Macha and his players not on same page? (Latest: Macha to return with 2011 club option)

[yogallardo43]

I think there may be a thread on this already, but I couldn't find it. I just wrote about Macha on my blog. What do you guys think on Macha's future? I think he could be a good manager, but may have lost this team. I like his conservative attitude on the bases, but he has run this bullpen into the ground. How much of this seasons blame do you guys place on Macha? How would you rate him compared to Yost? Let's start an interesting discussion on what an ideal manager is.

 

Here's the link to my article

[JoeHova]

I thought all along that Macha would be gone after this season (because he was only signed to a 2 year deal). Nothing he's done so far this year has changed my opinion. I wonder who Doug has in mind as his replacement.

[brewmann04]

ANYONE BUT WILLIE

[Never Outhustled]

I was a Macha backer, but he wasn't the enlightened Manager I thought he was. He is the same old school, small minded, guy we've seen a million times before.

 

I could have an interest in Willie Randolph if he brought his old pitching coach, Rick Peterson, with him.

[monty57]

Macha started to lose me last offseason when he declared that signing a closer was much more important to this team than addressing starting pitching. He completely lost me during the whole Gamel debacle, and I see few qualities that make me think he's a good fit for the Brewers. He obviously prefers older players to younger players, which does not work for a mid-market team. He seems to have picked up a few "SABR-things" while in Oakland, but doesn't appear smart enough to know how to utilize them. For instance, players shouldn't steal bases unless they can be successful over 70% of the time. Okay, sounds good. How does Macha use this? He lets everyone steal at will for the first few games, and then shuts everyone down because they're around 50% for the team. We don't steal another base until Melvin made him. He uses sample sets that a third grader would know are inaccurate ("Well, I started Billy Hall today because he's hit .400 against this pitcher." In reality, it was a 2-for-5 day back when Hall knew how to hit). He intentionally walks at least one batter a game.

 

I could go on, but I'd probably just get myself mad, so I'll end by saying that if he's the Brewers' manager next year, I will seriously consider taking a break from watching baseball for the season.

[bklynbrewcrew]

Macha needs to go as soon as the season ends. We need a manager that values young players and doesnt consider playing Gamel as a "zim zam". His handling of Gamel and Escobar as well as his abuse of Gallardo are reasons for him not to come back.

 

Bobby Valentine is the man for the job and I hope Melvin is smart enough to make this happen. We need to stay away from Willie and Dale since I dont see them as much of an upgrade from Macha.

[bklynbrewcrew]

Another great example of why Macha needs to be fired; its sept 9th and we are hopelessly out of the race yet Macha thinks Counsell should start at third base while Gamel rides the bench. This was bad enough when it was happening in june but why would Counsell start over Gamel in a meaningless september game.

[greeg35]

I originally thought Macha was a good choice because of his offensive philosophies (or at least what I thought they were), don't give up outs, value OBP, etc... I do like how he handles the pitching staff, media, and his general attitude over Yost.

 

What I have learned that I don't like is the well-documented poor handling of bad players (Gamel in particular) and I HATE that he uses 10-20 AB samples to put together lineups against specific pitchers. That is just plain stupid.

 

I'm not sure who to blame Patterson's presence, ignoring Heether, and JJ's playing time on.

[monty57]

That goes along with his playing of Cattalanatto (no future with the team) nearly every day since Hart has been out instead of Gerut, who may be out starting CF next year. He finally started playing Gerut "when he sensed his bat was going to start heating up" a week or so ago.

[SeriesFinale]

I'll be pretty surprised if Macha gets fired, especially over something like not starting Gamel in June; I'll be less surprised if he steps down.

 

He just doesn't seem to be enjoying himself and doesn't have a big connection to the area or the organization, and at his age would probably be more interested in spending time with his grandkids than dealing with the pitching staff he was provided with and the circus sideshow atmosphere that seems to envelop this team these days.

