Will Bill Hall ever make adjustments?

[bklynbrewcrew]

I'm sure someone will find reason to object to this but I'd just rather watch someone else fail instead of Bill Hall. I don't even care who it is. It would seem logical to play Gamel but I'll take anyone else over Hall at this point.

Im glad someone said this first because this is exactly how I feel. I dont even feel confident watching Hall hit lefties anymore. His plate discipline is flat out awful at this point and I cant stand watching as he stands at home plate to admire any fly ball he hits. I know Hall is supposed to be a great guy and all but I really cant stand watching him play at this point despite what I think is stellar defense.

 

His at bat against Aquino last night was a perfect example of why I cant watch him. Aquino was clearly wild and Hall was ahead in the count 3-1 with the bases loaded yet you knew he would swing at anything even remotely close to the zone. Of course he popped out to kill any chance we had for some insurance runs. At least Gamel has upside; at this point Hall is simply a terrible offensive player.

[Ayt]

If you watch Hall swing in slow motion, he's flinging his hips open way too soon a lot of the time. Just watch some of the pitches he's swinging at and missing. People say he has good opposite field power, but he can't duplicate that swing on a consistent basis. Last night, he tried to take a ball to the opposite field, but he opened up way too quickly and the result was an extremely weak swing.

 

Until he figures out how not to do what he's doing as often as he's doing it, he's going to continue to be abysmal and only get hits when the pitcher makes a mistake and his swing is actually a rare good one. Even when he's swinging at good pitches to hit his timing is usually way off because his swing mechanics are basically broken at this point.

[phxMILWfan]

I said it in the In-Game thread the other night. Hall's homerun was probably the worst thing that could have happened. He hit an 88mph fastball that was belt hight and on the inner third of the plate. It also didn't look to have any movement. As he stood their admiring his rare accomplishment I thought, there's no way he's going to listen to Sveum or any of the coaches and hit the ball the other way any time soon now.

[fondybrewfan]

I'll 2nd the responses in this thread. How many fastballs that are hittable pitches right down the middle of the plate can Hall swing through before he realizes he need to change his approach, change his stance, or just become a pitcher?

 

I wish I could find a stat, but I would imagine Hall swings and misses a ridiculous amount on fastball strikes.

 

I also would rather watch Gamel take his lumps out there rather than watch Hall flail away all the time while knowing that he has no future on this team after 2010.

[Gobias Industries]

I think the guy is cooked. Pitchers are just daring him to hit thigh-high fasbtalls, and he's just swinging right through them.

 

Let's face it. At this point, he's way below replacement level, and a guy like Adam Heether would undoubtedly contribute a lot more to this team. At what point, if any, do we eat this guy's contract? I'd personally look into it later in July if he doesn't show any signs.

[Invader3K]

I don't get why Hall should be starting at all at this point. He looks completely lost at the plate, which is a shame. Just use Gamel and shuffle the other guys in as needed.

[BadgerFan]

No more Bill Hall, please.

 

At what point do we bench him and play Gamel everyday? The guy is clueless at the plate...he's like Geoff Jenkins during one of his 6 week slumps - except he's been in the slump all season.

[Postseason2006]

How many more times is Ned Macha going to stick Hall out there to start. I would rather have Gamel playing full-time and growing with him instead of the Golden Sombrero Hall. He makes Jose Hernandez look patient at the plate.

[Klements Bratwurst]

At what point does Melvin cut his losses, swallow his pride, and DFA Bill Hall? I know he is due $6-$8 Million next year, but really can they really afford to keep him on the roster??? I just don't know what you can do with this guy anymore. He is useless, and a contending team cannot afford to have him on the roster. I say this in anger. Maybe tomorrow I will feel better about Bill Hall and his usefulness to the club.

 

Probably not though....and I am an owner of a Bill Hall t-shirt......

[Invader3K]

Would it really be so horrible to send him to AAA at this point? I know he could refuse assignment (I think), but who really cares at this point?

[naivin]

AAA sure seems like a good idea, and I would almost think as much of a mess as he is right now, he might actually welcome it. Then again, I suppose he has to consider the possibility that he goes down there and still can't hit. At which point his career is probably over. Still though, he has his money secured, I would think he would want to do whatever he can to try to improve. If he continues to hit .125, his career is over anyway.

[bobskube]

I am so sorry to say that I repeatedly told this board that Hall was a bad player for two years now. He is like Bump Bailey in "The Natural" now. He is bad karma and a very bad hitter who has absolutely no clue. He is worthless to this franchise and he has been given every chance to prove otherwise.

 

I expect he will be DFA'd soon and will clear waivers and will have to accept an assignment to the minors or else not get paid. Maybe he can at least become "average" again. Sorry I am coming off like a jerk, but I have had enough now of this guy.

[Invader3K]

bobskube, it's all right. I am actually a fan of Bill Hall, due to what he's done in the past, but he is absolutely terrible right now. I just don't get how he's become so terrible at the plate. He is serving absolutely no purpose, other than maybe as a late innings defensive replacement. I can't see him succeeding even as a pinch hitter at this point.

