College Basketball 2009-2010 (part 1)

[GoudaBrew]

They have played a few tough games this year and have only won a couple of them at home and lost everyone on the road.

So, they've played 7 teams that were ranked at the time they played them. They are 5-2 against those teams and 3 of the wins come from opponents who were in the top 5 in the country. Seven games against ranked opponents is not "a few" and 5 out of seven is not "a couple".

[thebruce44]

You can speculate all you want about how wisconsin would finish in the other leagues. To mean it comes down to 2 stats in determining how good a team is performing. Offensive Efficiency and Defensive Efficiency. For those of you unfamiliar with those terms, its a stat that figures out how many points a team scores per 100 possessions.

How does that account for the teams they are playing? I agree they are useful stats, but it doesn't really tell you anything about how they would fair in another league.

[thebruce44]

Aren't we talking about which Conference is better this year and not which is the best over the last 10 years?

In the big picture, who cares which conference is better, or the best? Only one team can win the title. I would not be totally surprised to see any of the top 4 Big 10 schools in the Final Four. The top 4 can compete with anyone in the country.

I thought it was an interesting debate and I care. If you don't then you can ignore the posts about it or take the thread in a different direction.

[zzzmanwitz]

How does that account for the teams they are playing? I agree they are useful stats, but it doesn't really tell you anything about how they would fair in another league.

The Badgers have the 7th hardest Strength of Schedule this season. 143rd toughest Non-Conference Strength of Schedule.

[trwi7]

I don't need to list.

Yeah, actually you do. Since it's pretty obvious to you, the list shouldn't take more than a couple of minutes to put together. Unless you don't actually believe that Wisconsin wouldn't finish in the top 5 in the Big East, ACC or Big 12.

 

 

[olliegjw]

I thought it was an interesting debate and I care. If you don't then you can ignore the posts about it or take the thread in a different direction.

I agree that it is a good discussion. I was only stating that it will all be settled on the court, and conference affliliation won't mean anything come tournament time. Everyone (except brewcrew7) seems to be in general agreement on who the top conferences are. Some have one conference slightly higher than another, but generally the opinions are in the same ballpark.

 

[Roscoe Chill]

Yeah, we are talking about this year. I'm just bringing up the last 10 years because of the silly label the Big Ten has received over the last 10 years or so. This year is no different. There are four VERY good teams at the top of the conference, rivaling any other conference. To the dude that says the Badgers wouldn't finish in the top 5 of whatever conference but won't list the five teams because he doesn't have to, I say you're a reach.

[thebruce44]

How does that account for the teams they are playing? I agree they are useful stats, but it doesn't really tell you anything about how they would fair in another league.

The Badgers have the 7th hardest Strength of Schedule this season. 143rd toughest Non-Conference Strength of Schedule.

Alone, that is still useless to help us predict how they would fair in another conference.

 

For what its worth, looking it up myself, Wisconsin's current SOS is actually 10th, behind 4 Big East Schools. Their projected SOS is 42nd and that is behind 15 Big East Teams...all of them besides Notre Dame.

[brewcrew7]

Ok if you want a list go to each of those conferences and take the top 5 teams. If the badgers had to play a schedule in these conferences they would not be in the top 5. That is the list.

 

I watch college basketball more than any sport and before the season, if all of you were polled, you would not have picked the badgers very high, just as most of the so called experts. Now, just because they are near the top of the big ten, there seems to be this idea that the badgers could go to the final four. I will say they are playing better than expected but the big ten is a bit down from what they expected as well. Mich St has gotten hammered by a few teams, Purdue went on their run of losses, and Wisconsin is what is being debated here. And I believe they are simply a good team but nothing special.

 

And as Bruce has said, I was not discussing last year or any other year. But you can be sure not to book any spots for any of these teams in the final four this year. Be happy you get one or two to the sweet sixteen and call it a year.

[zzzmanwitz]

The fact that most experts picked the badgers to finish so low is also ridiculous.

 

First of all, Bo Ryan is a great coach who always gets more out of his talent than he really should.

