Suppan for Gary Matthews Jr?

[JohnBriggs12]

Brewers would actually save $1.5 million in 2010, more if you count the savings on Cameron, and be getting a guy who the last time he played everyday (2007), produced close to a Cameron-type year, .252/.323/.419, 18 HR, 72 RBI. Gerut might be able to match that too, but he'd need a platoon partner, and Matthews wouldn't and bringing in Matthews would allow Brewers to use Gerut to platoon some with Hart in RF.

 

There's a downside risk of course. Matthews would cost $10 million in 2011 ($12 million less the savings on Suppan's $2 million buyout), but if he's still a guy that can play at decent level, at least that's some return on your investment.

 

Again, I'm not saying they should do this or that the Angels are even interested, but just thought I'd throw it out there for discussion.

[Hate those Rodents]

I thought about that too JB. I'd be willing to add a total of about 5 million, not a total of around 9 million though in a trade. Maybe making it Suppan and Riske for Matthews Jr. I'd do that in a second.

[Invader3K]

I don't think the Brewers could trade Riske since he's still on the DL, though.

[Hate those Rodents]

True, but my drift is that I think we'd need to rid ourselves of another contract. Not sure we have another bad one anymore though, which is nice. Maybe you do the straight up Suppan for Matthews Jr. trade and have Anaheim pay 5million or so. That'd be even better.

[yoshii8]

I'd rather just re-sign Cameron or go with Gerut, I don't think Gary Matthews Jr. is very good.

[Invader3K]

I tend to agree. I don't think he'd even be a big upgrade over Gerut at this point.

[kramnoj]

Players can be traded while on the DL, but I believe it needs league approval (see Peavy). But really, there isn't much point in trading Riske, this isn't the NBA where salaries need to match. In baseball, teams can just agree to send money (again, with league approval).

 

As bad as Suppan has been, and as much as he's reviled by some, he's about the same quality pitcher as Matthews is a hitter. There doesn't seem to be anything here. I would rather find a AAA CF minor league FA than take on more money while not improving the team.

[Mass Haas]

I shudder, and so would the Angels, thinking about Suppan's numbers back in the American League. The Halos would be better off eating Matthews' deal.

[trwi7]

I'd rather have Suppan. Both players are terrible, but Suppan is only terrible for one more year.

[And That]

This has already been said, but trading Suppan for Matthews would be like trading Suppan for the hitting version of Suppan and extending his contract for a year. No thank you.

[Hate those Rodents]

The only way to consider this deal is if you think Matthews Jr could essentially equal Cameron. Then we wouldn't need to pay Cameron and/or it'd be like dumping Suppan for free. I don't expect a Vazquez-type (meaning a guy that is overlooked due to his poor recent past and high salary) turnaround for the guy though, so I'd stay away, but Doug sure has been better at finding position players than pitchers.

[nate82]

The only way to consider this deal is if you think Matthews Jr could essentially equal Cameron. Then we wouldn't need to pay Cameron and/or it'd be like dumping Suppan for free. I don't expect a Vazquez-type (meaning a guy that is overlooked due to his poor recent past and high salary) turnaround for the guy though, so I'd stay away, but Doug sure has been better at finding position players than pitchers.

Matthews wouldn't even be able to replace Cameron's jock strap.

 

OK seriously now there is no way Matthews would be anywhere near as valuable as Cameron would be. I also believe Cameron will come back cheaper than what Matthews would cost for the next two years. Cameron will get a contract around $6-8m which is about right for Cameron and it will be either a one or two year deal. Matthews will be owed $11m in 2010 and $12m in 2011 which will be a whole lot more than what Cameron will be paid to do the same job but better.

 

Only way the Brewers should even consider this is if the Angels would pick up at least 80% of Matthews contract.

[dadofandrew]

I'd like Gary Jr. for $2M per, but no way would I add money to take him.

 

Matthews is a good defender who had two very good offensive seasons, and many other ok ones. He's not much below average offensively for a CF, and the move to the NL is likely to do him good. He's far from a star, but for $2M, you could do far worse.

[And That]

Matthews' average UZR for the previous three seasons is -13.1... he used to be a good defender, but it seems that age and injury have significantly erroded his skills.

 

And speaking of injury and errosion of skill, Matthews has had a nearly linear drop in ABs per year from 2006-2009: 620, 516, 426, 316.

 

Matthews had a decent year at age 27, and then a couple years of decent production and one year of very good production playing half his games in Arlington. He might be ok as a backup, but I would trust neither his bat or defense, nor his ability to stay on the field, in a starting role.

[RockCoCougars]

I'd rather see if KC would work a deal for Guillen who's worn his welcome out there. His contract is up next year as well. Perhaps the Brewers could either kick in some cash or a prospect or incorporate the two into a larger deal (include Hart or Hardy perhaps).

[DHonks]

For those talking about trading people on the DL, remember, there is no DL this time of year. Riske is on the 40 man roster, because there is no 25 man roster and there is no DL. He can be traded...buyer beware

[kramnoj]

I'd rather see if KC would work a deal for Guillen

 

What benefit do you see Guillen offering? Your feelings on Suppan are clear, but I don't see how doing a trade of Suppan for Guillen helps the Brewers. Guillen doesn't fill any Brewer need. I certainly wouldn't trade Hart away with Suppan just to get rid of Suppan's contract for Guillen.

