Brewers acquire Felipe Lopez from Arizona for Cole Gillespie/Roque Mercedes, Gamel back to Nashville

[jvrocksaz]

Lopez will sign a 4 million $ deal to ride pine. His ceiling is not that high -- he is almost 30 -- he's probably not going to ever have a huge payday.

 

Your opinion, not fact. I find it very, very hard to believe he won't decline arby to test the market. He can always get a 1 year deal for roughly that amount of money from pretty much any team at that point.

Just ask Orlando Hudson...

[PeaveyFury]

Well what about Gamel, Heether, the Hurricane? Lopez isn't that great when there are options in-house.

 

Gamel is probably the better option, but for whatever reason, the Brewers aren't convinced that he's ready. If that's the case, he should be playing everyday in AAA, as you have advocated many times here on this very forum. The other two can't really be counted on- yes, they are potential options, but we don't have much of an idea as to how they'll actually perform. With Lopez, you have a pretty good idea of a baseline.

[Fatter than Joey]

Your opinion, not fact.

 

C'mon, is this really necessary? You can do better than this. At least refute my opinion.

 

I find it very, very hard to believe he won't decline arby to test the market.

 

He could also do better in Arby than he could on the market. At any rate, I think offering Lopez Arby's is a gamble, and is anything but a foregone inevitability.

[twobrewers]

I am amazed that anyone can dislike this trade...

 

Gillespie had no future in Milwaukee. His ceiling, as mentioned, is similar to Catalanotto. It isn't hard to find those players. That said, why in the world did Arizona take him? They already have a really crowded outfield. It seems as though Heether would have been significantly more useful to them.

 

I've never been much of a fan of Mercedes. However, I have to think Arizona saw something in him.

 

1. The Brewers can finally settle on a consistent line-up.

2. Gamel gets regular playing time. (Even if it is in the minor leagues)

3. We obtain protection for both Counsell and McGehee's knees.

4. We are very likely to obtain a sandwich pick worth more than Gillespie and Mercedes.

 

Even if you hate Lopez - this is still a good trade.

[Invader3K]

Right. Some people were saying "Gamel should get sent back down to Nashville if he is not going to play all the time. " This trade accomplishes that...so what is the problem?

[PeaveyFury]

C'mon, is this really necessary? You can do better than this.

 

And posting "False." as a one word response when someone posts something is Pulitzer-worthy? No, that's actually just talking down to our newer posters.

 

And yes, it is your opinion, not fact. You can do a lot better than "Eh, Lopez still sorta sucks." Where exactly is YOUR actual rationale? I've already posted mine, but apparently you glossed over that. He's posted a .700+ OPS 5 of the last 6 years, and has been very good over his last 500 AB's (since leaving that ballpark in Washington), suggesting it's possible that he's taken a step forward in his career. All of that 'refuting' is already found in this thread.

[PrinceEatMeat]

I am amazed that anyone can dislike this trade...

 

Gillespie had no future in Milwaukee. His ceiling, as mentioned, is similar to Catalanotto. It isn't hard to find those players. That said, why in the world did Arizona take him? They already have a really crowded outfield. It seems as though Heether would have been significantly more useful to them.

 

I've never been much of a fan of Mercedes. However, I have to think Arizona saw something in him.

 

1. The Brewers can finally settle on a consistent line-up.

2. Gamel gets regular playing time. (Even if it is in the minor leagues)

3. We obtain protection for both Counsell and McGehee's knees.

4. We are very likely to obtain a sandwich pick worth more than Gillespie and Mercedes.

 

Even if you hate Lopez - this is still a good trade.

 

I completely agree with this take. I don't have any problems with this deal, even if another deal doesn't follow. Although, I would like to see us acquire a starting pitcher obviously. I think everyone would.

[jjfanec]

Lopez will sign a 4 million $ deal to ride pine. His ceiling is not that high -- he is almost 30 -- he's probably not going to ever have a huge payday.

 

Your opinion, not fact. I find it very, very hard to believe he won't decline arby to test the market. He can always get a 1 year deal for roughly that amount of money from pretty much any team at that point.

Just ask Orlando Hudson...

Hudson is not a good comparison at all. He would have gotten a good contract but he was a Type A free agent and teams did not want to give up a first round pick for him. Here is an article talking about that fact.

[berniebrewer4life]

Honestly, i like cole, but i think this trade helps us. CG honestly is probably a #4 OFer at best, and Roque(who i really liked) probably wouldn't have amounted to much. Add in a first rounder to this deal, and we come out on top.

[Fatter than Joey]

That said, why in the world did Arizona take him?

