Gamel's future

[bklynbrewcrew]

I think Mat Gamel's future with the Brewers lies entirely on the future of Ken Macha. If Macha is let go Gamel has a future with the team but if he is retained Gamel is as good as gone. It is obvious by now that Macha doesnt like Gamel and will not give him any chance at playing time. Even today when some of the backups are starting Macha had to start Counsell instead of Gamel.

 

I feel bad for Mat because his whole season has been ruined by his time in Milwaukee where he never got a fair shake. Hopefully Macha is fired because if he isnt I doubt Gamel will be around.

[TheCrew07]

Well Melvin could move McGehee and Counsell could retire this off season thus opening the door for Heether and Gamel. Then at least 1 of them will get a chance to play.

[BrewCrewForever]

I like Gamel, think he has talent and could be a good player. But in a small sample of MLB games this season, he strikes out a TON.

[paul253]

I don't understand how the Brewer organization works. Right now they have Casey McGehee, Mat Gamel, and Taylor Green all playing third base. Green has gotten some playing time at 1B but really not all the much. What exactly do they plan on doing with everyone? Why not move Gamel to the outfield and let Casey McGehee, who has certainly earned it, play third base every day?

[Ennder]

I don't really agree, I think people way overreact to this kind of thing. For every rookie that comes up and plays every day there are multiple ones that break in slowly and in this particular case we happened to have an unexpected breakout at the same position that partially blocked him.

 

Now if we don't do something about it in the offseason then I think they screwed up, so far it just hasn't been that big of a deal.

[wibadgers23]

3rd base is McGehee's job to lose right now, but what I want to know is what will happen if Gamel outplays Casey in spring training. Or what happens if they put up equal or similar numbers in spring training? Does Gamel still open the season in Nashville and rot down there for the whole year?

[jeffy]

I don't really agree, I think people way overreact to this kind of thing. For every rookie that comes up and plays every day there are multiple ones that break in slowly and in this particular case we happened to have an unexpected breakout at the same position that partially blocked him.

 

Agree...not everyone is going to come up and basically be handed a position like Hardy and Weeks were. Some are going to come up and be treated more like Hart. Some here said the same sorts of things about him...Yost does not like him, etc...

[dadofandrew]

If Gamel outplays McGehee in the tiny sample that is spring training, he'll be told to go down to AAA and keep it up, unlike this year, where he struggled the second half.

 

Gamel had a decent AAA season, but he needs to dominate at that level. As I have said before, Casey put up better numbers in the bigs than Mat did in AAA. As long as that is the case, the argument is moot.

 

Personally, I hope Mat does just that, because "too much talent" is a problem I'd love to have.

[logan82]

What about all the previous minor league seasons by McGehee where he never broke .800 OPS. I still think there is a good chance this season by McGehee was an outlier.

 

Edit: Forgot to add that Gamel is almost 3 years younger than McGehee.(3 months short of 3 years)

[PeaveyFury]

What about all the previous minor league seasons by McGehee where he never broke .800 OPS. I still think there is a good chance this season by McGehee was an outlier.

 

Yeah, I think it's extremely odd that people that constantly say 'beware of the small sample' seem unable to acknowledge the danger of relying on an outlier season.

[JohnBriggs12]

What about all the previous minor league seasons by McGehee where he never broke .800 OPS. I still think there is a good chance this season by McGehee was an outlier.

 

Edit: Forgot to add that Gamel is almost 3 years younger than McGehee.(3 months short of 3 years)

Once a player produces at the major league level, what he didn't do in the minors becomes almost totally irrelevant.

 

Would it make you feel better if he had? Good minor league seasons aren't necessarily predictors of major league success. Part of the purpose of playing in the minor leagues is learning to improve as a player. McGehee's numbers didn't fall off as he moved up. In fact, they generally got better the higher up he went so there is evidence he was learning something.

 

There's no guaranty that any player won't fall off. But McGehee's earned a major league job.

 

Gamel can do it, but he's still got work to do. His OPS was .839 at AAA this year. That might be better than McGehee did in 08 McGehee did drive in 92 runs in AAA last year showing a knack for the big hit that's carried over in the majors.

[logan82]

The only thing that I think is obvious from this season is that McGehee would hit well as a part time player and Gamel wouldn't.

[pogokat]

Have you guys just completely forgotten Scott Podsednik's rookie season?

 

Casey McGehee= scotty po in terms of outlier seasons as rookies in the majors...

 

I love casey and he's been great, but the odds are against him carrying an ops north of .760 next year...

[Ennder]

The only thing that I think is obvious from this season is that McGehee would hit well as a part time player and Gamel wouldn't.

I don't agree with this at all, there is no proof Gamel couldn't hit well as a part time player.

[logan82]

Once a player produces at the major league level, what he didn't do in the minors becomes almost totally irrelevant.

 

No it doesn't. Ask Bill Hall.

 

 

Would it make you feel better if he had?

 

Yes it would.

 

Good minor league seasons aren't necessarily predictors of major league success.