 

2nd, a team with 2 senior guards and 2 emerging stars (Leuer and Nankavil) should never have been picked to finish 8th or 9th in the B10 as I saw in may preseason projections..

Alone, that is still useless to help us predict how they would fair in another conference.

 

I totally agree, but combining that with the other stats I mentioned should show that Wisconsin should be considered at top 10 team this season. Difficult schedule and excelling in the games that they have played.

[homer]

Now, just because they are near the top of the big ten, there seems to be this idea that the badgers could go to the final four.

------------------------------

 

Actually, it's also because they also beat Duke, Maryland, and Marquette.

[thebruce44]

Actually, it's also because they also beat Duke, Maryland, and Marquette.

 

I will be pulling hard for my Badgers, but they won't be playing the NCAA Tourny games in the Kohl Center.

 

First of all, Bo Ryan is a great coach who always gets more out of his talent than he really should.

 

Very, very true. How well that translates to the tourny this year though I don't know. I wouldn't be at all surprised if one or two Big 10 Teams made it to the Elite 8 this year. A Final 4 appearance would settle down some of the detractors as well.

[olliegjw]

Actually, it's also because they also beat Duke, Maryland, and Marquette.

 

I will be pulling hard for my Badgers, but they won't be playing the NCAA Tourny games in the Kohl Center.

 

No, but they may play their first two games in a very fan friendly Bradley Center.

[TooLiveBrew]

If the badgers had to play a schedule in these conferences they would not be in the top 5. That is the list.

 

Well, now that you've backed up your absurd claim with facts, we can all agree!

I mean, why bother substantiating anything? It's much more fun to troll & make ridiculous statements, because you can just claim later you don't have to back them up.

I watch college basketball more than any sport and before the season, if all of you were polled, you would not have picked the badgers very high, just as most of the so called experts.

I watch a ton of college basketball, and have been doing so for years. This doesn't mean I am some sort of self-declared & self-legitimized expert. And for the record, I was very high on this UW team right from the get-go this season.

[trwi7]

The only conference I could buy Wisconsin not being in the top 5 is the Big East and I'm not even sure about that.

 

Big East standings:

 

1. Villanova (20-1, 9-0)

2. Syracuse (21-1, 9-1)

3. West Virginia (18-3, 7-2)

4. Georgetown (16-5, 6-4)

5. Pittsburgh (16-6, 6-4)

 

After that it's Louisville, who I think Wisconsin is clearly better than. Then Cincinnati, South Florida, Marquette, Notre Dame, Providence, Connecticut, Seton Hall, St. John's, Rutgers and DePaul. Wisconsin is easily top 6 in the Big East and I think they could be as high as third.

 

ACC standings:

 

1. Duke (17-4, 5-2)

2. Virginia (14-6, 5-2)

3. Maryland (14-6, 4-2)

4. Wake Forest (15-5, 5-3

5. Florida State and Georgia Tech (16-5, 4-3)

 

The Badgers have already beaten Duke at home and Maryland on a neutral court. They're easily top 5 in the ACC.

 

Big 12 standings:

 

1. Kansas (21-1, 7-0)

2. Texas (19-3, 5-2)

3. Kansas State (18-4, 5-3)

4. Texas A&M (16-6, 5-3)

5. Baylor (17-4, 5-3)

 

There's a pretty big drop off after Kansas State. Wisconsin is probably on a Kansas State level.

[RyDogg66]

Take a look at some of those ACC schedules, they are pretty weak. Heck, Virginia lost to Penn State at home I believe. Wisconsin is probably the second best team in the ACC, and they have already beat the best team in that conference. As far as the Big 12 goes, I agree that Bucky would be 3rd in that conference. In the Big 12, they are probably 4th.

[homer]

Actually, it's also because they also beat Duke, Maryland, and Marquette.

 

I will be pulling hard for my Badgers, but they won't be playing the NCAA Tourny games in the Kohl Center.

They beat Maryland on a neutral court...which is where their NCAA Tourney games will be held.

 

 

[thebruce44]

Actually, it's also because they also beat Duke, Maryland, and Marquette.

 

I will be pulling hard for my Badgers, but they won't be playing the NCAA Tourny games in the Kohl Center.

