How Suppan's Signing Changes Things

[joshjs]

With the addition of Jeff Suppan, it can be assumed that little more effort will be put into acquiring any more starting pitching this off-season.

 

However, the Crew still could move an outfielder -- presumably Mench or Jenkins -- for something.

 

So what do we want now? Bullpen help? (Do we need it? Maybe another lefty...) Quantity-for-quality corner outfield trade? (In my dreams.) Prospects?

 

I'm curious what you all think. Especially about where on the diamond some new prospects might fit into the five-to-eight-year plan.

 

Edit: Personally, I'd want to trade Clark for a decent low-level pitching prospect, if possible, and go with a starting OF of Jenkins-Hall-Hart with Gross and Mench on the bench.

[pogokat]

i think they may pursue bullpen help, but i'd rather trade whoever needs to be traded for prospects...

 

I think the outfield is looking like gross-Hall-hart...which is aok with me...in fact, i'm beginning to prefer gross over jenkins, just because he's younger and could/should exceed jenks last year..

[aracko]

I would anticipate this move causes Vargas to convert to the BP, which is a role I think he might be really effective in. I would not be surprised to see him slide into the setup role, because I think his hard stuff is perfectly suited. I think he could be what we envisioned with TBOW.

[splitterpfj]

I think an outfielder is definitely going to go, I suspect it'll be Jenkins or Mench, with Clark staying on for one more season as a reserve.

 

Something will have to give in the bullpen too, we don't have enough roster space to carry Cordero, Turnbow, Capellan, Wise, Aquino, Shouse, Sarfate, and possibly whoever doesn't win the #5 spot in the rotation.

 

I really don't know what else the team would like to add, but they surely have the depth to take a deal if they like what someone offers.

 

The only stated goal I can think of that they've missed on is adding a leadoff hitter. I don't know if they'll pursue that again or not.

[brettac1]

The only stated goal I can think of that they've missed on is adding a leadoff hitter.

 

They have two of them on the roster in Weeks and Gross, so I don't know why they felt they needed one in the first place.

[endaround]

You forgot that they also have Hart.

 

My guess is the Suppan signing means someone will now just be dumped for salary relief. Maybe that means picking up some of Clark's contract to save a few million. That said, the Brewers are thin in position prospects at higher levels and could even use some middling prospects there.

[brettac1]

Well, I'm not as sold on Hart as a lead-off option as others, and I think Gross and Weeks would be better options. I guess it depends if Gross actually gets to play, because I think he's the odd man out in the Hall to the OF thing, since I expect Jenkins in RF and Hart in LF.

[Ennder]

My guess is the lineup ends up something like this.

 

Vs righties

 

Weeks

Estrada

Fielder

Hall

Jenkins

Hart

Koskie

Hardy/Counsell

Pitcher

 

Vs lefties

 

Weeks

Hardy

Fielder

Hall

Mench

Hart

Graffanino

Miller

Pitcher

 

Clark is the odd man out so we just dump him. Gross backs up Hall in CF sometimes against righties. Mench backs up Jenkins against lefties. Unfortunately I don't think we'll get rid of Graffanino so he's the 3B vs lefties.

 

I'd prefer we trade Jenkins since it makes the most sense letting Gross start instead while not losing Mench who would be a great help against lefties which are going to give us trouble, especially if Weeks or Hardy gets hurt.

 

If we do pick up a new player I'd think it would have to be an OF and a RP for a better RP or something like that. We don't have many sure things in the bullpen but we have a lot of could be depth so its hard to add someone.

[splitterpfj]

Guys, we can list off all of the leadoff options we want to, no matter what we think, it's obvious that the front office wanted a change there.

 

Personally, I hope they leave it alone. First of all, Weeks can handle it for anther season, and secondly, we already have some sorting out to do in the outfield, if they add one for the leadoff spot...how does that fit?

[Nader Raider Tim]

Quite honestly with Suppan in the fold I think that the Brewers should explore the option of trading Capuono, Vargas, or Villenueva. I do think that pitching depth is important, but I would think that the Brewers should at least try and do a cost/benefit analysis on trading one of their other pitchers.

 

Capuono would be able to on his own bring in Alex Rios, or be a huge part of a deal for Crawford.

 

I wouldn't say that trading any of our pitchers should be a priority just that they should look at the possiblity at turning some of their Starting Pitching depth into a prominent impact outfielder.

[dadofandrew]

In a perfect world, one of the excess OF's would be traded for a solid relief guy, since we're dreaming, a LH who can get hitters of either batter's box out.

