Roy Halladay

[JohnBriggs12]

TOR told LA that a deal had to include Kershaw or Billingsley. The idea that the Crew can throw the Jays some A ballers not in their top 10 is ludicrous.

Anundsen should be in AA at any time now. Braddock is already there and has a 0.00 ERA and has now fanned 53 hitters in 34 1/3 IP total this season (51.4% of outs recorded). Both are 21 year old pitchers. Rankings aside, those 2 are pieces I'm sure the Blue Jays would find attractive.

 

Bottom line, I don't think it's that far fetched that the Brewers could come up with a package that would interest Toronto.

[Hate those Rodents]

Someone, maybe from ESPN, thought the Phillies would offer three A's a B and a C prospect. That to me would look like...

 

Escobar

Lawrie

Salome (I'll reach here and let us keep Gamel)

 

Anundsen

 

Dillard

 

We had better be darn sure that we make the playoffs at the minimum to give up all of that to send a pitcher to a team that might be just a little better than an average MLB team this year.

[jjfanec]

Someone, maybe from ESPN, thought the Phillies would offer three A's a B and a C prospect. That to me would look like...

 

Escobar

Lawrie

Salome (I'll reach here and let us keep Gamel)

 

Anundsen

 

Dillard

 

We had better be darn sure that we make the playoffs at the minimum to give up all of that to send a pitcher to a team that might be just a little better than an average MLB team this year.

Yep, the more I see what the Blue Jays are asking the more I say we should stay out of it. If rumors of what they are asking are true we probably would have to give up our three best prospects (maybe we could keep Gamel) our top pitching prospect (since we dont have one that would be considered an A guy) and then one more guy. Way too much in my mind for a year and a half of even a great pitcher like Halladay. I was willing to give up an A and B with limited upside and then a young arm for CC last year but I just cannot see giving up two more A's which would cripple our system

[sargennm]

Yep, the more I see what the Blue Jays are asking the more I say we should stay out of it. If rumors of what they are asking are true we probably would have to give up our three best prospects (maybe we could keep Gamel) our top pitching prospect (since we dont have one that would be considered an A guy) and then one more guy. Way too much in my mind for a year and a half of even a great pitcher like Halladay. I was willing to give up an A and B with limited upside and then a young arm for CC last year but I just cannot see giving up two more A's which would cripple our system

Look at their attendance figures, their payroll and their supposed asking price. It's clear to me that they will be getting rid of Halladay because it's a salary dump whether or not management and ownership will admit it. I think his asking price continues to slip down until it's about what CC garnered, unless they actually consider trading him to the Yankees or Boston which might keep the price higher.

 

If that's really what they want, then yeah, stay away. I don't think anyone will give them that much right now. Teams, even the big spenders, are just too conservative.

[TauPentaRei]

I personally don't think that we're going to get "Sheetsed" again... that is losing the A free agent but only getting a compensatory 2nd rounder. (or woe to the same Blue Jays here for getting Burnetted by the Yankess and only receiving their sandwich and a 3rd).

 

that was a perfect storm of the Yankees blowing their wad.

 

best case scenario is we re-sign Doc after 2010 and have 3-4 more years of Doc & Yo at the top of the rotation. Hello October, regularly. Bush/Parra/McClung/Villy/Dillard/Rogers/Arnett/Peralta/Anundsen/Whoever can fill it out. You don't necessarily need the depth because you've got 400 innings locked up 1-2. And we actually do have depth, even with 2 of that last 6 packaged and dealt.

 

worst case scenario is we lose Doc to Boston or LA or wherever, but get the 2 high picks and replenish A+ ball with some polished college arms.

 

 

I am starting to disengage from this being a reality... after a solid 36 hours fantasy. Is Ricciardi just a media $+%*@, or does he really need to unload Wells?

[endaround]

He can't unload Wells, Rios's value can easily rebound so you can wait on him, but he needs to free some money and Toronto has tons of young arms they want to see in teh majors.

[Never Outhustled]

If the Brewers give up a large package to get Halladay, would we then turn around and deal Looper for a prospect? While he just mediocre, I think most would prefer starting him to some of the guys starting on contenders like Jeff Weaver or Rodrigo Lopez. Getting a SS prospect back would be ideal. Dealing starting pitcher, even guys that are nothing more than tollerable, is usually pretty fruitful.

[Weirdos19]

Hardy, Rios, and Halladay to Boston

 

Bucholz and Delcarmen to Milwaukee

 

Lars Anderson, Jed Lowrie, and Manny Parra to Toronto

 

This works because Boston can take on the payroll and it gets them where they want to go.

