He's Baaaack! Vargas to MIL for Vinny Rottino

[SoCal Brew Crew Fan]

I understand all the frustration and the total irony of the situation, but to call out DM on this is silly. It's tough to turn on a dime and go from buyer (which we were 10 days ago) to seller. It's just not going to happen. They tried, it didn't work out, the team fell apart...it is what it is. Catching the Cubs and Cards at this point is futile IMO. I'd rather try and sell at this point, but there really aren't a great deal of options. They will deal Hardy, but will likely get a better package over the offseason. Hoffman would be really tough to part with from a fan standpoint. Cam is the only real option, but they may want to bring him back so I doubt it happens. If they can't get a 3/4 or better starter for 2010, why bother.

 

Whether it's Vargas or any of the other sub-standard AAAA guys with no future that we have it just doesn't matter. There are no real options.

[naivin]

Sometimes one would think we were 10 games under .500 with no shot at the post-season. The facts are we are .500 and only 4 games out of first place with basically 3/5 of our starting rotation hurt or a huge dissapointment all year.

We have no shot at the post season. Mathematically, maybe, but we will not be within 5 games of either the Cubs or Cards at the end of the year. This was a trade of necessity, ala David Bell.

[endaround]

Keep in mind the only players they could sell and would have trouble getting through waivers are Counsell and perhaps Lopez so its not like 3 pm means then end of trades.

[naivin]

It really isnt Melvin's fault.

This is absurd. If it isn't Melvin's fault, who's is it? To suggest their pitching woes are simply a function of injury is silly. Suppan was bad well before he got hurt. Bush is a solid pitcher and no doubt that hurt them. Para's ineffectiveness cannot be considered a surprise. A disappointment maybe, but not a surprise. The fact is, the Brewers went into this season with their fingers crossed, and anyone who thought they had a playoff capable rotation was fooling themselves. As I have pointed out previously, even with Sabathia, this is the second consecutive season they have been badly caught with their pants down late in the season where pitching is concerned. If that isn't Melvin's fault, who's fault is it?

[DougJones43]

I'll be honest. I just don't like Vargas, or watching him pitch. He rarely makes it past 5 innings. He pitches at a snail's pace. We gave up Doug Davis to get him and Estrada, and now ironically have traded to get Vargas back (after releasing him) because we couldn't get Davis back. People claimed he was a good clutch pitcher during the first couple months of 2007 because he somehow managed to keep his ERA respectable by miraculously escaping bases-loaded-no-out jams a few times. Finally, his luck ran out and he was as bad as expected.

 

If we had obtained somebody else of similar quality, I might not be as annoyed as I am with having it be Vargas. Although I still wouldn't really be happy with these kind of garbage-shuffling, spinning-our-tires type of transactions either way.

[BrewCityUnit]

Naivin, that is your opinion that we won't make the playoffs this year but you speak as it is a fact. What were the Colorado Rockies chances of making the playoffs two years ago. Things can happen and as a fan I want to stay in the race as long as possible....and this move helps us do that. Our August schedule gives us a great chance to be there in September and that is all I am asking for.

[joepepsi]

Wow, a guy leaves for lunch and a 75 post topic magically appears!

 

There's nothing wrong with this trade at all. This isn't about a playoff run; they need bullpen help and Vargas isn't terrible. At least not every appearance. If they're not getting Halladay, then I don't want a trade of good prospects for some maudlin pitcher like Randy Wolfe who won't take them to the playoffs anyway.

 

How cool would it be for Vinny if he makes the playoff roster as the 25th man and winds up with a ring? Good luck Vinny!

 

If this trade was done any of the other 11 months of the year, everyone here would be on board, figuring what can it hurt and depth is always good in pitching.

[jwill535]

Why do I have the feeling that the Dodgers process of picking Rottino was similar to having only 5 tickets and you have to decide between the plastic spider ring or the comb.

[SoCal Brew Crew Fan]

I'd be awfully surprised if Rottino ever plays for the Dodgers. They were going to DFA Vargas anyway after they acquired Sherrill.

[wallus]

is it possible that they just brought him in for long relief? Doug Melvin would be a totaly moran to think that Vargas is gonna help us out at all as a starter. This is a total joke if he is supposed to be our savior

I enjoy irony. I do not enjoy watching Claudio Vargas however.

[craigharmann]

they need bullpen help

Yeah, but aren't there guys in the minors that are comparable to Vargas? Or better?

[saget]

Hurray for 5 hour games!

[JoeHova]

is it possible that they just brought him in for long relief? Doug Melvin would be a totaly moran to think that Vargas is gonna help us out at all as a starter. This is a total joke if he is supposed to be our savior

I enjoy irony. I do not enjoy watching Claudio Vargas however.

http://www.waveflux.net/wp-content/uploads/2008/07/morans.png

[mls4]

I enjoy irony. I do not enjoy watching Claudio Vargas however.

Of current Brewer pitchers with over 70 Brewer innings pitched, Vargas has the best winning percentage and the worst ERA. Now that's irony.

[Brewcrewin07]

Wow!!! Doug wasn't lying when he said he was doing everything he could to improve the ball club. This is an amazing deal, one that will certainly lead this team to the playoffs and beyond this year. Doug is just smarter then every other GM in baseball. All these other teams are out there making deals that their fans are pretty sure will improve their ball clubs and their teams's playoff chances, and DM quietly swoops in and steals someone like Claudio to make all the other contenders quiver in their boots. Thank You Doug!!! Wow, this is just incredible....So THESE are the kinds of deals he works until Midnight to make sure he gets done huh?? I am totally impressed. You just made the rest of this season completely enjoyable. I will be sitting on the edge of my seat with every pitch Vargas and Burns throw as members of our starting rotation, watching them lead us to the playoffs for only the 2nd time in 26 years!!! I can't wait, I am so excited.

