Hoffman Close to Signing; Latest -- '10 deal signed for $8 mil, plus mutual option for '11 (reply #33)

[JohnBriggs12]

I think it's a mistake to commit $8 million to Hoffman before the market has even been established. Clubs that rushed and got their guys signed early last year overpaid. As good as he was this year, in the unlikely event he's as good next year, it doesn't solve the fundamental problem of poor starting pitching.

 

The closer should be the last piece for a team that's poised to win. The Brewers are far from being in that position.

[JohnBriggs12]

I agree with the sentiments so far. Sign Hoffman as quickly as possible and then move on to the rotation. Hoffman has been very reliable. It is a low risk move and allows us to continue to try to develop a closer for the future.

 

I find it interesting that you could swap out Mike Cameron's name in this statement, along with 'CF' for 'CP', yet Brewers fans seem very much split on whether or not to bring Mike back... meanwhile no one even thinks to object to Hoffman returning.

 

I like that Hoffman appears to be coming back (since clearly he's still very good), but the problem is the starting rotation, not the guy that throws some of the lowest-leverage innings of any pitcher on the roster.

 

 

EDIT: The first sentence I typed is by no means a shot at jjfanec. I completely agree with his point on Hoffman, his post just sparked my thoughts on Cam.

I agree with you on Cam as well although that is probably for another thread. I think he would take a pay cut to stay which would be nice.

 

I do not understand the cart before the horses analogy. A solid bullpen makes your relievers better. Even with a terrible rotation Hoffman almost got 40 saves. That is a lot of chances. You have to believe they will get one pitcher through a trade. They will have Gallardo, Bush, pitcher via trade, and then who knows (Suppan, Parra, Narveson, Butler, FA?, Looper, another trade). The Free Agent pitching crop is terrible so it makes more sense to spend money on a very good closer than a passable at best starting pitcher.

The FA starting pitching crop isn't terrible. It's about average. There's at least a half dozen guys that would have easily qualified as 2nd best starter on the Brewers.

[jjfanec]

The FA starting pitching crop isn't terrible. It's about average. There's at least a half dozen guys that would have easily qualified as 2nd best starter on the Brewers.

Who are these good pitchers? You have John Lackey as the stud. Then after that it seems like guys with serious injury questions (Bedard, Escobar, Harden) or guys who are not that great but will get more money than they should (Marquis, Washburn, Pavano) or guys who are old and most likely will only go to a coast or serious contender (Johnson, Wolf, Wakefield). After that I see Doug Davis and Pineiro. Pineiro could easily be in the guy who is going to get paid way too much category. I must be missing some people because we cannot afford Lackey, or taking chance on the injury risk guys. The other guys remind me of Suppan three years ago. Inning eaters who are getting older and do not strike people out. Not an appealing class, but like I said I could be missing people

[Invader3K]

I agree with that assessment. It seems like beyond Lackey (who we probably have no shot at signing), it's a lot of Jeff Suppan type risky guys that I would think most on this forum would be against signing. Realistically, Melvin is going to have to wheel and deal through trades to improve the club.

[patrickgpe]

The closer should be the last piece for a team that's poised to win. The Brewers are far from being in that position.

 

i don't agree with this statement. While I agree that the team needs to improve their rotation and there are some huge question marks regarding their everyday players, having someone who can shut down the door in the 9th is still important. I think most would agree that while the brewers will probably not be a favorite to win the central or get a wild card they are atleast a strong contender. It would be a mistake to let hoffman get away and be forced to make a setup man close. Do you remember the disaster of having Villaneuva close to start the year or a couple years ago when Adams was the brewers closer? Its still a key position. Plus considering how good he was, i was expecting the pay increase to be more than 2 million, so i am happy.

[TuesdaysWithRillo]

Hoffman is inked. 1 year, 8 million.

