Proposed Hardy & others trade.

[bando1234]

Since our outfield is in a mess & we have Hall locked up for a while it got me thinking. Could we put Hall back at short & trade Hardy,Carlos V, & Gwynn Jr for a bat. I would love to trade them for Carl Crawford but I dont think that would happen.

 

The two names that came to mind are Baldelli or Teahen. I think we are in win now mode. I know we have Braun at 3rd but he is not a good defensive 3rd baseman. Hes not BJ Upton awful but I think Teahen would be better, As for Baldelli hes locked up for a while & can play a good defensive center & can hit & steal a base. We could probblay get Upton & plug him in center & leadoff but I dont want a poor defensive player with an attitude.

 

I think out two biggest problems in 07 will be our defense & our bats. This could be a way to fix some of those problems. Just want to to see what others think.

[UWRyan428]

Teahan would be a welcome option, as I was thinking of his acquisition since the end of last year. I just have a hard time imagining the Royals would be open to trading him, as he is young and cheap. I know that Gordon is waiting, but he could easily be shifted to the outfield, or even first, as was the case with Team USA when they also had Ryan Zimmerman.

As for Baldelli, I am definitely in the camp that wants to see Rocco in Brew Crew Blue but it would take a bit to make such a transaction, as the Rays are of the opinion, rightfully so, that they are not going to be forced to make room for their young prospects until an overwhelming deal comes along. Both CC and Rocco have very palatable contracts. Also, JJ's value is quite low righ tnow so let's put off trading the gent until he at least brings his career average to .275-.280.

[wickedheat]

I think any deal to bring in a bat, especially an outfielder, needs to involve one or more of the following being shipped out: Jenkins, Clark, Gross, or Mench. That is aside from shipping out Hardy and Carlos V. and moving Hall to short, if that is indeed what we're talking about. Gwynn is likely at AAA for most of the year, regardless of the OF logjam.

 

I'll stay away from the Hall to 3rd option (which I prefer) to keep this thread on track. The problem with trading Hardy is that he needs a full season healthy to show what he can do and get some decent trade value. Which, I believe the popular opinion is that he'll do quite well if he stays healthy. If that happens, do you trade him now that he has value? I say keep him as a cheap, talented young SS.

 

I think the Brewers need to let a healthy JJ and Rickie entrench themselves in the middle infield. You could argue switching Hall and Weeks at 2B-CF. Or you could argue Hall to 3B, some combo of Gross/Hart/Clark in CF, hoping Hart plays full time 'tween CF and one of the corners. THEN, to get back to your trade for a bat (sorry for the rambling): You're left without Hardy in the trade, but Carlos V., one or 2 of our 'extra' OFs, and maybe you add a pitching prospect to get the coveted bat.

 

I don't have enough baseball knowledge of other teams' needs and who matches up well with the Crew. Does anyone know of a team out there that could use a quantity for quality type deal like this?

 

Sorry if this post rambles. I usually lurk here and am amazed at many of the well-thought-out and well-written posts, especially the ones who keep the thread on topic. Thanks for all the great posts everyone, and thanks to Brian and Brewerfan.net for this site. I'd say it's like crack to me, but I have never done crack.

[UWRyan428]

Just out of curiousity, what would be the asking price for Teahan in everyone's opinion? Villy or Inman? I would have to say that a young, highly-talented middle-of-the-order bat that is also quite cheap...well wouldn't be cheap.

[Crewin06]

I seriously don't think the Brewers need a huge boost for the outfield at the begining of the year. I think they need to start using some of their tier 2 prospects to get the bat at the deadline.

 

I posted it on the General board earlier in the middle of a long thread and I will post it again here.

 

If Atlanta is struggling at the deadline and looking like they won't be able to sign Andrew Jones and our pitching is healthy I could see a trade looking something like

 

Carlos Villanueva/Zach Jackson

Mench/Gross

and

Gwynn/Fermaint/Perez/Irrabarren

 

For Andrew Jones

 

Then at the end of the season offer Jones arbitration and try to offer him a reasonable contract. If he accepts GREAT. If he doesn't take the two draft picks and continue the minors pipeline.

 

But at playoff time could you imagine Weeks leading off and Jones, Fielder, and Billy Hall anchoring the middle of the lineup. It gets me excited right now just thinking about it.

