What is the difference between AA and AAA

[nate82]

Other than AAA having one more A than AA. On a serious note though is there any difference in talent between AA and AAA?

 

I feel as though AAA is more of a place for depth on the major league team roster than it is about developing players. I also believe it is where teams put their troubled young players at (Manny Parra, Clay Buchholz, etc....). The talent in AAA feels more like fringe major league players than it does of a place where the top prospects are at. If the top prospects are in AAA that usually means they are about to be called up not there to work on anything really.

 

Is this kind of thinking correct about AAA?

[TheCrew07]

AAA is a place to stash depth, and it's full pitchers like Chris Cody who know how to pitch but need to prove they can consistently get hitters out. Hard throwing guys who don't throw enough strikes also get stuck in AAA while teams wait for them to figure it out. It's a different style of pitching and the position players are guys that know how to play game.

 

 

What it isn't though is a proving ground, the litmus test for prospects is the jump from A+ to AA. Handle AA, especially the SL, and I'm jumping on the bandwagon. Prospects are in AAA for 2 reasons, service time and seasoning. Everyone else is fringe MLB quality trying to prove they belong.

[kramnoj]

My eyes were first opened to this difference in 96 or 97 when Peter Gammons was talking about the advancement of Vladimir Guerrerro. He said that the Expos probabably wouldn't move him up to AAA, because it was filled with bitter has-beens and never-would-bes (he was speaking about that particular team, not AAA in general). I just looked him up and Vlad has never been at AAA according to b-ref.

[nate82]

Is it fair to say that a player jumping from AA to the Majors is no bigger of a jump than a player going from AAA to the Majors?

[CheezWizHed]

While I agree that AA and AAA are pretty close to the same level, it still isn't equal. There are players that jump from AA to MLB, but very few. I can't think of the last Brewer to do that (and stick in the MLB).

 

Why:

1) In AA, you have a group of players that won't survive the jump from A+ to AA. That group makes BAs and ERAs look better for the rest.

2) In AAA, most of the future MLB stars will still course through AAA. Some won't stay long (Braun), but some stay the whole season (Fielder). Plus, all the AAAA players are there also. They tend to be lower talent (generalization), but smarter players.

 

To me, the biggest talent jumps are from AAA to MLB (simply because the best players stay there), then A+ to AA. But AA to AAA is a talent jump, no matter how you look at it.

[JohnBriggs12]

CheezWizhed,

 

The Brewers haven't jumped guys directly from AA, but their top guys have spent very little time at AAA. If you succeed at AA and you are considered a prospect, AAA is for just biding time until a spot opens up. It's also a repository for ex-major leaguers that haven't quite exhausted all hope for a return. The real proving ground is AA where the only difference between it and AAA is experience. Success there by age 24 and you are almost certain to see the major leagues at some point unless you bomb terribly in AAA. Failure in AA for any but the top draft picks (who get multiple chances), and you're looking at a career in the Northern League or some other indy league for experienced players or another career entirely. Non prospect types have to prove themselves at every level to move up and some do all the way to AAA where they still have to prove themselves to get a major league shot.

 

The jump to the majors is huge, whether it's from AA or AAA, but jumping from AA isn't much bigger than it is from AAA.

[jjfanec]

I agree with the difference not seeming too big and JohnBriggs makes a great point about how some of the Brewers young guys have not spent much time in AAA. There are obviously players who don't continue success in AAA. I look at Will Inman who has struggled mightily as AAA (actually he got demoted recently) after pitching very well at AA and you also have guys like Chris Cody and other soft tossers who seem to struggle once they hit AAA more than AA. Angel Salome has been an interesting case as well, because I think most of us expected him to continue his torrid hitting in AAA but he has been much less of a power hitter up there, although injuries seem to be a big factor with him. However, the jump to the majors is so big. Very few guys can be like Braun and Longoria and rip the cover off the ball right away or Yo and pitch very well...most guys struggle at first like Weeks, Homer Bailey, David Price (as a starter), etc. The learning curve is high.

[DHonks]

The Brewers have tended to view AAA as a necessary stepping stone to the big leagues, whereas other organizations (like FLA, for example) tend to call up the best pitcher from AA/AAA.

