Roy Halladay

[Never Outhustled]

I wouldn't get too worked up about this Parra rumor, because it comes from Josh Heyman, the same guy that reported that completely bogus Halladay-Mets rumor. The Jays may have asked about him, but we'll say no and the Jays won't consider that a deal breaker. If we don't include Escobar, that will be a deal breaker.

 

The Jays have alot of interesting young mid-rotation types. Those used a ton of high picks on pitching, they're the opposite of us. They also have a top catching prospect. What they don't have is prospects at SS and 3B.

[jvrocksaz]

Maybe Melvin is willng to trade Parra becuase he wants to get Cliff Lee in addition to Halladay... I can only dream...

[bobloblaw]

I wouldn't get too worked up about this Parra rumor, because it comes from Josh Heyman, the same guy that reported that completely bogus Halladay-Mets rumor. The Jays may have asked about him, but we'll say no and the Jays won't consider that a deal breaker. If we don't include Escobar, that will be a deal breaker.

 

The Jays have alot of interesting young mid-rotation types. Those used a ton of high picks on pitching, they're the opposite of us. They also have a top catching prospect. What they don't have is prospects at SS and 3B.

I can't say for certain, but coming from a Toronto fan I do not believe that we have any interest in Parra. We already have Romero, Cecil and Rzepczynski who are all lefties in our rotation. Not to mention we drafted 2 lefties high this year, the last thing we need is more left handed pitching. What we do need are infield prospects because we have none that are remotely close.

[lcbj68c]

According to the JS, Melvin hasn't even made a single offer yet. Tough telling who may or may not be potentially involved. Close your eyes and point.

[Invader3K]

I know this is pretty much scraping the bottom of the barrel in terms of reliable rumors, but there are a couple posters on the JSOnline blog that seem pretty confident something is going to be breaking today, in regards to Halladay. I'm not holding my breath at this point, though.

[sheethead]

I know this is pretty much scraping the bottom of the barrel in terms of reliable rumors, but there are a couple posters on the JSOnline blog that seem pretty confident something is going to be breaking today, in regards to Halladay. I'm not holding my breath at this point, though.

One is hinting at Halladay, and the other is hinting at Lee. You are right, it is scraping the bottom of the barrel.

[brewmann04]

Watch The Rays making a big move before the deadline.

[lcbj68c]

I know this is pretty much scraping the bottom of the barrel in terms of reliable rumors, but there are a couple posters on the JSOnline blog that seem pretty confident something is going to be breaking today, in regards to Halladay. I'm not holding my breath at this point, though.

Hardy's girlfriend was seen leaving Hardy's residence with a suitcase in tow...Hardy must be on the move.

Oh wait...he just brought home a new flavor of the week from Pittsburg, it's just Hardy's girlfriend who's been traded.

[chuckiehacks]

According to the JS, Melvin hasn't even made a single offer yet. Tough telling who may or may not be potentially involved. Close your eyes and point.

 

According to JP Ricciardi, no offers have been made yet - the Blue Jays are still scouting.

[lcbj68c]

Watch The Rays making a big move before the deadline.

Living in Tampa, that's the crap that bugs me. This Tampa team has a payroll of around 64 million, yet Friedman gets it done. They fill their holes nicely at starting pitching from outside the organization and have very few "poor contracts". Pat Burrel 7M, and Percival 4M come to mind.

[jackalope02ca]

I still think Manny Parra has a decent ceiling as well but any day I can move minor leaguers and Manny for Roy Holladay I do it without hesitation. It's like comparing apples to oranges. They both pitch but that is about where the comparison ends. Doc could win the Brewers a World Series this year or next. Manny might help them limp into the playoffs. If we could win a world series in the next two years I couldn't care less about dropping under .500 for a couple of years after that while we rebuild. Living in Canada I get to see a lot more of Holladay on TV than you guys as basically every Jays game is on TV country wide. I'm a lot closer to Milwaukee than Toronto so no I don't go to any games in Toronto but I will say this. Most of the posters on this board don't realize just how good he is. And that's not suggesting most of the posters on this board don't know baseball, in fact it's just the opposite. This guy is one of the top 2 or 3 pitchers in baseball right now and in his prime.

