Winter Ball Thread

[dadofandrew]

I have nothing against Iribarren, he is what he is, kind of a poor man's Catalanotto. However, does he have the bat to be the reserve corner OF? That's what he is if he's not Gomez's backup. He's several years older than Escobar, and they had near identical lines in AAA last year. That does not strike me as an OF bat. Several folks don't think Alcides has the bat to be a major league SS, but Hernan has plenty to play some OF? I just don't see it.

 

I think he's best suited to be exactly what he has been...AAA depth who can fill in if someone gets hurt in the bigs. I have yet to see where he fits in MIL, very similar to the past two Septembers. Like Kottaras in BOS, he'd be better off finding a place where he'll fit in...veteran RH 2B, veteran RH CF, RH utility INF who can play SS or 3B.

[JohnBriggs12]

Al, why are you limiting him to the OF? He played 98 games at 2B at Nashville and made just 5 errors. He's certainly a viable guy to use there if Weeks can't go. Speaking of Catalanotto, I thought he made fine 5th outfielder. He too had the ability to play some infield but his primary job was as late inning PH. What are you expecting to find for a minimum wage 5th OF?

 

No knock on Heether, but he's 2 1/2 years older than Iribarren. Sure, he's shown a little more power, but he's older and still it's not the type of power you equate with an everyday corner OF either. So your point about Iribarren being older than Escobar works both ways. Plus if you look closer, you'll see Iribarren's numbers at Nashville were actually a little better than Escobar's anyway. Hernan had for him an off year in 08, but most of his career he's hit, as a lifetime .314 minor league BA attests.

 

My whole point is why would you expose Iribarren to waivers and hurt your depth, when you can keep Iribarren either as the 6th infielder or 5th outfielder (actually both) and option Heether who can still be called up at a moments notice. I don't think the difference between the two justifies risking losing one.

 

The only issue is that it makes the bench a little heavy lefthanded. That's only the case if Gamel made the 25 man, and if he's not starting, why would he? If he is starting, then McGehee is the RH off the bench. Even assuming the lefty hitting Counsel is back along with Gerut and Iribarren as bench players, that would still leave room for one more RH bat. The pickup of Kottaras could even signal that extra RH bat could be Rivera. A third catcher makes the bench a lot deeper as it allows for use of a catcher to PH and also allows Macha to double switch at the catcher position and to PH for the catcher. Looking at Kottaras's splits, you don't want him facing a lefty reliever in a key situation late.

 

BTW, both Iribarren and Escobar have been on tears down in Venezuela. Hernan's up to .311/.382/.459/.811 and Alcides is up to .344/.379/.410/.789. I think both those guys can handle major league pitching myself and I wouldn't be shocked one bit if Weeks were to go down again, that Iribarren could step right in and do the job.

[colbyjack]

Again, like Briggs, I don't know why Iribarren is being cast as a backup corner OF, or even as a backup to Gomez. He doesn't necessarily have to be a backup at any one position, as he offers versatility, and speed, off of the bench. In my mind, he is potentially a perfect fit for the 25th spot on the active roster.

 

I don't even mind having a bench full of LH hitters since the lineup projects to have almost all RH hitters. Hernan has shown the past two winters that he hits RHPs extremely well.

[dadofandrew]

Briggs, as I have often said, the only bench guy I can recall of any significance that was a reserve 2B who could not play SS or 3B was Keith Lockhart. Now, Hernan can play OF, so he might have a future as a OF who can play some 2B. However, I do not see the niche for him in MIL...he's an inexperienced backup for Gomez, he is not going to hit enough to be a LF/RF reserve, and if Heether is one IF reserve, the other one needs to be able to play SS, as Weeks nor McGehee is going to. If Counsell is back, a pair of LH bats is far from ideal as your INF reserves. Given that they will probably go with a lefty bat to back up Gomez, that's a plethora of LH bats on the bench. Not only would you like to be balanced between LH and RH, you'd also like to have some power.

 

I just do not see a spot, barring injury.

 

If Weeks goes down, I'd see Gamel at 3B and McGehee at 2B, until Mat is no longer around.

[TooLiveBrew]

However, I do not see the niche for him in MIL

 

How can you not see the niche? Patrick laid it out perfectly in his post right before yours... not to mention that Hernan would be able to see a lot of 'one & done' PH appearances for the pitcher.

[JohnBriggs12]

Escobar continues to rake in Venezuela going 4 for 4 on Thursday with a HR and 2 RBI. His numbers now read: .385/.414/.492, in 65 AB's.

 

Iribarren did not play.

[Mass Haas]

The folks over at BrewCrewBall have done a fine job with daily winter league updates

 

I can't remember a Brewer prospect coming off his rookie pro season being given the leeway to perform in winter ball as 22-year-old 2009 6th round RHP Hiram Burgos has this year.

 

The native Puerto Rican was inexpensive coming out of Bethune-Cookman ($15,000) -- so he's more advanced. Still a bit of a surprise.

[battlekow]

Another scheduled free agent, Adam Heether, is with Leones del Caracas, the same team Mat Gamel is joining in November.

McCalvy reports that Heether's back in the States with a minor intercostal strain and that Gamel will be heading to Venezuela the day after Thanksgiving but won't see a game until early December. Also, congratulations on getting married, Mat.

