Melvin's Odd Men Out- Turnbow, Miller, Mench?

[rickh150]

Melvin has indicated over the last 3 months that multiple inquiries were made on Mench and Turnbow. Also, with Rivera's good year as a cheap back-up, it may come down to Miller, along with Mench, Turnbow, and a prospect being turned for something...eh, maybe anything.

 

Melvin, in a recent interview, said that the Brewers are way over their budget. Yet, what puzzled me was his comment on how the Brewers were not forced to dump players. I really appreciate Melvin's skills and trade maker, but he has not been real straight with the media over his few years here. In fact, his words are more and more proving to not carry much weight. His actions are bold and calculated, but he does not usually tip his hand one way or the other. So I'm calling him on this one. He's in dump mode.

 

The Brewers are over budget and these extra pieces of the Brewers have no clear cut role. Turnbow can go somewhere to be a probable closer. I don't think Ned wants to pencil wildness into the middle innings in Milwaukee. We might even get a hefty return for him. Mench is experienced and has put up good numbers. Right now, he's a platoon, at best. We need more. He'll also be under contract for 2 years. Miller could be a valuable back-up for a number of teams looking for a vet. Throw in Hendrickson, who has run out of options, and the Brewers might be able to swing a nice return, a return, or eh, nothing.... but the money, regardless of what Doug might say.

 

EDIT: Removed excessive punctuation in subject line -- Brian

[dadofandrew]

Miller would start for half the teams in MLB, and he'll only make $2.25M...Counsell was signed to be a reserve for $3M, Graffy will make about $2.5M as well.

 

I certainly have read nothing to indicate Miller's $1.825 over Rivera will be a reason to dump him. The Crew's bench is now loaded with vets who could start for some, and are top backups. This is the way Doug planned it.

[sbrylski]

I think you have correctly identified the three that are most likely to go, though it really isn't anything new.

 

I do think we will probably see two of these four... - Turnbow, Miller, Mench, Jenkins - ...go in the next month, or maybe a move during ST (maybe they really like what they see in Closser and then decide to trade Miller).

 

I don't think we will get a great return on any of them, but I don't think they will have to be given away. There has been some genuine interest in them.

 

IMO, the ideal trades with these players would be to get prospects in return for Turnbow and/or Miller, and then trade Mench or Jenkins for a decent reliever that we won't have to wonder if he will return to form. It would clear out two logjams, strengthen the bullpen, and boost the farm.

[Weirdos19]

Jenkins and Turnbow for Cla Meredith.

 

If we have to give em 3 million, fine.

[hauser42]

I don't see Miller going anywhere unless some one overpays for him. He is a solid, cheap, vet catcher. We learned last year that qaulity depth is needed. Riviera had a nice run, but he has done the same thing in the past and never kept it for extended periods.

[endaround]

How come Clark is never brought up? Even if he only bring $1 million in salary relief his opening up a spot is worth it.

[TooLiveBrew]

end, that's a good point, and I think he is brought up, but much less frequently.

 

The main reason I think Jenks & Mench get named first is that Clark has never voiced the mindset that "I''m a starter!!" *insert chest-thumping here*

 

Plus, as you mention, his salary being the lowest of the three also makes him a natural 3d choice on that list. If we can't move Jenks and/or Mench, I do agree that moving Clark is better than not moving anything at all.

 

(I just have faith that at least one of Menchkins will be gone, and optimistically - perhaps naiively - I think of a LHRP in return....)

[JohnBriggs12]

"Jenkins and Turnbow for Cla Meredith"

 

Sounds good to me Weirdos.

 

I totally disagree with the notion that Miller is a "must keep".

 

Yeah, Al, he's not all that expensive, but when you are over budget, $1.85 million is still real money. It takes two 30,000 crowds to accumulate that revenue @ $30 per fan. I happen to think Rivera is better now than Miller, but I can understand the arguments on the other side. But they not only have Rivera but Closser who has major league experience too. Besides, Estrada is going to catch 110 games at least.

 

hauser42,

 

Rivera has been raking ever since he's been Brewer property.

