The future of Jeremy Jeffress

[battlekow]

Haudricourt:

 

Another prospect who figures to make his big-league debut before the

year is done is right-hander Jeremy Jeffress. The Brewers

recently added Jeffress to their 40-man roster, in part to avoid another

suspension and subsequent lifetime ban should he test positive for

marijuana again.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

But the Brewers

also wanted to dangle the big-league carrot a bit closer to Jeffress,

hoping he'll stay focused and fulfill his immense potential. Jeffress

has been pitching in relief, but the long-term plan is to return the

hard thrower to a starting role.

[TooLiveBrew]

Excellent. I guess it was a little sky-is-falling to think otherwise, but it's just good to see confirmed.

[monty57]

How would a lifetime ban be different than him blowing out his shoulder except that he would have mentally trashed his career instead of physically?

One is avoidable by placing him on the 40-man, one isn't

 

He's done this to himself, he's been getting all the support than Wilhelmsen didn't...

 

Maybe they learned a lesson, that it's better to support the person rather than toss them aside.

 

I remain very high on his potential as pitcher, but I'm willing to separate myself from that idea judge this situation more on my personal value system.

 

Unfortunately in sports (and many "big money ventures") personal values take a backseat to money, wins, etc. Not saying it's right, but it's the way things often work.

 

Why is he more at risk during July and August than he was in June, May, and April?

 

Maybe they waited until he was done with rehab and the suspension was over. Maybe they wanted to make sure he was clean. Maybe they wanted to make sure he was still mentally and physically able to pitch. Or, you may be right, and they know he's using and want to hide it. I'm sure it wouldn't be the first time teams have purposefully hidden drug use (see Steroids Era).

 

Politics aside, we all have workplace rules we don't agree with, how much rope do we get to hang ourselves?

 

You ever work for a commission? Often, the high commission earners get more "rope" than the low earners. In other professions, tenured employees can almost get away with murder while non-tenured employees get treated like cattle. I'd guess a former #1 pick with a 100-MPH fastball gets more rope than some of his compatriots. Again, this doesn't make it right, but it happens all the time.

 

I'd be interested in the ethical rule that was violated.

 

If someone is performing an illegal act, and you do something to hide that crime, you are performing an illegal act (aid & abet). It would be pure speculation to state that this is what happened, but if it was, then it was not only an "ethical rule" that was violated, but it would be a criminal act.

[MJLiverock]

I'd be interested in the ethical rule that was violated.

 

If someone is performing an illegal act, and you do something to hide that crime, you are performing an illegal act (aid & abet). It would be pure speculation to state that this is what happened, but if it was, then it was not only an "ethical rule" that was violated, but it would be a criminal act.

There is no law that says a team has to drug test and fire or suspend players for that violation. Nor is there a workplace requirement law to do so. My own workplace doesn't test for drugs but says in the policy that if they suspect an employee is under the influence of a drug they can request a test. A positive test means going to rehab and a "strike" against the employee. Nowhere is it required to inform the law of a positive test and I have never heard of a company calling the police and a DA willing to prosecute someone for testing positive for a drug.

 

Even the factory where my dad works only fires people for multiple positive drug tests and they certaily don't inform the police of positive tests.

 

I can't even begin to fathom how HIPAA regulations would apply to positive drugs tests and sharing that information.

 

 

[pete]

Even if they drug tested him and were aware of positive results, it doesn't meet the legal definition of aiding and abetting.

[monty57]

Aid & Abet: To assist another in the commission of a crime by words or conduct.

 

The person who aids and abets participates in the commission of a crime by performing some Overt Act or by giving advice or encouragement. He or she must share the criminal intent of the person who actually commits the crime, but it is not necessary for the aider and abettor to be physically present at the scene of the crime.

 

An aider and abettor is a party to a crime and may be criminally liable as a principal, an Accessory before the fact, or an accessory after the fact.

 

I think it could be argued that putting Jeffress on the 40-man to hide his drug use and prevent him from getting a lifetime ban, with the knowledge in mind that the Brewers stand to make a lot of money by having Jeffress on the team would indeed fall under the definition of aiding and abetting. Of course, this is purely hypothetical, and I don't think it's what happened, so please don't think I'm calling Melvin out for anything.

