Cameron suspended for 2 games

[logan82]

A pitcher doesn't really miss his start though. It just gets pushed back a couple days. If there is an off day, all it does is juggle the rotation.

[lcbj68c]

JohnBriggs12 wrote:

When did Bruce Froemming start posting on here?

 

The ump initiated the contact. Cameron just held his ground. Umpires have to be able to take it. It goes with the job. They have the power and should just walk away. The umpire should be suspended for bumping a player. Most umpires are arrogant.

 

People don't pay to see umpires. They pay to see players. Cameron lost his cool when the umpire didn't keep his.

I don't know that I needed to be called a name for my opinion, but to each his own. Having been an umpire at the NCAA level and worked for sometime within MLB (a position that held close interaction with umpires), I'll disagree that most umpires are arrogant. I think the point about people paying to see umpires is true, but I've never seen an umpire act as if that is true. The umpire kept his cool until Cameron decided to turn around and whine for the 10th time in the series. Enough is enough. An umpire has to get control over the game and not allow Cameron to continue to hold up the game over some whiny diatribe (sp?) after each at-bat. An umpire has an obligation, one that he only engaged in after Cameron approached him from the batters box after the called strike 3. Cameron's motion should have been head down to the dugout, not to the rear of the catcher's box. Your opinions are insightful, but please dont try and create a perception that umpires think the game is all about them and a majority are arrogant...that couldn't be further from the truth.

[TooLiveBrew]

I think the point about people paying to see umpires is true, but I've never seen an umpire act as if that is true.

 

I just want to whole-heartedly agree with this, and say that the vast majority of the time the notion that an ump is out to 'put on a show' is just hogwash.

 

 

Your opinions are insightful, but please dont try and create a perception that umpires think the game is all about them and a majority are arrogant...that couldn't be further from the truth.

 

Totally agree, and I think this might be a case of a few (very visible) bad apples ruining the whole bushel for some.

[logan82]

Some of the strike out calls are pretty flashy and seem to be done with the intent of drawing attention. Including, I will add, this particular umpire. Whether they are intentionally drawing attention to themselves isn't important.

 

I should make it clear that I have no problem with Cameron getting ejected form the game. How he argued was somewhat questionable. I do however think a suspension was uncalled for.

[1992casey]

correct me if I'm wrong, but these player suspensions are with pay? I can't see professional sports players having to do the same thing as regular people that get suspended at work (i.e. no pay).

 

I believe suspensions are unpaid. But it's not unheard of for a team to choose to pay its player anyway if it believes the commissioner's office was wrong and the player was right.

[lcbj68c]

Some of the strike out calls are pretty flashy and seem to be done with the intent of drawing attention. Including, I will add, this particular umpire. Whether they are intentionally drawing attention to themselves isn't important.

 

I should make it clear that I have no problem with Cameron getting ejected form the game. How he argued was somewhat questionable. I do however think a suspension was uncalled for.

To be honest, this is how they are teaching and instructing "recruits" at the two sanctioned MLB umpire academies. I don't think umpires are trying to be intentional flashy for the sake of "look at me". MLB has accepted and encouraged this behavior by teaching it at the academies.

[TooLiveBrew]

I know at almost any level of umpiring, you are coached to make your visible call(s) clear & easily identifiable (like not just casually raising your fist up to shoulder-level to call a bang-bang play at 1B)... but something tells me the more demonstrative stike-3 calls could be toned down a notch without losing effect http://forum.brewerfan.net/images/smilies/smile.gif

[logan82]

The umpire in this particular game jumped almost past the right handed batter's box when he made the call. To me, that's a bit over the top. Still, Cam's first move was towards the umpire, who wasn't there because he jumped way over to make the call, instead of towards the dugout.

[mls4]

After ejection, Cameron went back into the ump's face. That should almost be grounds for a suspension at that point. How come it took so long for Macha to get there and pull Cameron away?

[phxMILWfan]

JohnBriggs12 wrote:

When did Bruce Froemming start posting on here?

 

The ump initiated the contact. Cameron just held his ground. Umpires have to be able to take it. It goes with the job. They have the power and should just walk away. The umpire should be suspended for bumping a player. Most umpires are arrogant.

 

People don't pay to see umpires. They pay to see players. Cameron lost his cool when the umpire didn't keep his.