 

I am sure Ryan is so very proud of you Doug. he wanted pitching help awhile ago, but you have gone above and beyond the call of duty in making this deal. Wow.

[Roscoe Chill]

BrewCityUnit: You're really missing the entire point on what a lot of people are trying to say. You're right, they are still in it. But if they think they're in it, then make a freaking move! Don't necessarily mortgage the future, but mortgage SOME of that future.

 

I can't believe you're actually saying that trading for Claudio Vargas = trying to win now. The trade says the exact opposite to me. It says that they aren't good enough to make a trade where you have to give up something of possible future value to get something that is obviously valuable NOW. It says that they aren't bad enough to sell in their eyes.

 

So, what do you have left? A .500 team with no shot at the post season, and not exactly a rosier picture in their weak areas for next year either.

 

Deuce, or get off the pot. Claudio Vargas 'aint helping.

 

EDIT: And Fatter Than Joey is funny, and really not all that hard to understand.

[bjkrautk]

they need bullpen help

Yeah, but aren't there guys in the minors that are comparable to Vargas? Or better?

 

I'm sure there are.....there just aren't guys in the minors that would require less to acquire than a AAAA-level* utility infielder who is clearly not in the club's long-term future.

 

(*- in Rottino's defense, he's never had enough time with the big club to prove he's not just a AAAA player. However, if the Brewers organization thought better of him, he would have received more than 1 plate appearance during the September run last year. He also wouldn't have been DFA'd and granted minor league free agency back in February.)

 

While having the Racine native in the system was a nice story, his long-term value to the franchise is minimal. Vargas, while not a great pitcher, has pitched well for the Brewers in the past, and has effective control (about a 2:1 K/BB rate over the last 3 seasons, including his time as a starter in Milwaukee). Ironically, if Rottino had been DFA'd back in 2008 to free up room on the 40-man roster, Vargas may have been the one to stick around in the Brewers organization (and probably would have made the rotation over Burns). I don't remember there being a lot of collective joy at letting a decent (albeit-back-of-the-rotation) starting pitcher walk during that off-season. If he can come in, and stretch out to the point that he's pitching 6 mediocre innings (4.5-5.5 ERA), that will be better than what we've been getting out of the back of the rotation now. I don't exactly see the downside here.

[RU Rah Rah]

Before the signing of Looper, I can remember having an extended discussion here about the quality/durability of the rotation as it then stood (Gallardo, Manny, Bush, Suppan, and maybe McClung or Villy). I, for one, refused to believe that all five of those guys were going to come close to making 30+ starts each -- it seemed totally implausible. The acquisition of Looper mitigated that problem somewhat, but, even then, you were were looking at (roughly) the five above + Looper each having to make 25 starts each -- which, at least to me, still seemed implausible way back in April. The fact that the team is now scrambling to grapple with this rotation depth problem (in the persons of Mike Burns and Vargas) frustrates me because it was foreseeable before the season even began.

[TracyThom]

Wow!!! Doug wasn't lying when he said he was doing everything he could to improve the ball club. ...

 

I am sure Ryan is so very proud of you Doug. he wanted pitching help awhile ago, but you have gone above and beyond the call of duty in making this deal. Wow.

Not a personal attack, but your sarcasm is getting very old.

 

My feelings echo mostly everyone else's here. I don't mind that we picked up a 5.00 ERA stop-gap. I'm just mad it's Claudio Vargas. He was my least favorite Brewer a few years back, and here he is again. This move makes me miss Matt Kinney.

[Roscoe Chill]

I don't exactly see the downside here.

Because there really isn't one. People are irritated about the lack of upside...none. This is a warm body, nothing kind of move that might help get to a .500 finish.

[sheethead]

Wow!!! Doug wasn't lying when he said he was doing everything he could to improve the ball club. ...

 

I am sure Ryan is so very proud of you Doug. he wanted pitching help awhile ago, but you have gone above and beyond the call of duty in making this deal. Wow.

Not a personal attack, but your sarcasm is getting very old.

 

I just wanted to say I enjoyed it Brewcrew. I am completely underwhelmed, much like how a Rangers fan must feel right now.

[logan82]

SeriesFinale wrote:

We need a facepalm smiley around here.

How is this? http://www.runemasterstudios.com/graemlins/images/doh2.gif

[SeriesFinale]

Aha, you've just opened a whole new world for me.

[Teatoe993]

No disrespect to Vargas, but the question I keep asking myself is "Why?". Why were time and resources used to make this trade happen when it does absolutely nothing for this team? The team has not been improved present or future. If we're gonna throw in the towel and focus on 2010, do it. Trade away the pieces that we can't use in the future for pieces that have a chance for the future. Try to finish in the lower half of teams so we don't have to give as much if we sign any FAs and to also improve our draft status. If we still think we have a chance to win the division, show it. Unload some prospects for a SP that will actually make a difference.

We are no better off with Vargas on the roster than we were without him. And he doesn't help us at all in 2010. He will not help us any more this year than some AAA scrub that we could have called up. Personally, I would rather have given a chance to some of our minor leaguers just to see what they can do at the big league level. Vargas will make .9 million this year. Pedro Martinez signed for 1 million. Seriously, I'd rather Melvin just roll the dice and try to sign Byrd and/or Glavine for that kind of money.

[BrewCityUnit]

NDOG44, give me a realistic move they should have made then if you think it is so easy?