 

In reality, I assume we'll shop Geoff, Kevin, and Brady and take in return the most we can get. Since the major league roster appears full and actually has 3-5 decent bench players who are out of options who may not make the team (Rivera, Nix, Sarfate, Hendrickson), one or two of them could be added to a deal to get back a reliever and/or prospects.

[sbrylski]

I'd love to see a package of any number of the following:

 

Mench, Jenkins, Jackson, Gwynn, Turnbow, Miller, Rivera, Clark

 

for a very good OFer.

 

However, I'll predict Mench or Jenkins goes for either a lefty reliever or an average AA SP prospect. Probably Mench.

[colbyjack]

I don't know if the Suppan signing really changes things. Were the Brewers going to get a solid starting pitcher by trading Jenkins, Mench and/or Clark, or some combination of the three? Rodrigo Lopez seemed to be the most intriguing name tossed around, and I'm glad the Brewers ended up with Suppan and not Lopez.

 

As others have noted, I do think the Suppan signing may have given the Brewers more flexibility in what they can ask for Mench, Jenkins, Clark, etc., in that they may be looking for prospects as opposed to proven big-leaguers. I agree with most that I would like to see a bullpen arm added (Jenkins for Benitez?), and I think we could see more rumor activity surrounding Turnbow, particularly with the Red Sox now that the Indians have signed Foulke. The Red Sox also seem to be looking for a 4th or 5th OF, and I think Coco Crisp is a name that could be tossed around a little bit more. However, I don't view Crisp as a real addition to the team (his numbers quite simply aren't that great), and he certainly doesn't help out the outfield glut, but a Clark/Mench + Turnbow deal may garner a Crisp + prospect return and could set up a possible Jenkins for reliever type of deal (I still think the Cardinals are a good fit for Jenkins, even if it is a deal within the division, and I have no clue who the Brewers would ask for and/or expect in return).

 

Similar to the notion that Sexson would be traded a few years ago and that the same would happen to Overbay last offseason, I am pretty sure the Brewers won't enter the 2007 season with Jenkins, Mench and Clark all on the roster. Melvin has seemed to make it pretty clear that Hall and Hart will be everyday starters in the OF, and Gross seems like a lock to be the primary backup, leaving spots for two of the Jenkins/Mench/Clark tandem. The free agent outfielder class seems to be the slowest group of players to sign, and I'm guessing once a few more of those outfielders have signed the Brewers will find a market for one of their extras as well.

[mothershipconnection]

Suppan's big paycheck may mean that Jenkins can now be had cheaply, because you have to imagine the payroll is stretched to near the max. If anyone is shopped even more than before, I'd put my bet on Jenks.

[endaround]

Well given the Brewers supposed had about $6 million to spend before the signing, any of Clark, Jenkins, and Mench could be had cheaply. I do expect one to be quickly salary dumped, but Clark is unlikely to give much, maybe a $2 million saving if lucky.

[DannyKmilw]

vs. rhps

1Gross lf

2Hart rf

3Weeks 2b

4Fielder 1b

5Hall cf

6Estrada c

7Koskie 3b

8Hardy ss

 

vs. lhps

1Weeks 2b

2Graffy 3b

3Hart rf

4Fielder 1b

5Hall cf

6Estrada c

7Mench lf

8Hardy ss

 

my hope is that we move Jenks at the least if not Mench also.

But i would like two see Gross get his chance at least against the rhps, which he rips against.

 

Just working with what we have now. But id love to move a run producer like Weeks down if possible, not many RBIs to be had with 7 8 9 holes in front of you. Hart may be an option to some but he also is a natural run producer more value lower IMO.

[bsglorydays]

Bullpen help.

 

If Jenkins and / or Mench are dealt, I will be very disappointed if it doesn't net the Brewers at least one solid RP with a good track record. I'd rather see Mench be the one to go, but with Gross still in the mix as a LH hitter, I would imagine Jenkins would be the most likely trade piece.

[Invader3K]

Bullpen help will probably be what we get at this point, but I'd love to see any combination of the guys mentioned (Jenkins, Clark, Mench, etc.) flipped for a big hitting corner OFer. I really think the Brewers need one more big bat in the lineup, as I don't see Jenkins returning to pre-2005 form. That way, we'd have Hall/Hart/??? as the starters, with Gross as the primary backup.

 

That said, I have no problem with Weeks being the leadoff batter. I'd love to see Tony Gwynn Jr. evolve into that role, but I doubt it will happen by Opening Day 2007.

