Which pitcher is the best bait?

[UWRyan428]

It would seem that, if CV the Elder were to repeat his performance last year and Big Ben continues to take his Centrums, we should have a dominating rotation. Moreoever, with CV the Younger on the horizon, we seem to have a White Sox problem of sorts. To wit, we also have a outfielder surplus that needs to be rectified. And with pitching at a total premium and our farm producing pitchers like rabbits produce...well you get what I'm saying. We have surplus...pitchers and corners. We need....OBO?? :-)

[pogokat]

i dont think we have a pitching surplus myself...maybe next offseason...but theres no pressure to use Carlos v. or Yo next season...they are both young and should benefit from taking it slower in AAA...

 

I'm sure CV the younger will wind up getting a shot this year...i' just glad the brewers wont be forced to run the entire nashville rotation onto the field this year...

[UWRyan428]

Well I would hope to see some CV the Younger and ZachJack during the upcoming season, hopefully in sterling fashion.

[Nader Raider Tim]

I said it in another thread but, I will restate my ideas on this topic. The Brewers are in a position that they are solid with veterans in their starting rotation, and have 2-4 young pitchers that could/will contribute (at some point). Should the Brewers try adamantly to trade away one member of that bundle or not?

 

I personally think that Melvin should put his feelers out there on the trade value of Capuano, Vargas, and Villenueva. Melvin should then do a cost-benefit analysis on any offers. If the Brewers can trade away some of that "depth" and get a very good young leadoff candidate, or a 3-4-5 hitter it should at least be mulled over.

 

The option should be explored.

[pogokat]

the brewers have control of vargas, capuano and others for 3 + years each, so playing out a season or two before trading them is possible...and if having the depth gives the crew a better shot at making the playoffs, they should probably be held another season or two...

 

if carlos v. or Yo. are so dominant that they have to jump in the rotation in mid july, then the crew can trade someone then..

[splitterpfj]

I agree with Pogo on this one.

 

If a great deal comes along, that's one thing, but I think the team should move slowly here, pitching depth is a great thing to have, and vital to a postseason run. If a AAA pitcher is red hot in June or July, maybe then, but caution makes the most sense today.

[Nader Raider Tim]

Hey I pretty much agree with both of you about wanting pitching depth....BUT, if you can turn a player that will pitch every 5th day, and you have a decent alternative option, you should be open to trade possibilities.

 

Players I would hope to be part of any potential deal including one of our pitchers:

 

Alex Rios

Garret Atkins

Brad Hawpe

Chad Tracy

Crawford

Baldelli

 

Basically if the Brewers could turn one of their quality pitcher into an everyday leadoff, or 3-4-5, hitter, I would be totally in favor of it.

[UWRyan428]

My purpose wasn't to advocate trading from our depth so much as which pitcher's value to another team is greater than his value to us... Ben Sheets' value to us is too much to quantify with trade value. Dave Bush's value fluctuates a lot but his value to us would probably be greater than what most would give us in trade. CV the Elder is new to our organization and deserves a chance in the keg. Thus, to me, it's Cappy vs. CV the Younger. I was just curious which of the two would seem more expendable to the masses. Obviously, Cappy's value is higher, both to us and others, as he is less than a year removed from all-star status (or perhaps he still is considered an all-star as he has yet to be unthroned in theory). CV the Younger's value to us would seem to be greater than his value to others, in that he ended the year on such a great streak while Cappy's numbers (record) fell off. I guess I'm just trying to convince myself that we're about to get another indirect gift from Richie Sexson.

[aracko]

I thought alot about this over the weekend. I really think 6 starting pitchers was a necessity that Doug and Mark discussed. They dont want what happened last year to happen this year if they lose a starter. There is definatly no plan to trade any of our starters. Should we lose sheets, bush, Suppan, Capuano, or Vargas the team can survive pretty well by plugging Villaneuva into the rotation. In the meantime, he can go back to AAA and work on perfecting his trade and becoming a better pitcher.