 

They are better predictors of success than a single MLB season are. The fact that McGehee has an OPS 104 points higher than his best MiLB season is reason to think this year is an outlier. I think he is more likely to be around league average for a 3B. I believe that is around .760-.790 OPS.

 

McGehee did drive in 92 runs in AAA last year

 

RBI as an argument for anything other than "who drove in the most runs" is useless.

[Ennder]

There are really 3 ways to handle the situation next year.

 

1) Trade Gamel for a team need, probably major league pitching. Doing this carries the risk of McGehee stinking it up next year but we have some other options at 3B in the minors as well.

 

2) Trade McGehee for a team need, probably minor league pitching. This carries the risk of McGehee actually repeating this and us not getting good value for him and the risk of Gamel not hacking it at 3B.

 

3) Keep both of them and let Gamel earn the job. This is the safe path as it keeps Gamel as insurance against McGehee struggling. The big problem with this is if they both do well we kind of get stuck with a log jam at one position and don't fill any of our other holes.

 

Any one of those 3 is probably ok as long as the trades bring decent talent in return.

[PeaveyFury]

There's no guaranty that any player won't fall off. But McGehee's earned a major league job.

 

I don't think there's anyone that thinks Casey doesn't belong here or hasn't earned a major league job, there just has to be the acknowledgment that Casey is more likely to have a dramatic fall off than your typical everyday player. Some people here get red in the face complaining about Melvin not trading guys like Turnbow, Hall, Hardy, etc before they fell off in hindsight, but with Casey the Brewers have the opportunity to trade him at a potential high point in value if they feel this is an outlier year. That's going to be a huge story and huge decision for the team to make this offseason.

[logan82]

I think #3 is probably the worst choice of the 3 unless the plan is to keep Gamel down long enough to gain another season of service out of him. I really wouldn't mind Gamel being in AAA for another year. I really don't want him brought up and given sporadic playing time like they did this year but wouldn't be bothered much if we gain another year form it.

[paul253]

Casey McGehee= scotty po in terms of outlier seasons as rookies in the majors...
I love casey and he's been great, but the odds are against him carrying an ops north of .760 next year...

 

I have never understood this line of thinking. He had a good year so we are just going to assume he will fall back and be a below average player next season? Who cares what he has done in his past, maybe he just made improvements. The fact of the matter is he has earned third base and should be allowed to play it until he gives it away. What happens if we "sell high" with him and Mat Gamel hits .240 next season while McGehee has another season like he had this year? I personally don't think this offense is good enough to trade away one of the more consistent hitters in the lineup. Beside, if this season is just an outlier and he is likely to fall off next season, can we really expect any real pitching help in return for him?

[pogokat]

Beside, if this season is just an outlier and he is likely to fall off next season, can we really expect any real pitching help in return for him?

 

but isn't that the problem? The Brewers should explore all options and see what the best they can get is..it's just not terribly likely that Casey will repeat his numbers...sure, maybe he has turned a corner...but it wouldn't be a common occurrence...

[sgtcluels]

It makes me throw up every time Patterson gets an AB and Gamel sits on the bench.

 

FREE MAT GAMEL!

[piccione88]

If the Brewers cant get "any real pitching" for Casey, we wont trade him. It is not like anyone is saying to trade Casey, just for the sake of trading him. It much more likely that McGehee will perform closer to how he performed the 6 seasons prior to coming here, and we have Gamel, who has alot of potential, and appears to be ready. So if you can get a decent pitcher, for a guy who will most likely be your second best third base option in 2010, it makes sense to pull the trigger.

 

As for this year, I am not that upset about Macha not playing Gamel. Melvin should not have brought him up to sit on the bench, but Macha is just playing who he thinks gives him the best chance to win in this case.

[twobrewers]

Casey McGahee is very likely over achieving.

 

However, having him as a .780ish OPS who can back up 3B, 2B, 1B and catcher in a pinch is very valuable at his salary.

 

The Brewers need to explore trading Hardy, Hart and McGahee in the offseason. They will also likely listen to offers on Gamel. Lastly, they have difficult decisions to make on Lopez, Cameron and Hoffman. (Because Kendall is an easy decision)

 

This might be the most exciting off-season for the Brewers during my life-time.

[bklynbrewcrew]

As long as Macha is managing the Brewers Gamel will not get a fair shake. I think it should be obvious by now that Macha just doesnt like the guy. Even in meaningless September games macha feels its appropriate to start Counsell and let Gamel rot on the bench. Get rid of Macha or Gamel will continue to have no shot of earning a starting spot with the team.

 

Lets face it Macha wouldnt play any young players if he didnt absolutely have to. Melvin is probably forcing him to start Escobar a few times per week or macha would just start Counsell. This Gamel situation is exactly why macha should never be the manager of a young team.

[Tbadder]

If I was Gamel I'd tell the Brewers to move me. I do it respectfully, and I'd do it with humility, and in secret, but if this organization really thinks it has something special in Casey, then I quite frankly don't want to be apart of that organization