 

I would have thought that one thing the 2009 season showed was that as bad as Suppan has been, he can't easily be replaced by random AAA filler. If there's a way to move him to improve the team, absolutely do it, but the Brewers aren't so rich in pitchers to start 2010 that they should dump Suppan just to dump him, if it doesn't improve the team on the field or financially.

[JohnBriggs12]

Matthews' average UZR for the previous three seasons is -13.1... he used to be a good defender, but it seems that age and injury have significantly erroded his skills.

 

And speaking of injury and errosion of skill, Matthews has had a nearly linear drop in ABs per year from 2006-2009: 620, 516, 426, 316.

 

Matthews had a decent year at age 27, and then a couple years of decent production and one year of very good production playing half his games in Arlington. He might be ok as a backup, but I would trust neither his bat or defense, nor his ability to stay on the field, in a starting role.

His linear drop in AB's had more to do with Torii Hunter being acquired in 08 than anything Matthews did. Matthews got the big contract after a big year for Texas in 06. In 07, he reverted to his career norms (again pretty close to typical Cameron numbers) which should have been no surprise. Angels didn't wait around, the next year, they signed Hunter, relegating Matthews to 4th OF job. Yes, his production dropped some the last 2 years but he wasn't playing everyday.

 

Look nobody said Matthews is an All Star or that his contract isn't horrible, but the question comes down to is the difference between Cameron and Matthews going forward (remember Cameron is 37 and he's going to slow down too), overcome by replacing Suppan in the rotation with a guy who's ERA is a run and a half lower (presuming they can find that guy). There's no guaranty they want Cameron back regardless. True Gerut might be as good or even slightly better than Matthews, but having both on the team pushes Hart to perform or be replaced.

 

Ridding the roster of Suppan provides the Brewers with much needed rotation flexibility. If Melvin acquires 2 starters, who do they replace? They could just eat Suppan's contract but that's a $14.5 million gulp. Matthews would likely at least provide modest production and decent outfield play on a regular or semi regular basis.

[brosto1]

I would much rather trade Suppan for Byrnes. It is just one more season of each. If paying the difference between the contracts is needed, then do that as well. Byrnes and Gerut then platoon in CF.

[endaround]

"pretty close to typical Cameron numbers"

 

Matthew's career line .258/.333/.408

 

Cameron's career line .250/.340/.448

 

Those aren't close. Add in Cameron has played above his career numbers the past two season while Matthews has been terrible and no they aren't close. Matthews isn't exactly some young guy either. Cameron is a very good player. Matthews is a 5th OFer at best.

 

Suppan making 12 injury fill in starts is better value then taking on Matthews for 2 seasons.

[And That]

Ridding the roster of Suppan provides the Brewers with much needed rotation flexibility. If Melvin acquires 2 starters, who do they replace? They could just eat Suppan's contract but that's a $14.5 million gulp. Matthews would likely at least provide modest production and decent outfield play on a regular or semi regular basis.

Ridding the roster of Suppan in favor of inserting Matthews on to it provides flexibility? It's swapping out a boondoggle contract for an even longer boondoggle contract. If the Angels offered to pay nearly all of the $8.5 million difference, sure, but if not... why would we pay that much for Gary Matthews? And why would they pay that much for Jeff Suppan? I'd rather have the extra pitcher than the extra outfielder anyway.

 

As for his production, it would be modest (maybe even with a capital M), and once again... his defense isn't what it used to be.

[mothershipconnection]

Matthews has been awful for 2 straight years: a .675 and .697 OPS aren't acceptable unless you're a fantastic defender. Juan Pierre hit better than him this year.

 

Suppan sucks, but at least has some shred of value as the #5/6 SP and will be gone in a year, while we could probably do better than Matthews by riding it out with Gerut or a minor league FA.

[Never Outhustled]

If I deal Suppan for someone with 2 years left on their deal, I'd rather it be Oliver Perez. Perez really turned things around under Rick Peterson last time, and then he reverted back to his usual wild self without him. I'd think theres a decent chance he could be good again reunited with Peterson. Perez is owed $24 million guaranteed over 2 years, Suppan is owed $14.5 million guaranteed, including the buyout for 2011.

[RockCoCougars]

If I deal Suppan for someone with 2 years left on their deal, I'd rather it be Oliver Perez. Perez really turned things around under Rick Peterson last time, and then he reverted back to his usual wild self without him. I'd think theres a decent chance he could be good again reunited with Peterson. Perez is owed $24 million guaranteed over 2 years, Suppan is owed $14.5 million guaranteed, including the buyout for 2011.

I'd do this in a heartbeat. I consider Suppan to be a sunk cost who actually has negative value to the team, because he keeps getting run out there due to his contract. If he was making league minimum, he would have been DFA'd long ago.

 

If Suppan is a sunk cost, adding $10 million in payroll equates to $5 million a year for Perez. I think that's an acceptable risk, but sadly the Mets probably wouldn't even consider it. Perhaps a three way deal could be worked out with Milton Bradley going to the Mets and Suppan to the Cubs?