[Klements Bratwurst]

Also well said, Bob Skube. We are going on two years of no hit Hall. At 3B, we cannot have that hole in the lineup. He looks like a beer league softball player. Upper cutting on everything, and when he hits one, he stands in the box watching everything he hits. Drives me nuts! Signing Hall long term might have been Melvin's worse move as our GM.

[crewcrazy]

This thread is fine for discussing Hall's continued struggles and what might help him, but it's getting dangerously close to becoming a vent thread. I'm as frustrated with him now as anyone, but this isn't the place to blow off steam.

[bobskube]

Believe it or not, it has not been him hitting .197 this year as much to how clueless he is. His swing has so many darn holes in it. I also think that he will "guess" on a pitch before the pitch is actually thrown if he will swing or not. He lets pitches go right down the middle, he swings through hanging sliders, he misses the high heater, and he misses the curve ball in the dirt. It is amazing. You can pitch him anywhere.

 

I will maybe see Doug when he comes to Chicago on July 4th weekend. He is the best guy in the world and I really have avoided talking Brewers with him in the past too much. He likes to talk travel and wants to know how you are doing. Instead, I think I will finally tell him that Hall has to go with a serious straight face and ask him to explain why he is still on the MLB team. I hope he won't punch me!

[bobskube]

This thread is fine for discussing Hall's continued struggles and what might help him, but it's getting dangerously close to becoming a vent thread. I'm as frustrated with him now as anyone, but this isn't the place to blow off steam.

I apologize. I need to bring more substance to the thread. However, I will still think the same way a month from now about Hall.

 

Oh, by the way, Hall is now batting .244 vs lefties, with .264 OBP, with OPS of .670. That, my friends, is horrendous for a guy that supposedly rakes lefties.

[Gobias Industries]

Yeah, that's what is so maddening bobskube. I don't truly believe he's as bad vs. LHP as he's shown this year, but I also don't think he's as good vs. them as he showed last year when he had an .893 ops with a .380 BABIP.

 

In hindsight, backloading Hall's contract has to be one of Melvin's most costly mistakes as Brewer GM(you could also say extending Hall in general, but that was a no brainer at the time). A lot of our core guys that will be in arbitration next year were still in their minimum salary days in 06 and 07. Now Hall's contract is an albatross, and those guys will probably get hefty pay raises.

[kramnoj]

Hardy is OPSing .635. We don't have a thread talking about how he should be replaced.

 

Hall looks awful, and there's no doubt that he's struggling. But the period during which he has stunk against LHP is much smaller than his period of success.

[Jay Zahn]

In my opinion Hall will likely be DFAed before the season is out. The main reason he's being kept around is as sort of an insurance policy in case Gamel flops offensively or defensively. Counsell and McGehee aren't suitable for 3rd long term as they don't have enough power. Had Weeks not been hurt Hall might be gone already but that's a moot point. I do realize that Hall doesn't hit enough to play 3rd base either, but I guess the Brewers are holding on to the rapidly vanishing chance that Hall will recover abilities that are likely gone for good. Once the Brewers have full confidence in Gamel Hall will be history.

 

Hall is the antithesis of a player like Craig Counsell in his ability to adjust his game to declining abilities. Hall is still trying to do things he could do in 2005 and 2006. He can't do those things anymore. Perhaps his inability to adjust is a moot point given his declining skills.

[BrewCrewForever]

Hall looked as bad as ever last night. Just totally lost at the plate. Now is the time for Macha to finally sit his butt on the bench and give Gamel all the PT to see what he can do.

[bcf5575]

I have seen this psted earlier, but didnt see an answer (though I didnt re-read all 9 pages) - can Hall be sent down to AAA? Get some consistent at bats and maybe work this thing out? he has got to be as frustrated with his performance as everyone else is..

[bklynbrewcrew]

I am pretty sure that Hall cant be sent down without his consent. Hall is now 8 for his last 85. You really have to wonder how a supposed contender can keep giving a guy like this chance after chance after chance. Between playing Hall and Kendall leading off I am really starting to think that Macha is not much of an upgrade over Yost.

[Fatter than Joey]

I expect he will be DFA'd soon and will clear waivers and will have to accept an assignment to the minors or else not get paid.

 

Bill Hall has 5+ years of service time -- He will get his money even if he refuses his assignment.

 

He likes to talk travel and wants to know how you are doing.

 

Maybe suggest travel suggestions for Bill Hall?

 

In my opinion Hall will likely be DFAed before the season is out. The main reason he's being kept around is as sort of an insurance policy in case Gamel flops offensively or defensively.

 

I agree with this 100% -- It seems prudent to me, to keep Hall on the bench, start Gamel, and keep Hall until the Brewers are 100% that Gamel is here to stay.

 

I have seen this psted earlier, but didnt see an answer (though I didnt re-read all 9 pages) - can Hall be sent down to AAA?

 

Sure. Hall would be exposed to outright waivers.....

 

1.) Hall could get claimed by another team, where the Brewers would be responsible for most of his salary.

 

2.) Hall could refuse the assignment, and get paid anyway.

 

3.) These waivers are irrevocable.

[bcf5575]

maybe melvin can work out a "change of scenery" trade. though it would be hard to match up contracts - there has to be someone else out there in a similar situation...