[Thurston Fluff]

I think you take care of what you can take care of when you have the opportunity. It may be a priority to revamp the starting pitching but that can't be addressed now. I don't think Melvin would do this deal if he thought it would hamper his ability to address the starting pitching. If fact it could help him in the sense that it could clarify the way he goes about revamping the starting rotation.

Cost certainty is going to come into play when deciding who to target and what way to get starting pitching. If he has the bullpen set then he knows how much he is working with when revamping the stating rotation. Knowing his parameters makes his job more focused. He will know how much he has to spend and what avenues he should go to fill those needs.

[DuWayne Steurer]

I think you take care of what you can take care of when you have the opportunity.

I think that's exactly right. It's the first day of the off-season, and the closers spot is taken care of for 2010. That's one thing Melvin won't have to even think about going forward for another year.

 

I'm not an eternal optimist, but I also am not nearly as pessimistic as some about the chances to compete in 2010. We lost Rickie for the year. Hardy and Hart underperformed and were replaced or injured. We had the worst hitting starting catcher in the league. Gallardo was inconsistent, and walked too many guys. Bush and Suppan were hurt, and replaced by AAAA scrubs who weren't any better. Villy, McClung and others in the bullpen performed below expectations. Manny Parra regressed badly and had a terrible year.

 

And they went 80-82. 5 lucky or bad bounces away from 85-77. It's not hard to see 5 wins worth of improvement simply from most of the guys playing at 90% of their expected production level. Shore up the rotation with a #3 type guy in a trade. Escobar putting up a .715 OPS next year improves on what JJ did offensively. Rickie Weeks should be healthy. Gallardo has a year of experience under his belt. Manny Parra pitched better in the 2nd half.

 

I see no reason why a good closer shouldn't be a priority for a team in this position.

[kramnoj]

TH is reporting that Olney is reporting that the deal includes a mutual option for 2011. No further details on that yet.

 

Edit: Linkification. - Toby

[joepepsi]

It's a wonderful move. I'm not a big closer guy, but if a team plans to compete, they need to have a reliable closer and be willing to overpay. I don't think they are overpaying by much, if any, and I think "going for it" in 2010 is the right move. The Brewers have one more year of Prince guaranteed and should do everything to maximize the win potential.

 

I understand the comparison to Cameron's contract status and that Brewer fans underrate his value. Still, I think he's going to look for $12 million or more next year, plus extra years guaranteed or optioned. I realize he's a great CF'er but I just don't see how that would be worth more wins that Gerut's defense in center.

 

Btw, Gerut hit .279/.343/.459 after the All Star break. If they could re-sign him for less than $4 million that would free up quite of bit Cam's salary for use elsewhere.

[trwi7]

Btw, Gerut hit .279/.343/.459 after the All Star break. If they could re-sign him for less than $4 million that would free up quite of bit Cam's salary for use elsewhere.

 

Gerut's not a free agent. He's still arbitration eligible and won't make that much in arbitration.

[joepepsi]

Btw, Gerut hit .279/.343/.459 after the All Star break. If they could re-sign him for less than $4 million that would free up quite of bit Cam's salary for use elsewhere.

 

Gerut's not a free agent. He's still arbitration eligible and won't make that much in arbitration.

Well, I consider that good news!

[foster1887]

Trevor will be going for save number 600 next season and it is going to be great that he will be in a Brewers uniform when it happens! I am fine with him signing for $8 million.

[CheezWizHed]

Clubs that rushed and got their guys signed early last year overpaid.

 

I doubt that will happen the same way this year. What happened last year was driven by the poor economy outlook, with the worst indicators happening in Nov-Dec. So those that made deals in Oct didn't see it coming.

 

Now that we have established what people will pay for tickets/food/etc... last year, next year should only be better. We hit the bottom this year and I think most teams will expect next year to be better on the economy. Purse-strings will still be tight, but not like last year.

 

Makes it even more impressive that we hit 3 million tickets again in 2009.

[hawing]

Welcome back, Trevor (not that you're likely reading this).

