Gamel and Hart for Jurjens?

[Hate those Rodents]

Not sure I have his name correct, and please read this link from a Braves fan before responding.

http://www.talkingchop.com/2009/9/11/1025718/braves-starting-pitchers-who-to

Obviously they are not getting Braun for him, but it seems like they'd like a 3B man and you know they were after Hart. Does anyone think that Gamel and Hart for their version of JJ would be fair for both sides. I am assuming he's an arm most of you would LOVE to have...

[nate82]

No. I wouldn't do that trade because you are gambling on McGehee doing what he did this year for a whole season next year and beyond. I would rather keep Gamel and try and get some players through free agency. I believe that person has it wrong the Braves are going to exercise their buyout on Hudson and that will save them the money they need to get another bat. Hudson is the most likely pitcher on the Braves roster to be gone after this season.

 

I wouldn't mind the Brewers picking him up though.

[bklynbrewcrew]

I would give them McGehee and Hart for Jurrjens but not Gamel.

[fleehaw]

I believe that person has it wrong the Braves are going to exercise their buyout on Hudson and that will save them the money they need to get another bat. Hudson is the most likely pitcher on the Braves roster to be gone after this season.

 

I wouldn't mind the Brewers picking him up though.

I believe MLBTR has a link that thought Vazquez might be the odd man out. He's a guy I would actively pursue.

 

Hart & Bush for Vazquez would be fine by me. While I like Bush, he's a mid-to-back of the rotation starter and the Brewers have too many of those and not enough cream at the top.

[nate82]

I believe MLBTR has a link that thought Vazquez might be the odd man out. He's a guy I would actively pursue.

 

Hart & Bush for Vazquez would be fine by me. While I like Bush, he's a mid-to-back of the rotation starter and the Brewers have too many of those and not enough cream at the top.

Hudson makes more sense since he has a $1m buyout next year that is a savings of $11m and there are plenty of free agent outfielders and 1B out there that the Braves could get to fill their offensive void. It will be a lot easier to find a quality bat in free agency than it will be to find someone to take Vazquez and his contract in a trade.

 

List of possible players the Braves could get with the $12m that they would be paying Hudson: Bobby Abreu, Rick Ankiel, Jason Bay (will be more than $12m), Johnny Damon, Brian Giles, Matt Holliday, Vladimir Guerrero, Troy Glaus, Mark DeRosa, Felipe Lopez, Russel Branyan, Hank Blaylock, Adrian Beltre, and Mike Cameron. That is a big list to choose from and only Holliday, Bay, and Guerrero would probably cost more than $12m a year. The options in free agency by far outweigh the trade market and is probably the safest way to go for the Braves.

 

I just don't understand why the Braves wouldn't just exercise that $1m buyout on Hudson. It is the easiest and best way to improve their team for next year while not giving up much of anything.

[NievesNoNO]

I like the deal a lot. A proven young pitcher for an unproven prospect and an averageish OF. Not that I don't think Gamel will be a fine major leaguer, but a deal like this has a fairly low amount of risk in comparison to a deal that might involve Prince for more unproven prospects.

[JohnBriggs12]

No. I wouldn't do that trade because you are gambling on McGehee doing what he did this year for a whole season next year and beyond. I would rather keep Gamel and try and get some players through free agency. I believe that person has it wrong the Braves are going to exercise their buyout on Hudson and that will save them the money they need to get another bat. Hudson is the most likely pitcher on the Braves roster to be gone after this season.

 

I wouldn't mind the Brewers picking him up though.

 

You might consider it too big a gamble, but I'm certain the Brewers don't and neither do I. McGehee has the inside track on the 3B job for next season because he got an opportunity and he seized it. To a lot of people in baseball, that goes a lot farther than gaudy minor league numbers. If the Brewers can get value back like Jurjens for Gamel and Hart, they'd be nuts not to grab it. If Gamel were to repeat his AAA numbers next year: .278/.367/.473, with 89 K's in 320 AB's, his value will drop like a rock. For me, that's the bigger gamble.

[jackalope02ca]

Why would Atlanta do that? Jurjens is one of the top young pitchers in the game. We would have to give up more than just Hart and Gamel to get him. I think Kris Medlen and Vazquez would be better players to try to pry loose.

[Hate those Rodents]

I dunno. I tried not being a homer on this one and really think Atlanta would go for this. I really think they are in as dire of a need for bats as we are for GOOD starting pitching.

[BrewCrewForever]

I would love Vazquez. But not for Gamel. Hart and McGehee for Vazquez. A rotation of Gallardo and Vazquez at the top would be fantastic. Have some combo of Bush, Parra, Looper or Suppan as your 3-5 and your set.

[Never Outhustled]

Matt Diaz is siezing their LF job. They need a 3B. Jason Heyward could grab an OF spot later next year.

 

They won't deal Jurjens with the impending free agency of there other pitchers. That would leave them with just 1 young pitcher.

 

If they want to buy out Hudson, I'd offer to take over his contract if they pay 500K. They save 500K instead of paying the $1 million buyout, and we get an ace caliber pitcher on a 1 year deal, for $11.5 million. His stuff is still awesome. If Hudson becomes a FA, he's getting a multi-year deal, and that would be too risky for us.

[dadofandrew]

Well, that's a risky move to be sure, but Hudson has barely pitched this year. Pronouncing him both healthy and still an ace seems to be more hope than fact.