 

Secondly, if everyone who witnessed someone doing drugs and didn't call the police were thrown in prison, there would be no one left outside the prisons, so of course it isn't going to happen. The key point (in my non-lawyer mind) is that the Brewers stand to profit significantly through an action that "overtly" hides a criminal act. If you have knowledge of an employee committing a criminal act, and you allow that action to continue, you are aiding and abetting. If you perform an action (such as placing him on the 40-man) that makes it easier to continue performing said illegal action, you are condoning the illegal action.

 

Again, there is nothing to say this is what's happening. Also, it's not the type of illegal action our legal system acts on. If Jeffress were doing something more serious and the Brewers were hiding it, they'd have problems. However, by word of law, smoking pot is illegal.

 

MJLiveRock, while there is no law for mandatory drug testing (which is good), I believe there are laws that state that if you have knowledge of a criminal act, you must report said criminal act (although we all know that most witnesses never come forward). I've never really understood how unions have been able to "negotiate" illegal actions, and I don't know why drugs have been put on a different platform from other crimes (i.e. if you perform the illegal act of doing drugs, you get one penalty, while if you do a different illegal act you get a different penalty). It's possible that it has to do something with the intrusive nature of "discovering" the drugs (i.e. taking a urine test as opposed to seeing witnessing someone stealing from the company). Again, I'm not a lawyer or in any way an expert on this matter, so I'm just speculating.

 

I guess the bottom line is that nothing is ever going to come out of this. I was just responding to a post saying they wanted to know what "ethical law" exists. Since there isn't such a thing as an "ethical law," I responded as best I could. I don't think Melvin or the Brewers are criminals, and hope the best for Jeffress.

[TooLiveBrew]

I can understand why some people are rubbed the wrong way by this move, but imo the most important thing to remember is that this move is really only coming a few months early. This isn't some super-shady move by the Brewers, it's just being smart. But then again Jeffress's marijuana use doesn't bug me any more than an underage drinking ticket would.

[logan82]

I can understand why some people are rubbed the wrong way by this move, but imo the most important thing to remember is that this move is really only coming a few months early.

Depends on whether or not an extra option gets used. If no option is used, yes it isn't a big deal. Considering Jeffress progression so far he might need that extra year for development.

[battlekow]

Depends on whether or not an extra option gets used. If no option is used, yes it isn't a big deal. Considering Jeffress progression so far he might need that extra year for development.

Baseball America confirmed that the Brewers did indeed need to burn an option on Jeffress after adding him to the 40-man.

[pete]

The very definition you present requires an overt act in the assistance of a crime as well as sharing criminal intent. I guess if you want to believe it, you can, but it isn't aiding and abetting. Even if a prosecutor could produce evidence that the Brewers sole purpose of putting him on the 40 man, such as correspondence, it still wouldn't qualify.

[TheCrew07]

Depends on whether or not an extra option gets used. If no option is used, yes it isn't a big deal. Considering Jeffress progression so far he might need that extra year for development.

Baseball America confirmed that the Brewers did indeed need to burn an option on Jeffress after adding him to the 40-man.

Which in my opinion was just foolish roster management, and my biggest problem with the whole situation, but I guess that's just par for the course from where I'm sitting.

[Invader3K]

Jeffress going to Huntsville now. Good sign.

[paul253]

Let's hope round two goes a little better than round one went.

[igor67]

I agree let's keep the train rolling. It definitely seems that the farm system has turned things around a bit after such a horrible across the board start.

[jackalope02ca]

And I thought he was a prime candidate for a demotion. He pitched terribly in Brevard and they reward him with a promotion. Go figure.

[Never Outhustled]

And I thought he was a prime candidate for a demotion. He pitched terribly in Brevard and they reward him with a promotion. Go figure.

 

He had a couple of bad outings with a dead arm, but righted the ship.

[brewmann04]

I was wondering if they will still use him as a reliever or a starter.

[jackalope02ca]

He had a couple of bad outings with a dead arm, but righted the ship.

How do you figure he righted the ship? In 2 of the last 3 outings he gave up 4 ER in 1 2/3 innings. And how do you get a dead arm after pitching a total of 18 innings this year to date thanks to his suspension?