[UWRyan428]

Bringing in Andruw Jones would be a great infusion of power to our lineup, but then do you shift Billy to left for the final push, thus, again, cramping an already cramped field of outfielders? Also, I know Andruw is truly spectacular with the bat and is still young by free agent standards, but isn't that a lot to give up for a guy who is still bumping up our payroll $10mil (I believe he's making $18.5mil, cut in half...)?

[Crewin06]

Quote:

---

Bringing in Andruw Jones would be a great infusion of power to our lineup, but then do you shift Billy to left for the final push, thus, again, cramping an already cramped field of outfielders? Also, I know Andruw is truly spectacular with the bat and is still young by free agent standards, but isn't that a lot to give up for a guy who is still bumping up our payroll $10mil (I believe he's making $18.5mil, cut in half...)?

---

 

I was thinking of it more along the lines if Koskie isn't able to go. With that Scenario, Hall would be the starter at third for the full year. Making the move to Centerfield next year. I think Billy would make the Sacrafice to be on the best team possible.

 

If Koskie is Healthy and playing 3rd base well. Its even better for the Brewers.

 

Can you imagine an outfield of Jones, Hall, Hart and a bench of Jenkins, Mench/Gross.

 

That is one of the if not THE best outfields in the majors.

 

I don't know salary part for Jones definitely but on Cott's page which seems pretty accurate for the Brewers it says that Jones is due 13.5 million for 2007. Half would be just under 7 million.

 

Yeah it's alot of money but I think Mark A. would pull the trigger if the situation presented itself.

 

As for the prospect info.

 

I just don't see where any of these guys fit into the Brewers plans over the next 2 years.

 

I mean Where exactly does Villanueva AND Zach Jackson fit in. Where do Mench AND Gross really fit in. This can all change with injuries. But right now the starting rotation looks pretty stocked for the next 2 years and somehow Yovanni Gallardo is going to get in there.

 

Wouldn't some of these guys be better used to aquire a super stud for a playoff push and give Jack Z (I believe that is his name) a couple more chips to get premiere prospects.

 

He has done a rediculous job aquiring talent in the draft over the past couple years. Why not reload hard at the end of the season again.

 

My lineup for the Playoff Push assuming a Villanueva, Fermaint, Mench Trade and a Koskie Injury would be

 

1.) Weeks - 2B

2.) Estrada - C

3.) Jones - CF

4.) Prince - 1B

5.) Hall - 3B

6.) Jenkins - LF

7.) Hart - RF

8.) Hardy - SS

 

Bench

Gross

Miller

Braun

Counsell

Graffinino

 

Our Pitching would still be the same and we would have Gallardo, Jackson, Dillard and Hammond waiting in the wings at AAA.

 

Plus the Brewers would get at least one sandwich pick and the team likely to look at Jones will be the top team in the league so the Brewers would likely get another 1st round pick.

 

If Koskie is playing and playing well at 3rd you can see how much more potent that makes our offense both offensively and defensively with Jones, Hall and Hart/Jenkins patrolling the outfield.

[valpocrewsader]

...and then we can lock up Jones long term and he can break the all-time HR record here in Milwaukee, continuing the tradition. Love it.

 

If this team had Jones in CF and Hall at 3B going into 2007, my expectations would be monumentally high. He's the type of piece that I feel is still missing from our lineup (Carlos' void), which -- imo -- will cause us to hover at or below .500 next year.

[hauser42]

Teahan is not coming to Milwaukee anytime soon. Royals have stated he was moving to LF this season to make room for Gordon. They have no need to move him and actually upgrade the team with him out there. Dejesus is supposedly going to play CF this year for them.

 

Hardy is locked in right now at SS, with Hall moved to OF Brewers seem to think Hardy is the future.

 

As much as I like Jones, I think it pipedream that he would sign a deal with us. He most likely needs to be overpaid to stay in Brew town.

[Crewin06]

I don't think Jones would sign a deal with us. The whole point of the trade was to make a push this year. In the second half. If the Brewers are doing well.

 

Then Cash in with the first round picks when the season is over.

 

As for the Power Void left by Carlos.

 

Bill Hall just hit more home runs and had more extra base hits last year than Carlos Lee ever hit before last year. And in my best guestimation will ever hit again.

[Riebes24]

Bill Hall just hit more home runs and had more extra base hits last year than Carlos Lee ever hit before last year. And in my best guestimation will ever hit again.

