomez at any point in 2007 or 2008? Probably not.

 

We sold low on Hardy. I think Melvin played JJ Hardy rather poorly from start to finish

[The Truth]

Talked with my buddy who is a hardcore Twins fan. He's not happy about this trade at all. Thought the Twins could get alot more for Gomez. Says Gomez has tons of potential. Thinks JJ is a very streaky very overrated player...

[trwi7]

14 million bucks. When people analyze this trade, can we please stop forgetting the 14 million the Brewers saved?

Melvin wants two pitchers. Would it shock anybody if we spent the $14 million we saved on Washburn and Davis?

[bklynbrewcrew]

Maybe we now sign Lackey to a huge deal but even that is a major risk considering Lackey has had arm problems and has tons of tread on the tires. I thought Melvin was supposed to be a statistical GM. There is nothing in Gomez' career numbers to suggest he will be even avaerage offensively.

[nate82]

some of the Possible FA's that stand out to me:

Josh Beckett

Erik Bedard

Justin Duchscherer

Rich Harden

Tim Hudson

Cliff Lee

Jarrod Washburn

Brandon Webb

 

There are options and as long as DM steps up and doesn't settle for a Suppan/ Looper I am 100% in appoval of the trade.

 

So step up and get it down DM!!

Webb's option was picked up he is not a free agent the same with Beckett. The Braves are about to extend Hudson so he isn't a free agent either. Cliff Lee has a very reasonable option left and the Phillies would be stupid not to extend him so he is not available. That leaves Bedard (unlikely to be ready for the first opening months of the season), Harden (the best pitcher of the bunch), Sheets (see Harden), Duchscherer (soft tosser and coming off an injury like Bedard and Sheets. Harden is also very injury prone), and Washburn (Left Handed version of Suppan and Looper).

 

Others available are Garland, Vazquez and Lowe (both Lowe or Vazquez could be had in a trade).

[sheethead]

We sold low on Hardy. I think Melvin played JJ Hardy rather poorly from start to finish

 

I agree with this. And Melvin was not going to extend Hardy, so he had to go. There was no leverage on his side in any deal. Clubs knew Melvin needed to unload him, and it just so happened he sucked in 2009. At least Melvin is taking a chance on a player sucking at a position we have a need, instead of keeping Hardy and having him suck instead of playing Escobar.

[thebruce44]

What about a move like taking on Harang and a prospect with the salary we saved. This move could potentially be much more detailed than just JJ+Cam vs Gomez+Escobar. Right now it is JJ+Cam vs Gomez+Escobar+14 mil. Wait to see what happens with that 14 mil before you tar and feather Melvin. He is a GM for a reason and you are just posting on the internet.

[YoungGeezy]

Talked with my buddy who is a hardcore Twins fan. He's not happy about this trade at all. Thought the Twins could get alot more for Gomez. Says Gomez has tons of potential. Thinks JJ is a very streaky very overrated player...

That's why everyone not a Brewer fan or Twin fan thinks it is a good even trade. Im happy with it and like the added 14 million

[Fatter than Joey]

Would it shock anybody if we spent the $14 million we saved on Washburn and Davis?

 

I am thinking Sheets+Davis

[battlekow]

Melvin wants two pitchers. Would it shock anybody if we spent the $14 million we saved on Washburn and Davis?

Exactly. The money saved only matters if Melvin does something intelligent on it, rather than Suppan 2: Junkball Boogaloo. Besides, ~$10M of that is Cameron's presumed salary for next year (assuming he'd re-sign for about what he was paid this year), something entirely independent of trading J.J. Hardy for Carlos Gomez, given that the Brewers already have another center fielder at least as good as Gomez on the roster in Jody Gerut.

[Mr QL]

Big freaking deal we saved money that we can use to sign "2 pitchers" with. Like who? What big pitcher is out there let alone two that we have a realistic chance at signing? I prefer we don't spend a bunch on pitching because I don't want to be stuck with another Suppan. We should of just kept Tony Gwyn Jr.

[RobDeer 45]

This lineup could be really bad next year with Escobar, Gomez, and Kendall hitting 6,7,8. That will mean our lineup essentially ends at the 5 spot. I dont see how anyone can defend this trade in any way. Gomez and Escbar may very well both have .300 OBP next year and will kill our chances of scoring runs.

Dude, where would Hardy have played? He was garbage last year. We would never have gotten a good pitcher for Hardy. You're living in a dream world if you think that. For us to be succesful we need youg scrappy guys to fill most of our postion spots and build around starting pitching. We can't expect to be able to have high priced FA's everywhere. It just won't work for our market size.

[YoungGeezy]

this reminds me a lot of the Melky Cabrara for Cameron thing last year that almost went down except I like Gomez potenial a lot more