[Mass Haas]

Why that Florida Independent Winter Ball League failed after only three weeks...

[twobrewers]

Gamel has started playing in Winter Ball.

 

So far he is 2 for 7 with a triple. (Also 3 strike outs)

[Tedaldtada]

Carlos Gomez is having a fine winter so far.354/.468/.458/.926 through 48 ab's. 6 BB and 2 IBB w/ 14 K's. He has also been hit by 6 pitches in 14 games. Please be careful Carlos.

 

Edit: He currently would be first in the league in BA, OBP, T-7th in SLG, and 3rd in OPS, but he does not qualify (2.7 PA's/team game, currently at 1.26).

[JohnBriggs12]

One thing that's fun about watching the winter leagues is you see names that crop up that haven't been around the majors for quite some time.

 

One that intrigues me is Richard Hidalgo. Hidalgo you may recall was one of the brightest young stars in the game when at age 25 in 2000 he hit .314/.391/.636 with 44 HR and 122 RBI for the Astros. After 2003 when he put up a .957 OPS, his numbers slipped considerably until his final year with Texas in 2005 where he hit .221/.289/.416 but still managed 16 HR in 339 AB's.

 

After leaving the Orioles spring training when his wife became ill in 2006, he left presumably to go to Japan. He joined the indy league Long Island Ducks in 2007 but "retired" prior to the season. In 2008 he attempted a comeback with the Ducks but left the team in August. Last year he played just 2 games in the Mexican League.

 

Whether his presence in the Venezuelan Winter Leagues means he's seriously looking to make a comeback, who knows. But I'd bet scouts are taking note.

[Mass Haas]

RHP Hiram Burgos earned a front-page photo on MiLB.com with this start in Puerto Rico. Martin Maldonado, struggling offensively, was his batterymate. Brewer AAA outfielder Tike Redman was in the opposing lineup, as was former Brewer farmhand and now independent league catcher Lou Palmisano.

[battlekow]

RHP Hiram Burgos earned a front-page photo on MiLB.com with this start in Puerto Rico.

He's got quite the stare.

 

http://web.minorleaguebaseball.com/images/2009/12/07/U22F8jNp.jpg

[JohnBriggs12]

Escobar over .400! A 4 for 5 night has pushed his average to .403.

 

Now that he has enough plate appearances to qualify, Escobar is leading the Venezuelan Winter League in batting with that .403 average which is more than 20 points better than the second place hitter. His OBP is .445 and he's slugging .500.

[fondybrewfan]

How good is the pitching talent down there? Escobar's number obviously looks awesome, but how much stock can you put into this performance? Is it similar to the AFL or even Spring Training in ARI where everyone puts up huge offensive numbers?

[JohnBriggs12]

How good is the pitching talent down there? Escobar's number obviously looks awesome, but how much stock can you put into this performance? Is it similar to the AFL or even Spring Training in ARI where everyone puts up huge offensive numbers?

The pitching is a pretty mixed bag (lots of veterans and young guys mixed together) and hitting has an edge: Team ERAs range from 4.06 to 5.47, but the fact that Esocbar (now at .408 by the way after another 4 hit game), is nearly 30 points better than the number 2 guy surely is still impressive. The numbers he's putting up down there coupled with his decent numbers for the Brewers should have him brimming with confidence going into spring training.

[twobrewers]

I am significantly concerned about Mat Gamel

 

In Venezuela he has 10 strike outs in 22 at bats.

In Nashville he struck out 89 times in 273 at bats

In Milwaukee he struck out 54 times in 128 at bats.

 

In 2008 he was striking out every 4.3 at bats.

In 2009 he is striking out every 2.7 at bats.

[dadofandrew]

Everyone hits in winterball, the pitching is AA level at best.

[Scooter1027]

Everyone hits in winterball, the pitching is AA level at best.

Which makes Gamel's struggles to this point more concerning. Granted, 26 ABs don't mean that much, but what continues to concern me is the 11 K / 1 BB ratio he's put up thus far. Against this level of pitching, should he really be striking out at this rate still? Gamel's '09 campaign has created a lot of questions in my opinion...obviously the talent is very much there and he has slugged at a consistently good level. But this strikeout rate has to improve or he won't make enough contact to be a true impact player.

[TooLiveBrew]

I think Gamel proved everything he had to prior to being called up, and was terribly mishandled. However, at some point, he needs to wipe that out of his memory banks & just get back to his natural stroke... and start raking.

[stalton]

TH announces Escobar clinching Winter Ball Batting Title

Batting Stats

 

Escobar with a great .393/.440/.491 and OPSing at a .931

 

Hurricane even with a very respectable .309/.365/.446 and a OPS of .810

 

Crappy pitching or not, its good to see those two mashing

[battlekow]

Hiram Burgos won Rookie of the Year honors in the Puerto Rican Winter League--unanimously, I believe.

[sheetskout]

Everyone hits in winterball, the pitching is AA level at best.

I'm actually gonna say that Winter Ball pitching is lower in equivelance than AA. I would say A+.

[BrewerBrent]

Hiram Burgos won Rookie of the Year honors in the Puerto Rican Winter League--unanimously, I believe.

Awesome. I was gonna say, everytime I read the winter league updates I would look for his name. Seemed like he always put up a pretty good stat line.