An .895 OPS at Nashville in 05, .827 in 06, then .774 as a Brewer in 06. He's hit 32 HR and driven in 113 runs in 569 AB's in that time. That's quite a bit more than a "nice run".

[brettac1]

I just don't think Miller will get traded, just because he's a hometown-type of guy, and I don't see them trading him when he signed with the Brewers with the intention of retiring as one at the end of his contract. Not that I entirely agree with that way of thinking, though.

 

I think Mench, and maybe Turnbow will get traded. I also think, though, that people who are clammoring for bullpen help in return might be overreaching, I think it would be a pure salary dump for an organizational soldier-type guy.

[twobrewers]

I know lots of people have been inquiring about Turnbow, but I don't really see the appeal of trading him away.

 

As far as former all-star closers go, his salary of 2.3M in 2007 and 3.2M in 2008 doesn't seem unreasonable. Not to mention that I believe the Brewers approached Coco about an extension and nothing has happened yet...

 

My thinking is, Coco closes in 2007. Hopefully Turnbow turns things around and can take back his closer role in 2008, when Coco signs elsewhere for 6M a year.

 

Projecting everything forward to 2008 we have a VERY strong offensive potential and strong pitching (Sheets, Cap, Sup, Bush, Yo) I don't foresee Melvin trading Turnbow and leaving a HUGE hole (bullpen) to deal with for 2008.

 

Jenkins makes the most sense to trade - since he clears the most salary. Mench can't be too far behind - but I have to think one of them will still be around.

 

Now, as we get towards the middle of the season...Braun comes up. I think Koskie is VERY likely to be dealt by midseason.

[RobertR]

I'm not against the idea of trading Clark. That said, Clark can play CF and complements Gross as a backup outfielder nicely. Defensive flexibility is a plus.

 

I do agree an extra outfielder for a reliable reliever makes a lot of sense. Ideally, I'd like to deal Mench. He's only really valuable with the bat against lefties and he's the worst defender of the bunch. Then again, other teams may think that too which would limit his value as trade bait. Jenkins, even with the big contract, is the veteran outfielder with the most value. Of course, the Brewers are planning to contend, so does it make sense to deal one of your better outfielders on a team that might struggle some for offense?

 

Robert

[endaround]

I really think the Brewers shouldn't be looking to get a majo league player but instead should be focused on getting a right handed Gross type. A corner outfielder who maybe too old to be a prospect but has at least shown something. Since the Brewers need a corner OFer next year either to start of to platoon with Gross it makes sense. Could of sworn the Brewers had one of those lying around last year....

[MNBrew]

While the OF thing is still a major mess, it seems pretty evident that with the total dearth at all levels of baseball at the catching position, the last thing the Brewers need to do is trade depth. The 2006 season proved again what can happen when you don't have that depth. While his salary is proportionally high for a part-time/reserve-type catcher, I don't see Damian Miller going anywhere unless the Brewers are completely blown away by a trade proposal.

 

That said, on Sportscenter tonight, they had a thing with the Top 10 team needs. At about #4, the Dodgers need a power hitter. At #2, the Red Sox need a closer. Sounds like Jenkins and Turnbow, respectively, if the Brewers can find a match with those teams. Oh, and the White Sox still need a CF, which sounds like Brady Clark. Not that it's that simple, but if they could free up that $13M in salary with minimal cost in return, they could still go out and get someone else for another gap (5th OF) if they felt so compelled (and if a deal were there to be had for the guys they'd target).

[danzig6767]

I sure hope the Brewers don't do some salary dump of Turnbow without getting much of anything of value back.With the shaky status of the pen,Turnbow rebounding to just being a solid setup man would be huge.Him finding control again of his slider is some unrealistic pipedream.

[Invader3K]

I think they could flip Turnbow for a high pitching prospect, or maybe a reliever, like they did with Danny Kolb a couple years ago (Cappellan).

[filthyfrog]

Turnbow's trade value is too low right now to trade him. I say keep him and hope that his slider returns. If it does, we'd have a knock out one-two punch at the back end of the bullpen.