[twobrewers]

I am already drooling over our 2008 rotation.

 

Sheets

Cappy

Bush

Suppan

Yo

 

For 2008, that would leave CV (The elder) CV (The younger) and also Inman and Zack Jack on the outside.

 

Honestly, the best part of the Suppan signing is that it gives us a bridge to get to some of our younger players.

 

I am not expecting any trades this year - as the depth with be important. But, if everyone stays healthy in 2007 we will almost certainly trade one of our starters. (Hopefully CV - the elder)

[JohnBriggs12]

Let's look at the two teams that played last season in the NLCS, the Mets and Cardinals.

 

On both pitching staffs were young pitchers who came up as starters who were big contributors in the bullpen.

 

I'm referring to Aaron Heilman and Adam Wainwright. Both ended up in the bullpen because they were crowded out by veteran starters and both contributed valuable innings for their respective teams. Now Wainwright is being counted on to start for St. Louis.

 

Now while I'm still not convinced Villanueva still isn't one of the 5 best starters, I'm virtually certain he's one of the 10 best pitchers on the major league roster and therefore should be on the Brewers on opening day even if it means in a relief role.

 

He's logged enough innings in the minors and been successful in more than 50 big league innings. He should be rewarded with a spot on the Brewers. Sure, in case of an injury he might not be as stretched out as needed right away, but that can be accomplished soon enough.

[sbrylski]

Briggs, I see Villanueva coming up at the first injury and getting starts. I think next year Gallardo could be our Wainwright. He could come up in the second half if he is pitching in AAA as well as he did in AA.

 

As the 6th starter, Villanueva will get time.

[Hammer]

I am in the camp of trying to build from a sudden area of success. An article on si.com says that the Yanks are still in need of pitching. Would they have anyone available in trade for one of our lesser starting pitchers? C Vargas anyone? Could a trade of Vargas + someone get Hughes +?

[pogokat]

yeah, vargas + sheets maybe...

[trwi7]

I wonder what Vargas is worth in a trade. I bet we could get a decent relief pitcher for him.

[TooLiveBrew]

True, but we could get more than that, I guarantee you. He's a low-priced SP in the current economic climate. Almost any team would jump at the chance to add him (as we did) even though he's not without some blemishes.

 

Look at what Melvin's gotten in the recent trades. If he couldn't get an everyday OFer for Vargas alone, I'd be shocked

[pogokat]

i think vargas will surprise next year...trading him now would be a waste of resources...there's no impetus to do it, and theres a very good chance his value is even higher next year...

[TooLiveBrew]

I agree, Pogo, I was merely debating his perceived value.

[UWRyan428]

I wonder if Dave Bush might be enough to pry Phil Hughes from the Yanks. He has had success against the Yanks as well as within the AL East and he proved last year that he is truly an up and comer in the pitching ranks. Then again, if roles were reversed, I would be a bit hesitant. Nevertheless, Bush is projected to be our second best starter next year.

[trwi7]

Why would we trade Bush for a guy wo has never pitched an inning in the majors? With our luck Bush becomes a Cy Young winner and Hughes blows out his arm.

[TooLiveBrew]

Quote:

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I wonder if Dave Bush might be enough to pry Phil Hughes from the Yanks.

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Ryan and trwi7, there is no ____ way the Yanks trade Hughes. I follow them closely enough to know that, if we're talking about giving a pitcher to get Hughes, the only one that'd get it done by himself would be Sheets.

 

I'm not joking. This is their YoGa, and you all know how much hype explodes a player's value in that system. Trouble is, the hype is legit: Hughes can whirl.

 

I completely disagree with the original post to start this thread. Trading away pitching now, on the verge of big things in Milwaukee, is taking a backward step. I know steps backward can lead to bigger steps forward, but I just don't see that here.

[endaround]

Vargas will be gone in one or two seasons. Suppan likely in two unless they can't sign Sheets. Capuano will likely be gone in 3. Things will more than sort themselves out.