They beat Maryland on a neutral court...which is where their NCAA Tourney games will be held.

 

The worst of the 3 though. Although I think they could probably handle MU at the Bradley Center. Just saying, beating Duke and MU at home and Maryland at a neutral site doesn't tell me much about how they will do in the tourny. Maryland is supposed to be an 11 seed right now, MU is on the bubble.

[Oldcity]

Just missing a win at Purdue should tell you something also.

[homer]

How about the job Tony Bennett is doing at Virginia?

[zurch1818]

Awesome stuff there on efficiency zzzmanwitz. I'm surprised to see the badgers ranked so high in offensive efficiency.

 

After figuring out what all of the stats mean, one stat really sticks out to me -- tempo, which measures the average number of possessions per game. The Badgers only average 61 possessions per game, which ranks 341. This shows that they are very deliberate with Bo's "swing offense."

 

I'm not really sure how to describe this, but West Virginia is fairly similar to the Badgers when comparing offensive efficiency, defensive efficiency, and tempo. West Virginia temp rank is 297 with 64.4 possessions per game, defense rank is 24, and offense rank is 4. The Badgers possession rank is 341, defensive rank is 6, and their offensive efficiency is 22. Adding up the offensive and defensive ranks for both teams give 28. So what the badgers add defensively, WV adds offensively. When you subtract the defensive efficiency from the offensive efficiency with both teams, the difference between those two teams is one point.

 

Even if this adds nothing to the fire, I find it rather interesting that there is another team out there that takes advantage of every offensive possession with success like the Badgers.

[Marc Newfield of Dreams]

I've been perusing the last few pages, and I'll say this.

 

There's a theme across the top 4 BCS conferences this year- each league has 3 great teams and a bunch of mush in the middle. Arguing conference rank at this point is pretty futile, since the top teams in each league are about even.

 

I would not want to be on the selection committee this year. There are going to be a lot of teams with very, very similar resumes.

[lukevan]

If the Badgers get a healthy Leuer back, they have five players who can score 20 points any given night (Hughes, Nankevil, Bohannon, Tayor, Leuer). They are one of the best defensive teams in the country. I have a hard time believing they can not play with anybody on a neutral court. The major weakness I see in a tournament game is if Nankevil gets in foul trouble but at least his backups have shown they can rebound and hang tough defensively.

[heresrobin]

One of the things that I was dead wrong about going into this year was Marquette's 3 point shooting. I apologize if this was brought up already, but do you guys realize that Marquette is the number one 3 Point FG% shooting team in the country? They are shooting 42.4% as a team thanks in large part to:

 

DJO 51/101 50.5% (man this guy has been a godsend)

Acker 33/63 52.4% (was only shooting 33.0% for his career coming into this year)

Cubillan 27/66 40.9% (a career 36.9% 3 point shooter coming into this year)

Jimmy Butler 11/21 52.4% (OK, I know that's not many attempts but he has a 136.4% offensive efficiency rating right now according to kenpom which is incredible - he's also one of the best in the nation at getting to the FT line - maybe he should shoot more?)

 

I hope this Marquette team doesn't get lost in the shuffle of the enormous Big East because they've been playing great and definitely deserve to be in the NCAA Tournament. They're probably a team that's flying under the radar nationally right now. I don't know if people realize how good of a team they are - just very undersized. I think they are much more dangerous than their overall and conference records suggest.

[TheCrew07]

Even though I talk quite a bit on the MLB forum about pitching upside, there's more to sports than pure athletic ability. Sheets is/was a very good pitcher, and he's about as unathletic as a professional gets, he runs like a duck waddles.

 

The Badgers might not be super athletic, but they play as a team, stick to system, and master the fundamentals so they win their fair share of games.

 

The Badger team that it made it to the Final Four was much less athletic than this current Badger team, so I don't see what high flying aeronautics have to do with college BB games. This isn't the NBA where it's all isolation and 2 man games... it's still basketball and a team like the Badgers always has a shot to win given their tempo and style.

 

The tempo and style may not be for you, but to dismiss the team because they don't blow you away with athleticism seems pretty short sighted from where I'm sitting.