[lcbj68c]

I agree with most of what TheCrew said..as usual. Except to me, Halladay is about 2010, not 2009. Furthermore, resigning him beyond 2010 would be nice as well.

[NievesNoNO]

I would like to know how including Parra in any deal helps plug the hole in the rotation? It replaces our only other high ceiling pitcher on the staff with a short term solution. What's long term about 2010? Parra isn't the hole, Burns is the hole, I still believe Parra will be a good pitcher, I'm not willing to give up on him yet. So in the playoffs we go Halladay, Yo, and.... whom? Bush isn't even pitching anymore... I thought originally we'd be lucky to have him back by August, now we'll be lucky to have him back by September. If my other playoff options are Looper and Suppan consider me uninspired.

Amen to that. As long as Burns is pitching every 5th day we have no shot. If we want to make a minor move and at least get a major league pitcher to take his spot and roll the dice that the other 3 teams in front of us now fail I'm fine with that, but I don't want to give Parra, Gamel, or Escobar in any deal this year.

[fondybrewfan]

I guess I don't know why a package including Gamel or Escobar, Salome, Peralta, and Scarpetta/Amundsen wouldn't be enough.

 

That is 4 of our top 15 prospects already including 2 of our top 5, if the Blue Jays are going to ask for more than that I doubt they trade him because I don't think anyone will be willing to give up more.

[Never Outhustled]

I guess I don't know why a package including Gamel or Escobar, Salome, Peralta, and Scarpetta/Amundsen wouldn't be enough.

The Jays have a better catching prospect, JP Arencibia, in AAA. If the package includes Gamel, wheres the SS they want? You have the value right, but haven't addressed their needs. Your correct in that Parra doesn't need to be part of this deal.

[Hate those Rodents]

Halladay doesn't want to hit. He's unlikely to sign with an NL team when his contract is up. He's said the former. Someone has the quote somewhere I am sure.

[Oldcity]

Funny, you think the fact that he'd be even more dominant in the NL would help him overlook that.

[MarquesJohnson2000]

He was quoted saying the exact opposite:

 

Halladay, 33, who has a full no-trade clause, says he hasn't provided a list of teams he'd be willing to play for. Yet after going 10-3 with a 2.85 ERA in the powerful American League East this year, he'd certainly be willing to try life in the National League.

 

"I'd rather hit," Halladay says, "than have to face Derek Jeter and A-Rod (Alex Rodriguez), (Hideki) Matsui and (Mark) Teixeira and all of the other guys."

 

http://www.hardballtimes.com/main/shysterball/article/halladay-must-have-taste-because-he-prefers-the-n.l/

[fondybrewfan]

I guess I don't know why a package including Gamel or Escobar, Salome, Peralta, and Scarpetta/Amundsen wouldn't be enough.

The Jays have a better catching prospect, JP Arencibia, in AAA. If the package includes Gamel, wheres the SS they want? You have the value right, but haven't addressed their needs. Your correct in that Parra doesn't need to be part of this deal.

Ok: Gamel, Peralta, Scarpetta, Cain, & Brewer.

 

I am sure with them getting rid of Halladay and Rolen shortly that they can afford to get a MLB SS by means other than the Brewers trade.

 

Hell maybe they think Bill Hall could still be a SS

 

Gamel, Peralta, Amundsen, Hall, and 1/2 of Hall's salary next year for Halladay

[Hsee2006]

Have to say I was not on board with the Halladay trade but the more I look at our future salary and arbitration situation the more it looks like this and next year is the window. If you assume that we will trade away some of our players for minor leaguers or other arbitration eligible players before they enter their final year, that means that after this year Hardy will be moved and, baring signing long term, means that Fielder, Hart and Weeks will be moved after the 2010 season. Therefore, 2010 is reall the year to go all out with the understanding that even if we gut our system now, following the 2010 year we should be able to restock it with a number of high quality young and arbitration eligible players.