 

AZ is 19 GB -- Their motivation is probably more about dumping Lopez.

 

1. The Brewers can finally settle on a consistent line-up.

 

I am not sure there is a tangible benefit here.

 

2. Gamel gets regular playing time. (Even if it is in the minor leagues)

 

I am happy about this.

 

3. We obtain protection for both Counsell and McGehee's knees.

 

Yep -- This definitely has stopgap benefits.

 

4. We are very likely to obtain a sandwich pick worth more than Gillespie and Mercedes.

 

This seems to be an easy stretch for many to make. If it happens, great... otherwise I think people are getting carts ahead of horses here.

[jjfanec]

This seems to be an easy stretch for many to make. If it happens, great... otherwise I think people are getting carts ahead of horses here.

Apparently Melvin is stretching like the rest of us because in TH's blog Melvin mentioned to TH that Lopez would be get a sandwich pick in return.

Lopez is a free agent after the season and Melvin said he projects as a Class B free agent, meaning the Brewers could get a compensation pick after the first round next June if he goes elsewhere.

It seems to me that the compensation pick was in Doug's mind in the trade if he mentions it to TH.

[PeaveyFury]

Apparently Melvin is stretching like the rest of us because in TH's blog Melvin mentioned to TH that Lopez would be get a sandwich pick in return.

 

Yeah, sure doesn't seem like the team is debating offering him arby at this point.

[Fatter than Joey]

And yes, it is your opinion, not fact.

 

False.

 

Everything I say is obviously factual.

 

Where exactly is YOUR actual rationale?

 

We have a presumably healthy Weeks coming back in 2010. Certainly we can find a better backup option for 2b than Lopez at $5M per year. It is not a foregone conclusion that Lopez will be offered Arby.

[PeaveyFury]

It is not a foregone conclusion that Lopez will be offered Arby.

 

Doug Melvin apparently disagrees with you, and I'll take his feelings on that subject over yours, if that's ok.

[mothershipconnection]

Gillespie had no future in Milwaukee. His ceiling, as mentioned, is similar to Catalanotto. It isn't hard to find those players. That said, why in the world did Arizona take him?

 

I think you answered that later in your post: Mercedes has been productive this year, is still young, and IIRC, was pretty highly thought of when we signed him as a kid. Plus, AZ gets to dump a decent amount of salary tied to a player with little value to them because they obviously won't compete this year.

[Fatter than Joey]

Apparently Melvin is stretching like the rest of us because in TH's blog Melvin mentioned to TH that Lopez would be get a sandwich pick in return

 

I just read the blog -- and the paragraph regarding compensation does not seem to be tied to Melvin in anyway shape or form. It just seems like a statement inserted by TH.

 

Yeah, sure doesn't seem like the team is debating offering him arby at this point.

 

First, I am pretty sure they will cross that bridge much later in the year. Second, I don't see where you can glean any sort of idea of what DM is planning to do with Lopez based on that blog linked above.

[nate82]

This was a good buy low trade by the Brewers here. The Brewers got Lopez for a lot less than what the Cardinals gave up to get DeRosa and both are comparable. If McGehee and Counsell were healthier I would be boggled by this or if Hall was playing better then this doesn't make much sense but Lopez is like the Durham trade last year. This adds depth and you know you can't count on Counsell to continue doing what he is doing and McGehee is going to regress also.

[Fatter than Joey]

Doug Melvin apparently disagrees with you, and I'll take his feelings on that subject over yours, if that's ok.

 

Sure, that's fine with me, but I sincerely fail to see how you can know his "feelings" regarding FA compensation based on that blog -- unless I am missing something, which of course is possible.

 

2 other things to consider:

 

1.) I am sure what gets fed to TH is not always a true assessment of "the feelings of the team" -- I, on the other hand, speak from the heart.

2.) FTJ never has and never will sign and then extend Ned Yost (or any of his offspring) to a contract.

[bando1234]

I think we all know this was not Melvins doing, Deputy Braun was working on this one for a few day.

[JJHardy7]

Gamel is probably the better option, but for whatever reason, the Brewers aren't convinced that he's ready. If that's the case, he should be playing everyday in AAA, as you have advocated many times here on this very forum. The other two can't really be counted on- yes, they are potential options, but we don't have much of an idea as to how they'll actually perform. With Lopez, you have a pretty good idea of a baseline.

I have wanted Gamel in AAA...a trade wasn't needed to make it happen. Gamel going to AAA is not part of this trade...don't give the trade credit for that. Gamel should've been sent down a long, long, long time ago...a trade wasn't needed. Playing him everyday. This trade has little to do with Gamel going down.