Like it or not, re-signing Hoffman has PR benefits. Name recognition and franchise legitimization sound kind of shallow, but if either persuades even casual fans to re-up for 2010, that's helpful - as much as we might wish that the whole fanbase were as diehard as we are.

[mletto157]

I'm not big on the "closer" being an important role... because statistically speaking most relief pitchers could perform in that role. However, with how the general fan base responded to Trevor this year, I totally see why they brought him back. After a disappointing season they need someone to fill the seats. Whatever makes people come to the games is a win for the organization. Having Trevor does that, and having him hit #600 this year could help that even more!

 

EDIT: I don't know about you, but even I got amped when Hells Bells starting playing over the loudspeaker this year.

[hawing]

EDIT: I don't know about you, but even I got amped when Hells Bells starting playing over the loudspeaker this year.

I'm so not a heavy metal person, but yeah, it's nearly impossible to not get into the whole Trevor time atmosphere.

One game we were at this year, the fans next to us got up to leave just as he was coming out. I was incredulous.

[PepsiFanClubAlum]

Great deal. Now we don't have to watch dougy acquire 5-7 "power arms" to try and find lightening in a bottle and be hostage by this need.

 

We will make better trades and signings, acquire better players with the box checked at closer.

[logan82]

I wouldn't be shocked to see Hoffman retained, Kendell resigned because Salome didn't tear up AAA, Cameron retained in CF because of Cain's season, Looper's option picked up, and i won't be surprised if Melvin doesn't find a good deal for Hardy, Hart, or McGehee and both Escobar and Gamel start the year in AAA. Essentially, I won't be surprised if we have largely the exact same team going into 2010 as we had in 2009.

 

I wouldn't be surprised to see most of the same roster back either. I do think one of JJ/Escobar will be traded though. I don't think we will get a good return on either if they are traded.

 

I think $8M is a bit much for a closer, but I agree that you take care of what you can when you can. The difference between Hoffman and the next best guy to relieve is probably minimal. This strengthens our pen overall by moving guys all down a notch. I don't see us signing a free agent pitcher. None of the free agents look that great so I don't see it as using money on the wrong need.

[colbyjack]

I see no reason why a good closer shouldn't be a priority for a team in this position.

 

I agree 100%, and am happy to see this deal go down so quickly. Just because the team needs starting pitching more than anything else shouldn't take away from the current strengths and possible other needs this team has. One thing that drives me crazy in the offseason is how some teams address their priorities one by one, instead of trying to just get the best players they can on their team. I'm sure the team has some kind of an idea of how they intend to improve their starting rotation and likely wouldn't have made this signing so quickly if they felt it would restrict any other moves they could make.

[splitterpfj]

It's a reasonable deal for a guy coming off a fantastic season...why not?

 

This team won 80 games with an absolutely horrible showing from its starting pitchers - that shows that there are some real strong points in other areas. I'm glad to see a quick focus on keeping a key contributor, you don't get better by letting an affordable star walk out the door.

[jjfanec]

Milwaukee had 22 blown saves this year and Hoffman only had 4 of them. I know before Hoffman came back from injury we had a lot of blown saves. I am not sure how many of those games we lost but Hoffman's presence for a whole season would made this an above .500 team. It is good to have him back. It is nice not have to reconstruct our whole bullpen in the off-season. Melvin will be able to focus on the rotation now.

[ilovebeer]

good news. can't wait to here hells bells next year. $8 million is not that all bad for a closer.

[EauClaireNWL]

If he pitches like he did this season next year, it's well worth the money. Our bullpen was pretty suspect until he came off the DL.

[bjkrautk]

If not Trevor, than who? Carlos V. didn't do anything to win the job, Weathers is only a year younger than Hoffman, and DiFelice tired out by August. Coffey's numbers were above average, and I think he comes closest to any of the remaining options for having "that closer mentality," but I'd much rather keep him in a setup role.