[Baldkin]

Starting Hardy over Escobar at any point the rest of the year shouldn't happen, especially if his reasoning is, "Escobar hasn't faced him before."

 

Starting Counsell over Gamel shouldn't happen either. The season is over, its a travesty.

 

I can't fault his handling of the pitching staff, especially after watching Yost the last two years. But his utter refusal to play the younger guys when this team needed them to contribute --not just this year, but next year as well--is just unacceptable.

[SeriesFinale]

I would call Counsell over Gamel in September inexplicable, perhaps not truly fireable. Hardy over Escobar I can understand somewhat more since they're looking to move JJ (presumably) this off-season. I'm much more upset/confused with DM for how he handled that hot mess.

[MJLiverock]

Wasn't it just a week or so ago that Macha said he wanted to rest Counsell more so as not to ruin his good season? I remember thinking why on earth is a manager worrying about an aged utility infielder's stat line to close out the year when he said the comment.

 

Now Gamel is up and still not playing so I guess Macha is still worried about that old zim zam of playing Gamel over Counsell even when he himself said he wanted to rest Counsell to preserve his good season. But I guess not if he has to play the best hitting prospect the Brewers have in his place.

 

And heaven forbid Jason Kendall doesn't play 6/7 games. Is Macha really that unsure about what Kendall brings?, that enamored with him? scared of him? so sure of Rivera being worse? Insane? Stubborn? Why?

[trwi7]

Perfect example of why I want Macha gone just happened in the game.

 

It's bad enough that he's not playing Gamel when we're out of the race. But now he goes and uses Gamel as a pinch hitter to lead off the inning. LaRussa sees this and goes to get lefty Trevor Miller. Macha counters that move by replacing Gamel with Bourgeois. Seriously, you're losing 5-0, you're out of the playoff race and Gamel has no noticeable platoon split. Let him bat, you moron!

[yogallardo43]

Perfect example of why I want Macha gone just happened in the game.

 

It's bad enough that he's not playing Gamel when we're out of the race. But now he goes and uses Gamel as a pinch hitter to lead off the inning. LaRussa sees this and goes to get lefty Trevor Miller. Macha counters that move by replacing Gamel with Bourgeois. Seriously, you're losing 5-0, you're out of the playoff race and Gamel has no noticeable platoon split. Let him bat, you moron!

Great point twri7, I couldn't understand what he is doing at all. Seriously, Bourgeois for Gamel. That's just bad.

 

I just posted an article talking about this.

[jhart05]

I'm thinking about not watching/listening to another game 'till I see Gamel 3B and Escobar SS, in the lineup at the same time. It would be nice to also see Rivera C, in there, but I'm not going to push it, because I do still enjoy listening to Uke and want to listen to at least one more game this year.

 

The season is over, Macha/Melvin!! Play the kids!!

[Eddiehitsthefoulpole]

I seem to remember something in Macha's press conference to announce his hiring which led me to believe that he some expertise in evaluating young talent. I don't believe that we have seen that. I am going to say something I said after the 2007 season. That is we may as well fire him now (or after the season) instead of firing him during next season. We don't want to have one manager set up the roster and the pitching roles, and then ask someone else to fix our problems during the season. I see signs that Ken is lacking in credibility in our dugout. I also am not sure that I trust Doug to hire a manager. He has hired Johnny Oates, Jerry Narron, Ned Yost, and Ken Macha. That makes him 1 for 4 with a 3 manager slump (although I should give Ned credit for bringing professionalism back to the team). If Doug gets to hire the next manager then Attanasio needs to put some limitations on him: no former catchers, no one who he ever had a beer with in the 20th century, and no one who has ever been employed by the Texas Rangers.

[SeriesFinale]

If Doug gets to hire the next manager then Attanasio needs to put some limitations on him: no former catchers, no one who he ever had a beer with in the 20th century, and no one who has ever been employed by the Texas Rangers.