[rotoherb]

The reality is that none of us know how he was pitching at Brevard County because we didn't see him pitch, and ten innings of stats isn't going to tell us anything. It's quite possible that he's still throwing 99 MPH has shown the stuff to move to Double-A. We really don't know what went on during the game where he walked four in 1.1 innings or his outing where he allowed five hits and three runs because we weren't there to see it. A scout at the game may come away with an entirely different picture than we get from looking at a box score.

 

Then again, maybe he isn't ready for Double-A and this will be a debacle. My point is that making a statement either way after 10 innings at A+ without seeing the guy pitch is dubious at best. I'd go with the scouting report over what he actually did when we're talking about 10 innings.

[Invader3K]

It seems like they're trying to fast track him to the majors. I have no problem with that, as at some point he has to step up and do solid work above A-ball.

[sheetskout]

Ok, let's take a closer look, shall we?

 

As I expected, Morrow's time as a reliever makes his ERA look respectable. Let's take a look at what he has done as a starter.

 

23 career starts, 120.1 IP (5.23 IP/Start), 110 hits, 125 K's, 76 BB's, 16 HR's allowed, 5.01 ERA, .756 OPS against, tOPS+ 111, 1.54 WHIP. All that with a .303 BAbip.

 

How about 2010 thus far? 8 Starts, 41.0 IP (5.125 IP/Start), 42 Hits, 54 K's, 27 BB's, 4 HR's allowed, 6.15 ERA, .787 OPS against, tOPS+ 100, sOPS+ 116, 1.68 WHIP. Now, he has been a bit unlucky with a .388 BAbip.

 

How exactly are these numbers 'way to optimistic' for Jeffress? And if I remember correctly, Jeffress wasn't getting AA hitters out because he was working primarily on his off speed stuff that year. He is a true one pitch guy right now, just like Morrow (they both flash plus off speed stuff at times). He walks a ton of guys, just like Morrow. He strikes out a ton of guys, just like Morrow.

 

Idk, do you have a better comparison?

Still think Jeffress can live up to Brandon Morrow? http://forum.brewerfan.net/images/smilies/smile.gif

[YoungGeezy]

He had a couple of bad outings with a dead arm, but righted the ship.

How do you figure he righted the ship? In 2 of the last 3 outings he gave up 4 ER in 1 2/3 innings. And how do you get a dead arm after pitching a total of 18 innings this year to date thanks to his suspension?

 

 

Wow the leader of the above the influence strikes again.... he pitched outstanding in wisconsin, was great in BC til he hit a couple bad outtings and now he is in Huntsville pitchin great again. Thing is that Jeffress could be outstandin but as soon as he gives up a run you will call for his head and want him gone. There is not a person on here who doesn't get how much you dislike Jeffress, there are 11 pages on this with you stressing it and then what you have wrote on other ones. Let it go already and be happy for how well he has pitched after the long lay off and his ability to get clean so far.

 

 

keep it up Jeffress!!! See you in Milwaukee in September! I'll have to send jackalope02 a Jeffress number 1 fan jersey http://forum.brewerfan.net/images/smilies/wink.gif

[Never Outhustled]

Jeffress has now thrown 7 shutout innings in AA, without a walk.

[HiAndTight]

He had a couple of bad outings with a dead arm, but righted the ship.

How do you figure he righted the ship? In 2 of the last 3 outings he gave up 4 ER in 1 2/3 innings. And how do you get a dead arm after pitching a total of 18 innings this year to date thanks to his suspension?

How about because you've only pitched 18 innings this year to date?

 

You do realize that the time a pitcher pitches IN the game isn't the only time he throws/pitches, right?

 

Man, just from reading this thread, you're on some over the top mission to bash Jeffress as much as humanly possible. We get it, you don't like him.

 

But I would say it certainly does appear based on VERY early results he has in fact, "righted the ship". 5 IP, 0 BB's 5 K's and 3 H allowed. 5 innings is 5 innings, be it 5 good innings or 5 bad, but all things being equal, I'd rather see him continue to dominate than struggle. I get the very sincere impression you'd rather see the kid struggle badly.

 

I guess I'm just not of the same mind that you throw a kid away because he's had a problem with pot of all things when he's 21 years old.

[TooLiveBrew]

Jeffress has now thrown 7 shutout innings in AA, without a walk.

I can't wait to see him in Milwaukee this September.