When is the last time Estrada has thrown a base stealer out? (merged: JB12's 'unnamed scout' comment on Johnny)

[jeffy]

I thought it might be about time this thread had a serious answer, and the answer is this past Thursday when Estrada threw out Chris Young of the D-backs.

 

(Meanwhile he has 6 walks on the season, the lastest was June 26.)

 

Estrada's CS for 2007:

 

7/19 Chris Young (Gallardo)

6/23 David DeJesus (Bush)

6/15 Luis Castillo (Vargas)

5/26 Rob Bowen (Shouse, why was a catcher trying to steal 3rd?)

5/23 Russell Martin (Villanueva)

5/23 Jeff Kent (Villanueva, 2 in a game! this was also 3rd base)

5/4 Adam LaRoche (Vargas)

4/28 Carlos Lee (Bush)

4/23 Derrek Lee (Vargas, 3rd base)

 

2 more CS attributed to Estrada were actually pickoffs by the pitcher.

 

This data is about two months old, so I thought it would be nice to bring it up to date. So let's see, Estrada now has 11 CS whereas two months ago he had...oh, hmm 11...can that be right, I guess so. Sorry, for the interuption, no need to update after-all.

[crewcrazy]

According to Yost Estrada made a couple of good thgrows last night. Just goes to show you how clueless Ned really is. Estrada is the worst defensive catcher that I have ever seen and coupled with his lack of power and .300 OBP is an albatross for this team. Bringing him back next year would be completely unacceptable.

Estrada's throws are usually in the general vicinity of 2nd base...the problem is that the basestealer is coming up from his slide by the time the ball gets there.

 

[twobrewers]

Opponents have stolen 35 consecutive bases on Estrada, who last nabbed a runner on June 23 (Kansas City's David DeJesus). For the season, he has thrown out six of 76 runners (7.9%), by far the lowest percentage in the league.

From JSonline.com on 9/15

 

That is HORRIBLE!

[jeffy]

Opponents have stolen 35 consecutive bases on Estrada, who last nabbed a runner on June 23 (Kansas City's David DeJesus). For the season, he has thrown out six of 76 runners (7.9%), by far the lowest percentage in the league.

From JSonline.com on 9/15

 

That is HORRIBLE!

So the July 19 CS listed above was an error...I checked game day log and it was in fact a pick-off. A couple others must also have been pick-offs, since he has only thrown out 6. The amazing thing is that more teams have not done what the Reds did yesterday...just run with any one who has any speed at all.

[RockCoCougars]

You better believe teams will run like crazy on Estrada for the rest of the season. Simply put, regardless of their investment in him, the Brewers cannot afford to play Estrada anymore this season. Everytime a runner reaches base they will usually be a base hit from scoring within a few pitches. Got to think the pitchers are losing concentration on the hitters while he's catching because they are focusing on the runners too much trying to hold them extra close.

[Fatter than Joey]

Got to think the pitchers are losing concentration on the hitters while he's catching because they are focusing on the runners too much trying to hold them extra close.

 

Yep -- esp. our off-speed pitchers. I'm sure we will see more of the same this weekend -- I assume Miller catches today.

[JohnBriggs12]

Estrada has 48 RBI. That is about 30 less than is needed to overcome his defensive and baserunning issues. Over the course of this season, that's enough to keep this team out of the postseason.

 

He's been horrible. I don't want him back for 08.

[TooLiveBrew]

At least he's an easy guy to root for - never gives you any reason to think he's not giving it his all

[jeffy]

Somewhere it was mentioned that Estrada has had a hamstring injury. Is it possible that this might be the reason for his inability to throw anyone out? His career stats, excluding 2007 have him throwing out nearly 27%. If he is hurt, it could be this injury is making it take longer to get up and also affecting the speed of the ball when he throws.

If it is an injury, this might be a reason to let him come back next year. But, in any case, now that the Reds have exposed his inability to throw, he needs to do a lot of sitting the rest of this year.

[JohnBriggs12]

This was mentioned by Astros telecast team last night. They quoted a scout commenting on Estrada:

 

"He gets fatter and lazier every year".

 

Gentlemen, that's our starting catcher.

[sweepscc]

After watching Estrada for a year I'm inclined to believe him. I actually long for Damian Miller. Miller definitely calls a better game and can beat a pig in a foot race.

[twobrewers]

This was mentioned by Astros telecast team last night. They quoted a scout commenting on Estrada:

 

"He gets fatter and lazier every year".

I didn't even know I was a scout!

[dadofandrew]

And yet every game, he makes several nice plays blocking balls in the dirt. His cERA is the same as Miller's, so if indeed Damian calls a better game and/or throws better (either of which, I could believe), it does not save the team any runs.

 

I see most of this as simply being a reaction to Estrada being husky, which may or may not be related to his lingering injury (I would have to imagine if he is not running all out, he also is not working out as he normally would).

[Patrick425]

I have been a Brewer Fan for about 30 years now. I can not think of a player in a Brewer uniform that I disliked as much as Estrada with the possible exception of Sheffield. Yes, we had guys like Hammonds who was injury prone and not a very good player and Chuckie Carr who was laughable and A. Sanchez who was a bust and countless prospects that never saw the light of MLB, but something about Estrada just really irritates me. I see no hustle. I don't see any real concern with him that he can not throw a runner out. He completely lacks any level of intensity. I'm just glad that he is not under a LT contract and I pray that the Brewer front office sends him on his merry way.

[homer]

The actual quote was from the Sporting News and it was:

 

"He gets fatter by the day and lazier by the minute"

[Fatter than Joey]

And yet every game, he makes several nice plays blocking balls in the dirt.

 

1.) He is fat and slow. He blocks a lot of things.

 

2.) Carlos Lee blocked a ball in the OF last night, it doesn't mean he isn't a sloppy/lazy fielder.

 

Estrada is about the worst Catcher in the NL handling pitches I have seen in a long time, he backhands everything and rarely tries to move his body to get in front of the ball.

 

His cERA is the same as Miller's, so if indeed Damian calls a better game and/or throws better (either of which, I could believe), it does not save the team any runs.

 

I don't think anyone here thinks that Miller is a stellar catcher at this point of his career. Comparing Estrada to Miller doesn't make either of them better compared to the league.

 

Estrada's FRAA is -7 -- so clearly overall, he is a negative on our team defensively.

 

I see most of this as simply being a reaction to Estrada being husky,

 

Seriously?

 

There are a lot of slams on Estrada on this board -- rarely does criticism focus around his gravitational pull -- He has a WARP of 1.8 -- which just isn't good.

 

which may or may not be related to his lingering injury

 

It is more probable that his injury is a result of being out-of-shape and less than diligent manner in taking care of himself.

 

The Brewers fanboard's are not the first to call out Estrada

[bucksman4]

Just goes to show you how clueless Ned really is.

I don't think it's cluelessness on Ned's part. You very rarely ever hear him call out players, even when they're performing badly. He gives the media the ol' "hang with 'em" line. In Yost's mind, he probably doesn't see any point in calling out Estrada for his lack of throwing runners out because what will that really do to help the situation?? It's not going to all of a sudden give Estrada a rocket arm and awesome accuracy. It is what it is. If the Brewers are unhappy with Estrada both offensively and defensively, you'll know where they stand when he IS or IS NOT on next year's roster.