 

Works for Toronto because it gets Rios' contract off the books and they get the young shortstop they covet. They also get ML ready pitching.

 

Works for Milwaukee because it gets them the future #1 or #2 starter they want and fortifies a bullpen that needs it. They can bring Escobar up too. Even shaves a bit of payroll.

[Never Outhustled]

Hardy, Rios, and Halladay to Boston

 

Bucholz and Delcarmen to Milwaukee

 

Lars Anderson, Jed Lowrie, and Manny Parra to Toronto

That deal gives up on this season. We need something that improves us this year and next without downgrading other positions. We trade surplus prospects, not big leaguers, to get better.

 

. Sure, Parra was bad in 14 starts so far this year, but Buchholz was equally as bad in 15 starts last year. Parra looks like he might have things fixxed with a couple of mechanical tweaks. Parra, unlike Buchholz, has a career MLB ERA under 5. If Bucholz in an upgrade, that improvement is wasted by the downgrade at SS.

 

This team has an amazing 6 relievers with ERAs under 3, and Villy gives us a 7th guy who's capable when right. We have minor league relievers who could fill the gap if needed. We don't need to trade for a reliever.

[steve267268]

All teams are flawed, your argument doesn't hold water.

True, but even if Roy Halladay could help us make the playoffs I don't think we would do much once we got there. Halladay, another solid pitcher, and someone to bolster the batting order (see: Casey Blake '08) would make us contenders. Anything short of that and we are giving away our future to make another short playoff appearance. It was a good move last year, but I think it would be stupid this year.

[Never Outhustled]

True, but even if Roy Halladay could help us make the playoffs I don't think we would do much once we got there

I'm not sure why you say this. Our record in games not pitched by Parra this year is outstanding, plus Parra might have his issues solved. Hallday would be a huge addition, and Gamel is likely better than any Casey Blake type addition.

[endaround]

Halladay adds 2-3 wins by himself. And the idea that the playoffs require 5 aces to win is just not true.

[derflotr]

Anyone catch Haudricourt's tweet?

 

"Brewers haven't ruled out jumping in on Halladay. Check out my Brewers notebook at jsonline.com in the morning."

 

I really have a hard time believing that one player, even one as good as Halladay, makes this team a World Series contender. And I can't think of any other reason to trade away multiple top-tier positional prospects. I just don't think the Brewers are in the position to make this deal. It would really be a gamble.

[endaround]

The Brewers were one Braun hit away from taking 2 of 3 from the Dodgers even in the Brewers nadir. The difference between the World Series and not isn't that great.

[Brewcrewin07]

Hmmmm, could things be heating up??

 

http://www.jsonline.com/blogs/sports/51065382.html

[derflotr]

They've got to be mega-confident with this year's draft, though I guess every team loves their draft at first...based on what they were asking from LA and St. Louis I don't want to think about the package the Brewers are going to have to come up with...on one hand I really don't want to trade away young and cheap near-major-league ready position players. On the other hand, Brewers fans have come out in droves and the organization wants and should reward that. Should be interesting to see what Toronto's going to ask for...

[DHonks]

I'd love to add Halladay and Rolen, but I just can't come up with a fair package either either, let alone both

[DonMoney4Mgr]

At first, I wasn't thrilled about aquiring Halladay and depleting more prospects for a year and a half rental. However, I would consider trading prospects that we have excellent alternatives and/or major leaguers that are underachieving this year and are close to free agency. Consequently, I could see a trade along these lines;

To Toronto - Gamel, Hardy, Parra, Anundsen, and Dillard

To Milwaukee - Halladay and Rolen

I wouldn't want to give up Parra necessarily, but what other pitching would attract them? For Gamel, I believe we have options (Heether, Green). For Hardy, Escobar of coarse.

SS Escobar
2B McGeHee/Counsel
LF Braun
1B Fielder
3B Rolen
CF Cam
RF Hart
C Kendall
P Yo, Doc, Soup, Loop, TBA

[Foofty]

You know, after reading TH's latest post on Halladay and looking into what we need, i.e. Top end SP & a true Leadoff Hitter I was thinking the same as many of yall... the answer might not be trading Escobar at all. We could trade JJ, yes hes streaky, but he is almost always going to provide 20-25HR a season and good defense. Let alone he was a previous All-Star and young! Keeping Escobar in the #1 spot would give us a true leadoff hitter role we have been looking for. McGehee has come from nowhere and is showing he can hold his own at 2B defensivly ( average ), and all honestly should be in the everyday line up for the rest of the season. Councel could fill the 3B role if we give up Gamel in the deal as well.

 

JJ, Gamel & PTBNL AAA for Halladay. I would go for it. 80% of the female brewer fans would be mad trading JJ, but I would rather trade JJ than Escobar.