[recte44]

I still think that we're too quick to give up on Jenkins. I would be very happy to see him in the starting lineup come Opening Day.

[sbrylski]

I still think that we're too quick to give up on Jenkins. I would be very happy to see him in the starting lineup come Opening Day.

 

I agee, and would be happy as well. But one of them has to go. I like Jenkins over Mench as an everyday starter, but Mench sort of fits our team needs better by killing lefties.

 

If Mench gets traded Jenkins will start and Clark will see some time against lefties. Gross would act as the backup at all three positions.

 

If Jenkins gets traded, I think Mench and Gross would split time against RHP, and Mench would start verse LHP. So Mench would get ~2/3rds of the AB's from LF, while Gross takes the other ~1/3. If one is outhitting the other, he will get more playing time. Clark would act as the 5th outfielder.

 

I'm fine with either option, so make the deal that gives us the best return.

[MNBrew]

I agree that Jenkins still has the potential to perform very well, warts and all. However, I remember reading in a recent JSOnline column a reiteration of either TH's or DO's assertion that Jenkins' ongoing insistence that he's a great player and doesn't really need to make significant adjustments REALLY sat poorly within the clubhouse, with the front office, or both.

 

Despite his other virtues, I wouldn't be surprised if that cinched his eventual way out of town.

 

As it stands now, we have 6 OFs and 6 IFs before factoring in Laynce Nix, Vinny Rottino, Gwynn, or anyone else who might have a shot at playing their way onto the roster. So unless they plan to change course and go with an 11-man pitching staff all year, at least one outfielder and maybe more won't be around by the start of the season.

[Brew Man Dan]

I think we can carry Cordero, Turnbow, Capellan, Shouse, Sarfate, Wise and Aquino in the 'pen, however, that means Vargas is our 5th starter and Villy goes to AAA. We could also trade wise/aquino and Mench/jenkins for a solid RP.

[dhoffman19]

I agree with MNBrew that Jenkins' attitude - real or perceived - is a problem with the organization. It seemed to me that Yost took a few subtle digs at Jenkins last year without bringing him up by name. For instance, Jenkins said he wouldn't get rid of the leg kick in mid-season. Then when Clark changed his batting stance in the middle of the year, Yost went out of his way to praise Clark for being so courageous to take a chance like that, hinting that others on the team should follow his lead.

 

I realize others may disagree, but I'd be happy to see him go. It's just too painful to watch him swing and miss at sliders in the dirt any more.

[monty57]

I agree with MNBrew that Jenkins is gone. Last season ended with his tearful goodbye. He's given Brewer fans a lot, and will probably still be a useful player, but everything I've seen points to Jenkins playing elsewhere in 2007.

 

I project an OF of Hall, Hart and a Gross/Mench platoon, with Brady as 5th OF/PH/defensive replacement. Although we should get decent production from that group, if we're in the playoff hunt, we'll probably make the "Hot stove" lists as suitors for an OF in the last year of his contract.

 

The IF is set with Fielder, Weeks, Hardy, Koskie (sounds like he'll be healthy... at least I hope), Estrada. Counsell backup SS/2B, Graffy backup 3B/2B. Miller is b/u cather, but I still think he could be traded. Hopefully one won't be needed much, but who is the backup 1B? I'd guess Graffanino. I've always thought Hart would fill this, but it hasn't happened so far.

 

The starting rotation should be Sheets, Capuano, Suppan, Bush, Vargas with Carlos V in AAA to start the season, getting called up when one of the starters goes down. It'll happen, so we might as well prepare ourselves for it.

 

Someone from the pen needs to be traded to make room for Sarfate, and an earlier poster menioned that Hendrickson is out of options, so I could see him either traded or used as the long man to start the season (Yost only uses the long man about once a month when his starters are healthy, and that's when the starter gives up about seven runs in two innings, so I don't want to see Carlos V or Vargas in this role). I also believe Vargas has much more worth (either as a player or as trade bait) as a starter than he does out of the pen.

 

That leaves Jenkins, one of the backup catchers (I'm still leaning towards Miller) and at least one person from the bullpen (Turnbow's probably the one being "shopped" the most) as the most-likely-to-be-traded players on the current roster.

 

As has been mentioned by others, I'd shoot for prospects and/or a potential quantity-for-quality bullpen arm in return. I'd love to see Melvin pull another Carlos Lee out of his hat, but I don't think even Melvin is good enough to pull off another trade like that again.

[Invader3K]

It would be pretty weird if Jenkins is still on the Brewers roster, come Opening Day. He'd be kind of like an albatross on the team.