 

Therefore, I propose we trade Parra, Gamel, Lawrie for Halladay. Halladay replaces Parra for next year, hopefully McGehee (he is the wild card as he gives us some stability at third base) replaces Gamel until Green is ready.

 

Then after this season, we trade Hardy for young pitching to replace Parra and Escobar replaces Hardy and McGehee becomes the full-time third basemen. The starting rotation for 2010 then becomes Halladay, Gallardo, Bush, Suppan, Looper or pitcher pitcked up in Hardy trade. This gives us a better starting rotation and more depth. Our position players remain virtually unchanged but we need to find a center fielder and Rivera takes over for Kendall with Salome as backup.

 

Then after the 2010 season we tear it down and rebuild by moving Weeks, Fielder and Hart. We get comp picks for Bush and Halladay. And we gain a ton of financial flexibility with Hall, Suppan, Fielder, Hart, Weeks and Halladay all come off the books which could be reinvested in a player we find most worth investing in long term, possibiliy Fielder.

 

So I think this gives us a better shot short term but also gives us enough flexibility to rebuild after taking a shot in 2010. Ultimately, this strategy relies upon McGeehee serving as a bridge to Green and Escobar holding his own. If those two can do that then losing Gamel and Parra gives us a legitimate shot both in the short and long-term.

[bamberger]

If it came down to it, and Halladay would agree to come and stay through 2010, I would trade Escobar, Gamel, plus their choice of any two other minor leaguers besides Lawrie and Braddock. That would bridge the team to 2011, when more pitching should be available and they might have to let position players go because of salary or free agency years.

[GB12]

I know this is pretty much scraping the bottom of the barrel in terms of reliable rumors, but there are a couple posters on the JSOnline blog that seem pretty confident something is going to be breaking today, in regards to Halladay. I'm not holding my breath at this point, though.

The posters on all JSOnline blogs are complete morons. Don't take anything from those posts ever.

[Invader3K]

The posters on all JSOnline blogs are complete morons. Don't take anything from those posts ever.

 

Oh, I know all too well. I was just posting for the sake of conversation. Also, since this was brought up before, here's a partial list of starting pitchers who will be free agents after this season (taken from MLB Trade Rumors):

 

Josh Beckett - $12MM club option with a $2MM buyout

Erik Bedard

Justin Duchscherer

Rich Harden

Tim Hudson - $12MM mutual option with a $1MM buyout

John Lackey

Cliff Lee - $8MM club option with a $1MM buyout

Brett Myers

Brandon Webb - $8.5MM club option with a $500K+ buyout

Todd Wellemeyer

 

To me, that is not the most inspiring list. I don't see anyone we would realistically have a chance to sign. That's why I think making a trade like the ones proposed for Halladay or Lee would be so helpful now, because I can't see Melvin going out and signing any of those guys, and I doubt we have enough to trade for a high quality starting pitcher during the off season either. It's not like the Brewers will be the only team looking.

 

Edit: To add to that, we're currently still 4th in the NL in runs scored, but 13th in pitching. How does that not say "Acquire some top tier pitching help?"

[sheethead]

To me, that is not the most inspiring list. I don't see anyone we would realistically have a chance to sign.

Well, after Wellemeyer pitches two fluky games in the NLCS, we can grab him for around $40 million.

 

The posters on all JSOnline blogs are complete morons. Don't take anything from those posts ever.

 

Are you trying to be all encompassing? I would debate that all the posters over there are morons. I would even debate the capacity of someone who feels the need to call others morons.

[Invader3K]

Not to speak for GB12, but I don't think he literally meant everyone there...however, if you check out that blog on a regular basis, the vast majority of discussion there is pretty much drivel. Basically the polar opposite of this forum. There are very few posters there that really make any insightful comments, or have anything substantive to add as far as rumors (which was kind of my point earlier). At least a few people over there did call out some of the latest rumor mongers over there pretty thoroughly.