Student Expectations Seen as Causing Grade Disputes

[thablingster]

RyDogg, pretty much every online classroom is set up with discussion boards. Some schools use D2L, others use Blackboard Academic Suite, and I'm sure there are plenty of other online platforms out there.

 

What happens is for each week of the class there usually is a discussion topic based off of class reading or other material and the students are expected to converse back and forth regarding their opinions of the material. It is much like how traditional classroom professors will sometimes make students write chapter summaries or chapter reflections to gain critical thinking skill. These discussion topics are factored heavily into a student's grade, so they are required to perform admirably in them.

 

Another facet of online learning which is beneficial to the workplace is that it can vastly strengthen not only a student's computer skills, but their writing skills. Students depend on writing for the majority of the work they turn in, outside of internships or various proctored exercises some classes may require of them. Some courses also require students to have webcams or a way to video tape themselves giving presentations so that their physical presence can also be evaluated.

[RU Rah Rah]

I think that online instruction, like any form of pedagogy, has potential strengths and weaknesses -- and how these manifest themselves depends a great deal on both the instructor and the student. (Lazy students are going to find a way to be lazy, whatever the course format. Same thing for bad instructors.)

 

What frustrates me is that the students in my traditional lecture course insist on having online delivery of course materials in addition to the lectures. I will cover basic course material five ways: 1.) orally, while lecturing; 2.) via PowerPoint in lecture; 3.) in assigned readings; 4.) on a study guide (available on D2L) that highlights all of the relevant material that will be on the exams; and 5.) in give-and-take in a D2L discussion forum that I set up before every exam. I am very explicit that this is the way it's going to work, and I think it's a good deal. (When I was an undergrad, we only got #1 and #3.)

 

Is this easy enough for students? No. They repeatedly demand that I post the PowerPoint slides and my own notes on D2L -- even though I state on my syllabus that I won't do it.

 

If this trend continues, in 5-10 years the demand will be posting the exam questions (and answers?) online ahead of time.

[bani1717]

Interesting point about eventually the demand will be for exam questions to be online. It's interesting to me mainly because I have a professor who gives 3 essay exams throughout the semester, and for each one, he gives out the "big" question ahead of time -- the one that requires the longest answer and is worth the most points. He says he does it because never in life will we be required to memorize a bunch of info and then write as much about a couple questions related to it as we can in 50 minutes. But, for example, we may be given a topic on which we must give a presentation to our boss/coworkers and have a couple days to get ready for it.

 

Now, obviously this wouldn't work for all classes, most obviously the classes that give multiple-choice exams. But, I think in a way the prof has a point. And let me make it clear that he does not post a "sample answer" or anything like that, and he makes it very clear that neither he nor the TAs will discuss anything related to that question from the time he sends it out until after the exam.

[jwill535]

I took an online Physics course. Try typing out formulas long hand on word and you can see how I enjoyed it.

 

I had a math teacher for algebra that didnt require numbers being used, just the letters. You broke down equations to the point you needed to fill in the numbers and that was your answer. He reasoning being that he didnt need to know that we could use calculators, just that we knew how to work the equations. Also all tests were open notes, again his reasoning being that in real like situations if you do not remember an equation you are going to look it up, he just wanted to know you knew which one to use and how to use it.

[RU Rah Rah]

Oh, for my smaller, upper-level courses, I will post the essay questions online. I do think that's a more meaningful intellectual enterprise -- making them think through stuff, and render arguments on paper, etc. But for an intro course with 400 students total (spread out over two sections) and no TA's, I have to go the scantron route.

 

I am absolutely not a fan of multiple choice tests, but to prepare for them, students do have to show some discipline and organizational skills. Those are things that they will have to rely on out in the real world (albeit in different contexts).

[alorrigan]

I'm currently taking some online classes with my on campus classes. The way online classes work is there is regular homework to go along with the discussion board. You are required to post in the discussion board on four different days. I have no problem doing that except there are only 8 people in my class and no one posts anything until the last day of the week. I try to post things to encourage discussion but no one does anything until the last minute. Because of this my participation grade is suffering. I'm getting about half the points for each week. My homework, test, and quiz grades are great but my participation grade is terrible. I'm consideration emailing the professor to ask for a boast in my grade because it is quite obvious that I am the only one who is trying to make an effort to get my posts in during the week and I can't have discussion when I'm the only person posting.

 

The thing holding me back is that I hate grade grubbing and I have never done it before. If I do this am I being a hypocrite or do you think this is a situation where it's ok?

[pogokat]

I had a similar situation in a grad school class where we met in person, but had the blackboard discussions as well...i didn't email the professor...i just decided to have a conversation with myself...so my "posts" were more or less mini essays where i discussed every aspect of the topic at hand, at least a little...the others would still chime in at the last minute and i did a lot more work than them, but i got the grade i wanted...i have no clue what kind of grades they got..

and yes, it did piss me off as much as it is probably pissing you off..

[RU Rah Rah]

The thing holding me back is that I hate grade grubbing and I have never done it before. If I do this am I being a hypocrite or do you think this is a situation where it's ok?

No, I think you have a legit concern over how the online discussion is (not) working. Without overtly mentioning your grade, you might email the prof about how s/he might tweak the format a little so that the discussion isn't just a last-minute rush job for everyone. It sounds like your interest in getting a better grade dovetails with his/her interest in having a real online discussion -- and there's nothing wrong with that (as long as you're cool about asking).

[alorrigan]

The thing holding me back is that I hate grade grubbing and I have never done it before. If I do this am I being a hypocrite or do you think this is a situation where it's ok?

No, I think you have a legit concern over how the online discussion is (not) working. Without overtly mentioning your grade, you might email the prof about how s/he might tweak the format a little so that the discussion isn't just a last-minute rush job for everyone. It sounds like your interest in getting a better grade dovetails with his/her interest in having a real online discussion -- and there's nothing wrong with that (as long as you're cool about asking).

Every couple of weeks he posts saying that he's disappointed in the lack of discussion but he hasn't done anything about it. This last week I asked if he could make one or two posts related to the topic for a jump off point for the rest of us and he said he would. He hasn't for this week yet, but it's still early.