Jarrod Washburn- Latest: Beat Reporters for both teams think they're talking

[Hate those Rodents]

My bad on Clement. Thought he was younger and could play catcher more legitimately. Might still be a good "buy low" guy to have in the deal if our scouts like him and see something. I guess I'd take Green out of my proposed deal, or just not go after Clement in the deal.

[Never Outhustled]

X ellence wrote:

---

The M's are terrible in LF. Hart would be a fit for them.

Not really. They just called up Michael Saunders.

I was wondering when they'd finally do that. No matter, we're better off keeping Hart since we don't have a viable replacement. Washburn for prospects, keep it simple.

[southpaw121505]

Hardy and Salome alone should net those 3.

[liveforoctober]

General statement time.

 

Melvin has made a few blunders (DD for Estrada, Linebrink in some opinions, etc) ... but for the most part has a clean and possibly glowing trade resume as the Brewers GM.

 

But I just have a bad feeling about him dealing with Jack Z... one of those "student becomes the master" situations. For some reason I can see Jack stealing an extra player we don't have to give up... or getting a free upgrade on a player.

 

I love being aggressive, but let's stay smart!

[SeriesFinale]

But I just have a bad feeling about him dealing with Jack Z... one of those "student becomes the master" situations. For some reason I can see Jack stealing an extra player we don't have to give up... or getting a free upgrade on a player.

Yeah, I mentioned last night that I was nervous about this too: Jack Z is pretty much the last GM I'd want the Brewers dealing with, especially if prospects are involved.

[pete]

I don't know. Z and DM have the advantage of being able to discuss the entire situation openly and honestly without worrying about leaks or BSing. The team has a lot of quality prospects who aren't hyped. I'm hoping, perhaps irrationally, that Z can put together a deal that includes a lot of nice prospects due to his knowledge of the system without taking premium guys.

[Pudster13]

Hate those Rodents wrote:

What about Hardy/Salome/Green/Fredrickson for Washburn/Morrow/Clement?

I actually think this would be a good deal for both teams if Clement could catch full time, which I think he can.

 

I think getting Morrow would be the key to this deal for the Brewers. He has a much higher ceiling than Fredrickson.

 

The Brewers system is loaded with offensive talent. It is very devoid of pitching talent at this time.

 

This deal would allow us to keep cost-controled blue chippers Escobar, Gamel and Lawrie, while also netting us a stop gap starting pitcher that we're deperate for, a potential #1 starting pitching prospect, and a potential solid hitting catcher to backup then replace Kendall.

 

Hardy is replaced by Escobar.

Salome is replaced by Clement (I personally don't believe Salome can become an everyday MLB catcher)

Taylor Green is a sold B-level 3B prospect, but if Gamel can't cut it at 3B, McGehee is an everyday option for a while.

Fredrickson was a supplemental 1st round reach by the Brewers and has the massive control problems that usually kill pitching prospects.

 

I actually think the the Mariners may reject this offer.

[SeriesFinale]

Interesting thought from USS Mariner last night:

 

By the way, don't be surprised if Carlos Villanueva is coming back to Seattle in any deal the M's make with the Brewers. He's falling out of favor in Milwaukee, thanks to a 6.18 ERA in relief, but his FIP is just 4.22. His fastball is underwhelming, but he throws a bunch of off-speed stuff and has solid command, and he's got experience in the rotation. He's the kind of major league arm that the M's would like to get to replace Washburn, and one that the Brewers would actually be willing to give up.

[wibadgers23]

Ken Rosenthal's take-

 

Few know the Brewers' farm system better than Mariners general manager Jack Zduriencik, who drafted and signed many of Milwaukee's top young players in his previous job as the team's scouting director.

Zduriencik surely would love to obtain shortstop Alcides Escobar in a trade for lefty Jarrod Washburn, and it's reasonable to think that he might even include righty Brandon Morrow to pull off such a deal.

The Brewers, though, likely would be reluctant to trade Escobar for two months of Washburn, a potential free agent, and the uncertain future of Morrow, who is back at Class AAA trying to re-establish himself as a starter.

Brewers shortstop J.J. Hardy is a free agent after next season, and the team has made no effort to extend his contract, according to a major-league source.

Therefore, the Brewers will be very careful about trading Escobar, knowing that without him, they could be forced into the market for a shortstop in 15 months.

http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/9858776/MLB-trade-deadline-buzz:-Monday's-edition

[Hate those Rodents]

From Rosenthal ..... http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/9858776/MLB-trade-deadline-buzz:-Monday's-edition

 

Uhhhhh, why is it that I can see Melvin panic and give away Escobar for these two. Please give them JJ plus instead Doug, unless JZ thinks he's overrated and doesn't want to pay him either.

[Bench Coach]

Hardricourt has a new blog up saying the same thing. It may take Escobar and that would be too much. I am starting to think that nothing gets done. Also starting to think we should see what we can get for Cameron and Hoffman (and maybe Hardy) and restock for next year. I agree with many others here...we are not one or even two players away. We need a top starter (or two) another bullpen arm and I would still like to see another lefty, high OBP. hitter.

 

As much as I would like the Brewers to make it this year, odds aren't good. Maybe if we get hot in August we still have a chance, but this is not a World Series Team. Lets go with what we have and look toward filling needs for next year, while trying to get the current team going enough to get close.

[MarquesJohnson2000]

I don't have a good feeling about this... what if Mark A. orders Doug to do whatever it takes to get Washburn?