I think people are really missing some points here. How is Lopez going to make this team better this year? How many more wins is this trade worth? It's not many if any. Again, if another trade is made...it's different. We gave up players for options we already had internally. I didn't really see too many posts lately about the need for another IF on the MLB squad. Lopez isn't bad or anything...if Counsell was hurt...it'd make sense. I would've much rather given Heether a shot...not cause he's cheap or anything, but because obviously the guys we traded away had value. The posts stating we didn't need them are 100% false. Milwaukee may not have needed them, but obviously they had trade value. I just wish we would've traded them for a position that would make an impact on the team this year. There are no guarantees about even getting a pick or that pick even making it past AA. I will say if another trade isn't made, the Brewers have really botched this year on a few levels. It's about time to put Macha on the hot seat. A trade like this is an indication that they are 'going for it'...so let's start holding Macha accountable like Yost was always held around here.

[JoeHova]

I think the odds of the team offering Lopez arbitration are pretty high, both because they will doubt he'll accept and because even if he did accept, he has a track record of being worth $4-5 million per year. The risk is not especially large, even if he plays as poorly as he ever has, he'd still only be overpaid by a couple million.

 

As for the trade itself, I don't know how much I like it. If Lopez can keep playing like he has been so far this season or like he did in 2005, great. Otherwise, it was probably pretty pointless. I would have liked for the team to hold onto Mercedes.

[Fatter than Joey]

I have wanted Gamel in AAA...a trade wasn't needed to make it happen.

 

This is a great point as well. I am happy with the end result, but the trade wasn't necessary.

[Thats Freakin Sweet]

I have wanted Gamel in AAA...a trade wasn't needed to make it happen. Gamel going to AAA is not part of this trade...don't give the trade credit for that. Gamel should've been sent down a long, long, long time ago...a trade wasn't needed. Playing him everyday. This trade has little to do with Gamel going down.

I think people are really missing some points here. How is Lopez going to make this team better this year? How many more wins is this trade worth? It's not many if any. Again, if another trade is made...it's different. We gave up players for options we already had internally. I didn't really see too many posts lately about the need for another IF on the MLB squad. Lopez isn't bad or anything...if Counsell was hurt...it'd make sense. I would've much rather given Heether a shot...not cause he's cheap or anything, but because obviously the guys we traded away had value. The posts stating we didn't need them are 100% false. Milwaukee may not have needed them, but obviously they had trade value. I just wish we would've traded them for a position that would make an impact on the team this year. There are no guarantees about even getting a pick or that pick even making it past AA. I will say if another trade isn't made, the Brewers have really botched this year on a few levels. It's about time to put Macha on the hot seat. A trade like this is an indication that they are 'going for it'...so let's start holding Macha accountable like Yost was always held around here.

Obviously Gamel wasn't a solution to Macha. Given that, this trade is absolutely a necessity. Both McGehee and Counsell are nursing bad knees. Bill Hall is just plain terrible. Lopez is a proven commodity. Adam Heether is not. That no one was posting about the need for someone like Lopez, means nothing about whether or not the deal should've been done. Neither one of the guys given up were integral to the future of the franchise. You are correct, they do have value. They netted the team a proven major league starting SS/2b that can switch-hit and is a leadoff hitter. He's no great of the game, but he makes sense given the team's situation.

[thablingster]

One reason I like this trade is it helps the bench situation, adding another bat besides Cat who can pinch hit reliably. If Lopez starts on a routine basis which is most likely the expectation, that means either Counsell or McGehee will be available off the bench to hit. Rest for both of those guys as they've been banged up going into August is a good thing.

 

I do wish they'd have given Gamel more of a look and more playing time at 3B to accomplish the same thing, but at least now he has had a decent taste of the bigs, should know how pitchers like to pitch him and will have an opportunity to go down to AAA, play every day, and work on that. He'll be back in a little over a month, anyway.

 

Hopefully this will also end the musical lineups of Kendall batting 1st then 8th then 7th, Hardy batting 2nd then 8th, and all of the randomness that came along with losing Weeks for the year. This isn't something that will put the team over the top, but it hopefully will help more than it hurts.

[Fatter than Joey]

even if he did accept, he has a track record of being worth $4-5 million per year.

 

Except with arbitration --- the arbitrator chooses one side or the other, it's not really a "fair market" thing.

 

even if he did accept, he has a track record of being worth $4-5 million per year.

 

Presuming Weeks is healthy -- Weeks is going to get most of the starts -- Paying someone $4-5 to backup 2b is probably not prudent. If DM is concerned that Weeks can only start 100 games -- then it is more sensible of course.