 

Considering pitching is a high risk area no matter what, I guess that's just off the chart risk for me. You could easily bring in a Doug Davis type and perhaps a returning from an injury guy (Justin D?) as well for $11M.

 

That said, if Hudson returns and pitches well, he will probably outperform the two I mentioned. That's a big "if" for a small market club especially.

[Never Outhustled]

You could easily bring in a Doug Davis type

How do you propose getting Doug Davis to sign a 1 year deal? Signing Davis to the 3 year deal he'll get risks messing up 3 seasons. I'd rather have the better pitcher on a 1 year deal.

[dadofandrew]

Davis will probably get 2-3 years, I meant per season salary wise.

[nate82]

Escobar, Sheets, and Duscherer (Spelling?) are probably your best bets of getting them to sign 1-year deals. Both Escobar and Sheets have been injured Sheets hasn't pitched this year and Escobar hasn't pitched a full year since 2007.

[Invader3K]

It seems like Atlanta and Milwaukee match up well as far as needs. Would like to see Melvin explore this in the off-season, whether it's for Jurjens or another good young pitcher.

[nate82]

It seems like Atlanta and Milwaukee match up well as far as needs. Would like to see Melvin explore this in the off-season, whether it's for Jurjens or another good young pitcher.

Atlanta won't be trading any of its good young pitching and I would be leery of any of them they trade away. If anything they will trade Vazquez or Hudson before they trade any of their young pitching.

 

Atlanta has no use for Hart with Diaz playing as good as he has been playing. The Braves also have Hayward and Schafer who will probably be in the majors at one point in the year next year Schafer probably starting in AAA with Hayward. The only player the Brewers have that makes sense would be Gamel and I don't think the Braves are willing to give up any of their young pitching for Gamel.

 

So it would have to be a 1B type or a 3B type with Jones moving over to 1B. Maybe you could get Medlen for McGehee.

[Invader3K]

You may be right. It just goes to show how hard it is to trade for "good young pitching." The fact that the Matt Cain "meme" seems to have died around here points to that.

[dadofandrew]

ATL's LF and RF production is among the lowest in the NL...they will add offense.

[nate82]

ATL's LF and RF production is among the lowest in the NL...they will add offense.

Free agency will be the easiest place to add to that. Considering there is Holliday, Ankiel, Bay, and others available. Plus if the Braves exercise their buyout on Hudson that is $11m more than what they would have had this offseason to get a bat. Plus I believe Church will be better than he was with the Mets for the Braves next year. Hart doesn't really add much to the Braves than what they already have and they can get better players in FA than they probably could in a trade.

 

Plus I don't see why the Braves will trade either Jurjens or Vazquez. If anyone is going to be traded it will be Hudson or that $1m buyout will be exercised by the Braves. Trading a healthy pitcher and then relying on one that was injured the year before and who is an older pitcher is not a wise decision. I believe sports writers and other people are overlooking this. The Braves are not going to trade Vazquez or Jerjens and then rely on an injured pitcher in Hudson. It just doesn't make any sense at all.

[dadofandrew]

I would not say that, as Hudson has very minimal trade value due to his injury. Vazquez is the most likely to go because of his salary.

 

Ankiel got out 70% of the time this year, so he's nothing like Holliday or Bay, who are likely to be retained by their current teams.

[Never Outhustled]

ATL's LF and RF production is among the lowest in the NL...

Al, your using completely out of date numbers. Atlanta addressed this months ago, with success. They traded Jeff Francuer for Ryan Church. Church's career OPS is well above average. They benched Garret Anderson, who was getting 2/3 of the starts in LF as part of a platoon. They promoted his platoon partner, Matt Diaz, who has blossomed with the added playing time. He now has an 885 OPS.

 

Atlanta also has Jason Heyward, a RF who was just named Baseball America's Minor League Player of the Year, waiting in AAA.

 

Atlanta is very set in the OF corners.

[dadofandrew]

I do not look at Matt Diaz and Ryan Church and see impressive corner OF production. Average maybe, but not much more.

 

ATL is expected to trade pitching for offense this offseason. With McCann, Jones, and McLouth set, 1B is obvious, but other than that, LF/RF would appear next.

[derflotr]

I would do this trade in a second, but I'm not entirely sure Atlanta would approve it.

[pingman]

I'm a longtime Braves fan living in Wisconsin.....but I'm a Brewers fan too (1a & 1b)

 

Jurrjens (& Hanson) are nearly untouchable from the Braves perspective.....so Wren would counteroffer by asking for Fielder (which would also be crazy)

 

Realistically, the Brewers don't have what the Braves need to land a Jurrjens or Vazquez; this is not a knock on the Brewers.....HOWEVER, they could put together a package to land Lowe or Kawakami, but the price will still be considerable

 

Braves needs this offseason:

 

1) elite hitter at 1B (or 3B if Chipper is moved to 1B)....they'll probably prefer to resign LaRoche to keep 1B warm until Freddie Freeman is ready....

 

2) closer or setup man.... Soriano & Mike Gonzalez are free agents & IMHO the Braves will only resign one of them.... the Braves might be interested in Todd Coffey ....moving Lowe to closer is unlikely but shouldn't be ruled out

 

3) 3B of the future....area of weakness in the Braves organization, especially if Chipper retires after 2010 as rumored....Gamel or Lawrie