I don't know that I needed to be called a name for my opinion, but to each his own. Having been an umpire at the NCAA level and worked for sometime within MLB (a position that held close interaction with umpires), I'll disagree that most umpires are arrogant. I think the point about people paying to see umpires is true, but I've never seen an umpire act as if that is true. The umpire kept his cool until Cameron decided to turn around and whine for the 10th time in the series. Enough is enough. An umpire has to get control over the game and not allow Cameron to continue to hold up the game over some whiny diatribe (sp?) after each at-bat. An umpire has an obligation, one that he only engaged in after Cameron approached him from the batters box after the called strike 3. Cameron's motion should have been head down to the dugout, not to the rear of the catcher's box. Your opinions are insightful, but please dont try and create a perception that umpires think the game is all about them and a majority are arrogant...that couldn't be further from the truth.

I'm not defending JohnBriggs whole post but I have to say that after reading your posts it was quite obvious you had done some work as a umpire. I know that a lot of people are obvious in their defense of their teams player and you are obviously biased in your defense of the umpire. Cameron deserved to be tossed from the game but the umpire didn't do a great job of staying calm. You've made several mentions of Cameron whining and how he should put his head down and walk away. At what point are your posts too negative towards the player? I'm not going to go on and on with this but I think that considering this is "brewerfan.net" and not "umpirefan.net" it was getting tough to read your posts. Just my opinion.

[lcbj68c]

Sorry you felt that way. It wasn't my intention to slam Cameron. I think there are two sides to the issue. Many people do not know the thought process, reasonings, mannerism of umpiring, let alone the rules half the time. I tried to bring to light some of those issues. Sorry if it became difficult to read without you feeling compelled to believe I was being negative to another Brewer. I think many people have shared the same sentiments as I have. This topic concerns umpiring, so I commented regarding umpiring, doesn't seem that makes it umpirefan.net? I didn't go into a thread about Parra and talk about umpiring...into a thread about Billy Hall not hitting and turn it into a thread about umpiring. My apologies if I said something you didn't agree with about beloved Brewers' behavior, I just wanted to impart some knowledge of living in the other guy's shoes. I'll try not to do that in the future.

[phxMILWfan]

I know what the thread is about. Your input is valued especially considering you've worked as an umpire. The point I was trying to make is that I thought you were a little one sided in your opinion. There are pleanty of people who are one sided in their opinion in defense of Cameron, JohnBriggs was more along those lines. I didn't mean to imply that you shouldn't share your opinion. I just meant that after one of your posts I knew that you were going to defend the umpire over Cameron regardless of what happened. I think people take the comment "people pay to watch the players not the umpires" too literal. I'm sure umpires know that the fans aren't paying to see them, it's just that some of them still try and steal the attention of the fans. I can not name for you which umpires because I care so little about the umpires that I would never take the time to learn their names but there are a few that seem to look for an argument. There is one that seems to have a serious napoleon complex.

[JJHardy7]

How come it took so long for Macha to get there and pull Cameron away?

 

That is what I was also wondering. It seemed to take him forever to get out there.

[RU Rah Rah]

And umps argue back because . . . why? What can they possibly gain from it?

 

(Rhetorical questions, obviously. I know that it's about machismo as much as anything else.)

[brewdude15]

When we played the Astros, was Lance Berkman or Cecil Cooper ever suspended for their tirades?

[lcbj68c]

1 game seems like plenty in my opinion. It would seem they gave him 2 games, knowing it would be reduced to 1 game on appeal. If you give him 1 game, how do you lower it on appeal? Seems like a "ticky-tack" reason for a suspension in the first place, but as an example, they must feel the need to suspend him. I personally dont think any suspension is neccessary..ejection from the game for his behavior seemed good enough, but Cameron will be the latest to be made example of I guess.

[Crew2323]

And umps argue back because . . . why? What can they possibly gain from it?

 

(Rhetorical questions, obviously. I know that it's about machismo as much as anything else.)

That's what I don't understand. As a basketball referee, I get chirped and yelled at countless times during a game. But if I screamed back at every coach or player whom I had on me all night, I'd never officiate another meaningful game ever again. I have heard the argument that, "Umpires can yell back because they get grief all the time." Baloney. It's unprofessional. I think other officials in other sports get more grief than umpires, and you don't see them getting into verbal confrontations with players. So why, then, do umpires do it, and why do they get away with it?

 

And as far as officials not having egos, I don't know any official, in any sport (myself included) that doesn't have some sort of ego. You almost have to have one.

[Postseason2006]

This is my biggest complaint about umpires. Instead of turning the other way, they have to initiate the confrontations. How about Selig growing a set and start fining these guys. People come to see good baseball not have poor umping take the game away.

The Brewers got hosed on a strike 3 call to Cameron but in the Rockies rally, there was a 2 strike pitch to Smith I believe that was called a ball at the knees.

[razzzorsharp]

Suspension reduced to one game, will serve it tomorrow (6/20).