[TheCrew07]

I look at Will Inman who has struggled mightily as AAA (actually he got demoted recently) after pitching very well at AA and you also have guys like Chris Cody and other soft tossers who seem to struggle once they hit AAA more than AA.

I'm not sure Inman is a very good example to make a case on, this was his third time through AA, got bumped to AAA and stunk, then sent back down.

 

The competition is a little bit better in AAA, but I think it depends on the perspective you choose to look at it from. Pitching wise you're working against mostly veteran players with some MLB experience, those guys are going to challenge you on every single pitch, that trend starts at AA, and continues as they move up. From a position standpoint they aren't really facing more talented pitchers, they are just facing a different style of pitcher. Starting pitchers like Gulin, Cody, DeFilice, etc who don't throw exceedingly hard but understand how to work both sides of the plate and mix their pitches well are going to be in AAA, as are hard throwers like Sarfate or Pena who are trying to harness their stuff will be there pitching out of the pen. Many players and coaches have mentioned that AA pitchers probably throw harder, but AAA pitchers will pitch better (a couple out of the Brewer organization this year if the various audio interviews linked). AAA is a good stepping stone, but a player really has to flop at AAA to never get a chance in MLB if they are a legit prospect. If a player succeeds at AA, they are going to see MLB time at some point, even if it's just a cup of coffee.

[CheezWizHed]

JohnBriggs12[/b]]The jump to the majors is huge, whether it's from AA or AAA, but jumping from AA isn't much bigger than it is from AAA.

It sounds like for the most part, everyone is arguing on the same side. The main difference seems to be some think AA to AAA is a 1 inch step, while others a 4 inch step (compared to a 4 foot step to the MLB).

 

I thought TheCrew summed up AAA pitching very well.

 

I was curious about the service time of our MLB squad at AAA, so I did some digging:

Partial season at AAA: Braun, Gallardo, Hardy, Gamel, Parra, and Weeks - Gamel

Single season at AAA: Fielder (blocked by O)

Multiple at AAA(non injury): Hart, Hall, Villanueva, Stetter, Iribarren

 

It seems that the Brewers still use AAA as a proving ground before you get to the MLB. If you succeed there, we move you up in a short manner (unless blocked).

 

But there are some prospects that struggle at AAA. This season:

Cody: Small sample, but was dominating AA and under

Salome: Improving as the season goes along, but again dominated AA (hopefully coach is correct and this is only injury related)

 

I really couldn't recall any high prospect that succeeded at AA and dropped to be a low/non-prospect at AAA. I'm sure they are there but not many.

 

Conclusion: The step is small. The size of the step is semantics.

[JJHardy7]

The Brewers haven't jumped guys directly from AA, but their top guys have spent very little time at AAA.

Examples? Guys like Braun and Yo aren't your everyday guys. You could also argue that JJ and Rickie were rushed and struggled somewhat because of it. If you're great, you probably don't play more than a year in AAA...but most guys play one season there or so. Also, it depends what you mean by 'spent very little time'. If you classify that as a year or so, I'd agree. If you're talking more like two months, I'd disagree.

[PlayerHader]

JJHardy7, your post seems to validate the quoted statement rather than make any argument against it as it seems you are attempting.

[TheCrew07]

Fielder was up and down, didn't spend a full season in AAA. Parra didn't spend a full season in AAA, nor have Gamel and Escobar this season. Hardy skipped AAA entirely. The only Brewer player who spent significant time in AAA was Hart, and I still think the team going with Mench over him was garbage in year 2.

[CheezWizHed]

Fielder only spent the interleague games in MLB. Otherwise, he was in AAA the full year. Granted, it was only because he was blocked.

 

Hardy had 26 games at AAA. If we had another option at SS, he would have had more.

 

At the time of writing, Escobar was in AAA (well, I hadn't heard anyway...). Some would argue he could use the full year.

 

And I listed Parra and Gamel as partial years in AAA.

 

Hardy is an interesting case in this arguement. I seem to remember this discussion happening back around the time he was called up (why play at AAA, he hit at AA and we need him now). Too bad, my time machine is broke so we can't go back and leave him in AAA longer to see if it would have helped. http://forum.brewerfan.net/images/smilies/smile.gif