 

And as I've said all offseason, we need to keep Jenkins for his contract year, unless we get a ridiculously good offer for him. Geoff's ready to bust out.

 

On the other hand, I'd be happy with getting anything for Mench. I would have been ok with non-tendering him, but maybe we can get a decent A-ball prospect for him. I'm not hoping for anything more.

[brewmann04]

Melvin talked about looking for a lefty reliever and a long Man

any thoughts who still might be aviabale

[dpapo]

I guess this is getting a bit off topic, but before Suppan signed I made a list of some of the free agent starting pitchers available in the event that Suppan wasn't signed. So some of the pitchers from that list could possible be signed to fill the long relief role.

Some of the names included,

Tony Armas, John Thomson, Chan Ho Park, Mark Redman, Ramon Ortiz, Brandon Claussen, Bruce Chen, Brian Moehler, Russ Ortiz...

Someone also added Jorge Sosa, who would probably fill that long relief, emergency starter role quite well.

 

As far as left handed relievers, here is another list of possiblities. May be missing a couple names and I'm not sure on the health status of all of them, but here is a list.

Edde Guardado, Kent Mercker, Arthur Rhodes, Scott Schoenewies, Ron Villone, Scott Saucerbeck, Randy Choate, Mike Koplove and Tom Martin.

 

Edit: A few other names out there, as far as the that long relief role:

Aaron Sele, Brian Sweeney, Ryan Franklin, Travis Harper, Jason Johnson, Aaron Small, Ryan Vogelsong...

 

Going through the list of possible players made me think of a couple quotes from the movie Major Leagues,

 

Board Member 1: "I've never heard of half of these guys and the ones I do know are way past their prime."

Charlie Donovan: "Most of these guys never had a prime."

 

And

 

Board Member 2: "This guy here is dead."

Rachel Phelps: "Cross him off then."

[dadofandrew]

I'd say Jorge Sosa or Mark Redman would be all but perfect as far as the long relief/spot starter role, as would Jerome Williams.

 

But, given inflation, these guys might well get $3M as teams figure out they need SP's. Sadly, if they are willing to accept less, say $750K, they won't want to come to MIL, even if they're given guaranteed deals, as the opportunity may not be nearly as much with the Crew as elsewhere.

[TooLiveBrew]

From the list of LHRP, I still would like a look at Kent Mercker. He's 39, but TJ surgery is notorious for successful comebacks (although I'll admit I don't know if being "older" affects that). Per Rotoworld:

Quote:

---

Free agent Kent Mercker, who appeared likely to retire after undergoing Tommy John surgery in August, wants to pitch again next season.

"When I first had [the injury], in my mind, I didn't want to play anymore. What's the point?" Mercker said. "I went through the surgery. Why not go through the rehab? You can't play this game long enough. It's the best job on Earth. It's a cliché, but it really is if you have the opportunity to do it. Not many other companies are calling me to say 'If you're able to, we'll pay you X amount of money to play a game.' I figure if I get one that does do it, I should take advantage of it." The soon-to-be 39-year-old left-hander will probably have to accept a minor league deal in order to continue his career. He has spoken with the Reds.

---

I'd certainly take a stab at Mercker for a minor-league deal with a ST invite. And, to be honest, if it'd take a one-year MLB deal (@ appx. $700k), I'd do it.

 

Over the last 3 seasons, his WHIP is 1.34, his ERA+ is 138, and FIP = 4.79. None of those are all-star or world-beating, but I'll take the chance to give us another LHRP

[dadofandrew]

I assumed Mercker would retire or sign with the Reds.

[Ennder]

Being over budget and being so far over budget you have to dump salary are two different things. I'm sure they'd like to dump some of the dead weight in the OF but I don't think they HAVE to dump salary either,

[thefutureishere2006]

i think clark isn't mentioned becuase i think he has more value coming off the bench than mench. mench seems to be the guy that needs the consistent ABS. i think clark can get back to decency off the bench for milwaukee.