 

You do realize he's playing in Houston now right? With the ridiculously absurd 200-somthing foot fence (well it certainly feels that way) in left field, he'll probably hit 10 more HR's next year.

[sbrylski]

You do realize he's playing in Houston now right? With the ridiculously absurd 200-somthing foot fence (well it certainly feels that way) in left field, he'll probably hit 10 more HR's next year.

 

I loved this chart when I saw it. Craig Biggio's home runs last year:

 

http://www.hittrackeronline.com/parks/Biggio_Craig_2006_scatter.jpg

[Riebes24]

Wow, that's good stuff - Thanks sbryliski. I have a hard time watching Brewer games in Houston - I loathe that ballpark.

[TooLiveBrew]

Riebes -- ME TOO! And sbryl, that chart is awesome

 

Actually, my frothing at the mouth months ago on how I loathe that park - and my subsequent posterior-oriented nickname for the Astros - got me my first warning on BF.net ever!

 

awwwwww....

[hauser42]

I don't think Jones would sign a deal with us. The whole point of the trade was to make a push this year. In the second half. If the Brewers are doing well.

 

Then Cash in with the first round picks when the season is over

 

Hall is not going to be moved back to SS if we do that trade, mybe in to 3B, but more likely to LF. I would not like the trade if they have no shot of bringing back Jones for a couple of years. This is not a older team that is trying to make one last run at a title.

 

 

Also think we have to offer a high end prospect to get Jones from the Braves. We are offering a lot of mid range guys at best from the proposal I say in this thread.

[Crewin06]

I don't think people get the point of the trade I made.

 

If you don't here is the point.

 

Right now Villanueva/Jackson and Mench/Gross could probably start on Various teams throughout league.

 

Right now the Brewers have a surplus of 3rd starters in the outfield and 5/6th starting pitchers.

 

If the team is relatively healthy at the deadline why not trade some of these extra pieces for one sure fire superstar.

 

With Villanueva/Jackson gone the brewers still have the one that doesn't get traded and Gallardo in the minors for pitchers. They still have a surplus of outfielders in the Majors. And they still have a pretty good minor league system.

 

The reason we wouldn't sign Andruw Jones after the season is because he will likely command over 18 million a year for 6 to 7 years on the open market. A figure that the Brewers can not afford. To think otherwise is just rediculous.

 

As to the person that thinks we should add more. I would tell him that that deal is probably overpaying for a half year of service.

 

Young pitching is a top commodity. Especially young pitching that could do a decent job if given a starting spot. To throw in an Outfielder that could at least be the 4th outfielder on a lot of teams and another mid-level prospect likely to play in the majors someday is alot for a 3 month rental and 2 prospects that haven't played a day of minor league ball.

 

The more I think about this trade the more I see Melvin planning it right now.

[hauser42]

Right now Villanueva/Jackson and Mench/Gross could probably start on Various teams throughout league.

 

My issue is I'm not sold that the Braves give up Jones for those players. I know he is only a rent a player, but I feel they can get more for him.

[UWRyan428]

Also, with the sale of the Braves, I find it hard to believe they would trade one of their most recognizable stars for anything less than a "name", if only a prospect "name". Also, it wouldn't be a one year rental, as they would only trade him if they fell off a great deal and were completely eliminated. I would say that Torii Hunter is the better trade target for a one year rental, if you're looking.

[Crewin06]

I don't really consider Torri Hunter a super star.

 

Sure he is a nice player and an upgrade, but I don't think I would give up on the prospects I mentioned for a rent a player of Torri Hunter's ability. Not to mention add the excess salary.

 

Also I find it hard to see the Twins falling off that far to be in a position that they would want to trade him. The twins were 1 game off the pace for best record in Baseball last year.

 

The Braves however are a different story. I don't really pay much attention to them but it doesn't really seem like they added a whole lot or are getting players back from injury that they would get them to the playoffs.

 

Or maybe I am just reading all the signs wrong but normally if you have a player that you want back and is going to be a free agent after this season that is a top 5 CFer in the league don't you think they would start into contract negotiations? I understand that the Braves were just sold. However With the way the market has went this off-season the last thing I would ever want as a GM if I wanted to re-sign somebody is for that player to hit the open market.

 

Oh well it is a fantasy trade that will never happen.

 

Its just fun to think about this stuff out loud once in a while.