For the most part (I believe he played a few games as catcher), Macha falls within these limitations.

Again, I'm not necessarily on-board with him not starting Gamel and Escobar as much as possible (I understand they want to get JJ some looks), and today's decision to switch out Gamel was pretty inexplicable in the situation, but to me, the true storyline of this season's disappointment was not written by Macha.

 

 

 

[bucks2281]

It's not just that he PH'd for Gamel. Hasn't Gamel stated that he sees the ball better against lefties? That was just ridiculous. As far as I'm concerned, the rest of 09 isn't about winning, it's about player development.

[logan82]

Fire Macha or don't fire him. It will make little difference as long as Melvin is hiring the guy. Macha was the lesser of 3 evils during the hiring process.

[thablingster]

The more of Macha I've seen, the less I have liked. The playing time issues for the young guys (Gamel, Escobar) have already been mentioned so I won't continue to bang that drum. It does appear as though Macha is slightly hesitant to play call-ups consistently or give them ample opportunities as referenced in previous threads about Gamel and the infamous comment he made about how he decided to start Carlos Villanueva out of the bullpen instead of Tim Dillard because he didn't feel Dillard's secondary pitches translated well to getting out big league hitters as a starter.

 

One of the biggest things which I find frustrating is his overall demeanor. As a young team one might think that having a manager who never shows that they are upset or angry outwardly may be a good thing, but one time I'd just like to see him go out there like Bobby Cox or Ned Yost and let someone have it. That is one of the best things Yost brought to the team is he stuck up for his teams and his players to a fault (it also led to short-sighted decisions and ultimately his demise as a manager, but that is neither here nor there). Even if a call is obviously wrong it seems as though Macha goes out there, gives it a half hearted effort and returns to the dugout. That has to have some tangible effect on the players. I think as a young team having a guy who can show that passion and fire in an appropriate situation might actually be a positive thing.

 

The fact our pitching staff is in shambles isn't really Macha's fault, but at this point we should be playing for 2010 and starting the kids. I realize maybe there is some internal pressure to start guys like Patterson and Gerut to see if they have a role on the 2010 team, but Gamel and Escobar really should be starting pretty much every day from here on out.

[Invader3K]

So, I have to wonder: Is Doug Melvin not stepping in and preventing some of these moves in order to simply give Ken Macha more rope to hang himself, anticipating an inevitable firing soon after game #162? Or is he just completely oblivious to the nonsensical moves his manager is making at this point in a lost season? It's a real head scratcher to me.

[DannoMac21]

I hope you guys saw some of the comments in the recent MJS article, made me absolutely sick to my stomach...

 

http://www.jsonline.com/sports/brewers/58248062.html

 

Macha has to tread the fine line of still trying to win games while developing players and looking to the future. He did not start newly recalled third baseman Mat Gamel against the Cardinals because he said Gamel struggled at the plate in the second half at Class AAA Nashville and Macha wants to see the young player in batting practice for a couple of days.

 

"You'd certainly like to get him and his home-run potential bat in there, but he didn't have a good second half," said Macha. "I'd like to get him back in a groove before I put him back out there."

 

General manager Doug Melvin said he hasn't asked Macha to play certain players and indicated Macha shouldn't have to feel he has to win games to save his own skin.

 

"He's got a contract for next year, so I don't think that goes into his thinking," said Melvin. "I haven't ordered him to play guys at this point. We might sit down in a little bit, but I said we're trying to win games and gain some experience."

 

"To gain some experience here is fine. There may be a point where I'll say I'd like to see somebody play a little bit more. But it's not there yet."

 

Is this a joke?!

[Invader3K]

Is this a joke?!

 

Certainly seems to that way at this point. The team in general, I mean.

[AJAY]

Bill Michaels of WTMJ is reporting that there is a lot of unhappiness with Ken Macha inside the clubhouse.

 

http://www.620wtmj.com/sp...llmichaels/58492182.html