[southpaw121505]

McGehee has come from nowhere and is showing he can hold his own at 2B defensivly ( average ), and all honestly should be in the everyday line up for the rest of the season. Councel could fill the 3B role if we give up Gamel in the deal as well.

I'm sorry to nitpick but Counsell would play 2nd and McGehee would play 3rd. Beyond tht, I don't want to trade Gamel either. I'm starting to think Halladay will cost way more than I'd be willing to dish out.

[ELCABALLO45]

The idea of getting Rolen as well kinda intrigues me. I bet he would LOVE to get back at TLR.

[Invader3K]

I would think if the Brewers could take Halladay and one other significant contract from Toronto, it shouldn't cost quite as much in terms of what Melvin would have to give up.

 

What does everyone think of what Melvin said as far as the possibility that they could trade for him and then he would ask for a trade after this season? I would think if Halladay waives his no trade clause to come here, that would be a pretty remote possibility.

[Never Outhustled]

Keeping Escobar in the #1 spot would give us a true leadoff hitter role we have been looking for.

How is Escobar a true leadoff hitter? He doesn't get on base. His MLEs right now have him as a bad offensive SS. Having him and Kendall in the same lineup what be tough to overcome. You don't give the most ABs to a bad hitter. In 3 years Escobar might be a nice leadoffman, but not now. If we get Halladay, then we want now production.

 

 

However, I would consider trading prospects that we have excellent alternatives and/or major leaguers that are underachieving this year and are close to free agency.

Why would Toronto trade a year and a half of Halladay for a year and a half of Hardy? Also, if we include Parra, who pitches for us in 2011? I understand if you think 2011 is too far off to worry about, but then why not deal Escobar, the guy that fits a rebuilding team best?

 

 

Taking on both Halladay and Rolen is a huge amount of salary. We didn't suddenly become the Yankees. Rolen alone adds as much salary as CC did last year, and Halladay is significantly more. We can add some salary, just like last year, but this duo would be almost 2 1/2 CC's. I doubt thats feasible.

 

 

Toronto has asked for a Teixeira type deal, that includes an MLB ready SS. The Teixeira deal included prospects ranked 1,2,3,14, and 17 in Atlanta's system, though most were a few years from being MLB ready. Toronto has alot of young pitching, but need offense. Their OF is set for years. We're the perfect trading partner for them. Escobar is the MLB ready SS. Brett Lawrie is a guy they wanted to draft, but we picked 1 spot ahead of them. Taylor Green is the type of player their scouting style would appreciate, and he would fit perefectly taking over for Rolen when his deal is up, or if he's dealt before then. Those are prospects 1,3,and 8 in our system.

 

 

To Toronto: Escobar, Lawrie, Green, Periard, their choice of Peralta/Scarpetta

 

To Milwaukee: Halladay, SS Juan Diaz (from Seattle)

 

To Seattle: Marcos Scutaro

 

The Teixera deal also included LHP Ron Mahay to Atlanta, so I thought Toronto should throw in aplayer too, and Scutaro is obsolete with Escobar in town. Seattle is contending, and could really use a SS. Juan Diaz is athletic, a strong defender, and is having a solid season in A+.

 

Toronto gets 3 Canadians in the deal, which should help with the PR nightmare trading Halladay will be.

[bklynbrewcrew]

I absolutely hate the idea of this trade. I really dont want to give up a big part of our future for Halladay no matter how good he is. I would not under any circumstances trade away Gamel who I truly believe will be a great player for us. I could be talked into giving up Escobar who I feel is overrated ( a Brewers executive compared him to Alfredo Griffin) but it will take far more than Escobar to get the deal done. Gamel and Lawrie are the two guys I really want to keep and I am sure that one if not both would have to be included.

 

Gamel is just too important to the future of this team to be included in any deal. I really hope we arent desperate enough to make a deal like this.

[Never Outhustled]

Gamel and Lawrie are the two guys I really want to keep and I am sure that one if not both would have to be included

I agree that I wouldn't give up Gamel, but Lawrie I would. He's much farther from Milwaukee than I anticipated when I begged for his draft selection, and his attitude is worrisome. While some say he has Braun's confidence, to me it looks like Matt Laporta's arrogance. Braun interacts well with his teammates, while Lawrie doesn't seem to know he has any. They don't interact at all, as he struts around the park like he owns the place despite somewhat underwhelming performance. Braun never got pulled from a game for lack of hustle, and never seemed to have a giant chip on his shoulder like Lawrie exudes in interviews. Dealing Lawrie now might be perfect timing, just like dealing Laporta last year was.