[Hate those Rodents]

This would be the second time in two years that DM trades a player he calls "untouchable" (LaPorta last year). I think he loses all legitimacy/respect from other GM's if he does that and also that other teams will know you can fleece the Brewers at the deadline every year for the next few years because MA is going to insist on making a move as big as he can and DM is going to give in in the end.

[dpapo]

You can add me to the no way should the Brewers trade Escobar crowd. I hope Melvin doesn't get caught up in the heat of the moment and does a foolish trade that will hurt this team in the future. Especially when this team has a number of needs that any one trade is not going to take care of. If Escobar is what Seattle is only willing to take, then just forget about it.

The other thing to keep in mind is that the Brewers are going to have a number of decisions and needs for next season. Cameron, Kendall and Hoffman are all going to become free agents. Better to keep Escobar and then trade Hardy, if not now, then in the offseason for either pitching help and/or players that can help fill in for the players that the Brewers might lose to free agency.

[SeriesFinale]

Serious question: When did DM call LaPorta "untouchable"?

 

Not necessarily saying he didn't, but I don't recall him being in the press about it as much as he's been for Escobar and Gamel.

 

Personally, I think he balks if the price is Escobar given JJ's contract situation, and I do think he considers Gamel untouchable.

[SoCal Brew Crew Fan]

For Escobar? Halladay? Maybe. Washburn/Morrow? No way Doug...don't do it.

[wibadgers23]

SoCal[/b] Brew Crew Fan]For Escobar? Halladay? Maybe. Washburn/Morrow? No way Doug...don't do it.

Exactly. You don't trade your future shortstop for two months of Washburn and an erratic reliever with arm problems. But yes for a guy like Halladay. Ugh, I'm starting to have flashbacks of the Inman for Linebrink fiasco.

[fondybrewfan]

Its one thing to say someone is "untouchable" in the media, its quite another to say a player is "untouchable" to another GM. Other GMs could probably care less about what Melvin says to the media, if they take Doug's words to the media as fact and are too lazy to give him a call to ask about the player then they deserve to be left out in the trade market. There would be no reason for other Gm's to respect Melvin less if he lied to the media, in fact they might ask the guy for a few tips

[JohnBriggs12]

I don't have a good feeling about this... what if Mark A. orders Doug to do whatever it takes to get Washburn?

If you saw Attanasio on with Brian and Bill the other night, he seemed to be averse to trading any of the so-called core including the underachieving Hardy. I took it as he's too emotionally attached to Hardy to okay a deal for him but since he has no such attachment to Escobar, he's willing to let him go. I know that sounds crazy, but that's how he sounded to me.

 

That's what happens when your owner is away 80% of the time. He's still operating on the assumption that all of the core is universally loved.

[Marc Newfield of Dreams]

Exactly. You don't trade your future shortstop for two months of Washburn and an erratic reliever with arm problems. But yes for a guy like Halladay. Ugh, I'm starting to have flashbacks of the Inman for Linebrink fiasco.

See... that's where my hang-up is. I really don't think they see Escobar as the future SS. I have no inside info or anything, but my gut tells me if they thought he was the guy, JJ would have been gone by now. He just doesn't fit the Melvin mold, he doesn't have pop and is probably not seen as a leadoff guy. I think Melvin's tenure has shown he wants 7 guys with power, then the catcher and pitcher.

 

The attachment to Hardy is also a valid point I think. Fan favorite, homegrown product, seems a bit harsh to trade him off after one down year. Gotta think Mark A. is aware of the PR angle.

[bobskube]

SoCal[/b] Brew Crew Fan]For Escobar? Halladay? Maybe. Washburn/Morrow? No way Doug...don't do it.

Exactly. You don't trade your future shortstop for two months of Washburn and an erratic reliever with arm problems. But yes for a guy like Halladay. Ugh, I'm starting to have flashbacks of the Inman for Linebrink fiasco.

Is this the same Inman who can't crack into the mighty San Diego rotation and got demoted to AA earlier this year? Still young...I know. He is a #4 type guy at best in the future.

[fondybrewfan]

Atleast thus far the Linebrink trade was a failure for all parties involved. Linebrink stunk when he was with us and no one we sent over has amounted to anything thus far

 

I would be fine sending Escobar to Seattle but we would need another significant piece other than Washburn. I don't know if they have any other high level pitching prospects other than Morrow. I wonder if we could get back Rowland-Smith some how? He has had some decent success in the Majors the last couple years, maybe a #3 type pitcher.

[SoCal Brew Crew Fan]

I have a slightly different take on the Linebrink trade with a similar conclusion. It stunk for the Brewers even more since Thatcher was the reliever they needed down the stretch that they were looking for in Linebrink. I guess the final script won't be written until all the prospects and comp picks have their runs, and as fondy points out so far no one has been anything special, but for the Brewers ultimate goal of helping out the 2007 team it was a complete bust. Maybe it cost us one win on a team that lost the division by 2 games.

[bcf5575]

if we are talking about trading escobar, shouldnt the targets be Hallady or Lee??

[uwisfan]

I will stop following the crew for some time if they are giving away Escobar in the manner suggested. I really hope Melvin is just posturing though that doesnt seem to be his MO.

 

Escobar was at the same age as Hardy in the last 2 years of the minors, and put up very similar offensive numbers. When you add speed, defense, upside, and cheap years to the equation.. well, Escobar better be playing in Milwaukee