Choosing a graduate/law school

[samwise]

I recently was accepted into a few law schools and am looking for some advice anyone has had on choosing graduate or law schools.

 

I have been offered partial scholarships to a couple of the schools, in one case a 75% scholarship, but these schools are not highly ranked. On the other hand I was accepted into a better school but it looks like I will not be receiving any scholarships but will probably be receiving federal aid. So it boils down to this, take a better school for more money or pay less (significantly) at a worse school. (I use worse only in a relative sense). There are other pro's and con's but I would be looking for any general advice anyone would have.

[nodakfan17]

PM Sent. Good Luck.

[RyDogg66]

I am a recent (2006) law school grad, maybe I can help. Since none of us know you personally, you might want to tell us (me) some of the schools you are considering and where you want to practice/live when you graduate.

[TheBwaz]

Trust me, don't be a lawyer. It leads to premature balding and, on occasion, a nasty rash.

The prestige schools are going to give you better shot at the prestige jobs. Then again, if you finish top of your class at a mid or lower law school, you are still going to have plenty of offers. The smaller the mortgage on your brain, the better.

Keep in mind also few law schools have a truly national reach. Most tend to feed the local market (I can't go to court without knocking over 4 guys from Marquette just to get in the door). I would add a 3rd consideration to your conundrum and state that having a good idea of WHERE in the country you want to practice would help. I made the decision to head back to Milwaukee after starting a scholarship program in Dayton. I got a job, but I practically had to light myself on fire to get noticed over the hordes from Wisconsin and Marquette; and I did pretty well in school.

[samwise]

Thanks for the info already guys.

 

I have been accepted at 6 schools:

Hamline (Minn)

St. Thomas (Minn)

William Mitchell (Minn)

Northern IL

John Marshall (IL)

Marquette

 

The scholarship offers are all for the schools other than Marquette.

 

I know that Marquette is not a very prestigous school, but it ranks better than the other 5 and it does have its advantages. If I were to attend Marquette I could live with my aunt and uncle for the first year so living expenses would be lessened. I am planning on staying in Wisconsin for the foreseeable future so automatic bar passage is nice and their new law school building is a plus. But it is going to cost some serious cash and I am wondering if it will be worth going into that much debt when I could be getting a law degree at a fraction of the cost.

 

Again thanks for all the help.

[RyDogg66]

With those schools as your choices, and wanting to practice in Wisconsin, I would recommend Marquette. For the bar privileges alone it is a better deal than the other schools. The trio of Minnesota schools are nice but as you can imagine they play better north of Milwaukee (in my limited experiece) if you want to practice/live in the greater Milwaukee area there are tons of Marquette grads and that degree will help you. Not to mention there are tons of clerking jobs available in the Milwaukee area in between 1l and 2L years and 2L and 3L years that could land you a job.

 

As far as costs go, I would work Marquette a little more to try and get some money out of them. Also, what kind of law do you want to practice? If you want to be a corporate type then going into debt is no big deal. If you want to be a Public Defender or Assistant DA then money becomes an issue. JOhn Marshall is a great school to go to become a trial lawyer.

 

I would probably avoid N. Illinois (isnt it in Rockford?) if it isnt in Chicago.

 

Just my thoughts.

[KMFlorie]

I am a 3L at a law school in northern Indiana. I went to Marquette as an undergrad and think very highly of its law school. However, I believe the financial aspect of law school should be your most significant consideration in making this decision. Marquette's tuition is more than 32K per year, which totals 96K for your law school stay without considering any room and board. Assuming that the other schools you are considering have a similar cost (though I believe they are less expensive), you would pay only 24K in total for the school offering you a 75% scholarship. Choosing to pay 72K more for a similar degree requires, in my opinion, far more than the differences offered to you by Marquette.

 

First and foremost, don't overvalue the diploma privilege. Though not having to study and take the bar exam is a nice perk, Wisconsin's bar passage rates are extraordinarily high (89% overall, 92% for first time takers - http://www.ncbex.org/file..._Admissions/2007stats.pdf). Furthermore, if you are looking to do corporate work and land a job with a large firm, that firm will pay all of your bar expenses and prep fees, as well as give you a monthly stipend during a summer where you review for the bar in lieu of working. Not a bad gig.

 

In addition, you must consider not only the type of job that you want to take, but the probability that you will attain that type of job. As mentioned above, corporate jobs pay much more than public interest jobs or government jobs. This should not discourage you from going to law school if you want to take one of those jobs, but should weigh on how much debt you want to take on to earn your degree. Marquette has some information on their website relating to these differences in pay (http://law.marquette.edu/...e.pl?2130&pageID=2171), though they fail to indicate how many students were placed at each level of compensation within each sector of employment. On a related topic, you should take note of the ongoing controversy in the legal education industry with regard to career service information provided by law schools and the value of legal degrees. The Wall Street Journal published a page one article on this topic that I think gives a pretty good treatment of the issues (http://online.wsj.com/art...0786780835602-search.html). Furthermore, if you are looking to go into corporate work, you should take note of the significant contraction occuring in that legal market. I will be working for a corporate firm in Chicago starting this fall. Though I consider myself lucky because my firm has yet to fire any attorneys, as many other firms have, the firm decided to reduce this year's class of summer associates (from which the following year's class of full time associates is selected) by 30%. Some of my friends have seen even larger summer class reductions, delayed starting dates, or cutbacks at their firms. Based on the current economic problems, I would expect the employment outcomes for the current 2Ls at my school to fall short of the employment outcomes for the same class the previous year. Whether those jobs return by the time you are looking for work remains to be seen, but banking on such an immediate reemergence seems risky at best.

 

Finally, though I agree with others on this board that a Marquette law degree provides an advantage if you want to work in Milwaukee, success remains a key ingredient to landing a job in any market. Milwaukee firms, judges, or government offices will have a hard time turning you down if you graduate in the top five or ten percent of your class regardless of which law school you attend. Furthermore, outside of the Milwaukee area, the Marquette advantage presumably dims somewhat. Between my first and second year of law school, I worked for a trial judge in a county a bit north of Milwaukee. In this county, the judge I worked for, the district attorney I dealt with on a regular basis, and two of the prominent defense attorneys all graduated from Hamline. Furthermore, I should note that as a law student in Indiana, I had no problems securing interviews or offers from firms in Milwaukee despite the lack of a Marquette law school connection.

 

I guess all of this is a long winded way of suggesting that the benefits offered by Marquette probably pale in comparison to that 75% reduction in tuition. However, as I said before, I love MU and have substantial respect for both the law school and its graduates. On a purely educational basis, I don't think you would be making a mistake by choosing MU. If you have any other questions, please feel free to send me a message.

[samwise]

KM and RyDogg thank you so much. I will probably be sending you a PM KM (haha). I am thinking I should really get serious about what type of work I want to do beforehand and pick the school that best suits the line of work. I have some ideas of the work I would like to do but need to do some research. Again, thank you guys for the info.

[WV Brew]

My brother started off at Marquette and was able to transfer to Madison after one year. They will always have some attrition after the first year. That could be a possibility also.

[homer]

Why do you want to be a lawyer? Only reason I ask is that I know a lot of miserable lawyers that are stuck in their jobs because they have 6 figure student loans to pay off.

[AJOHNSON104]

I graduated in 2004 from MU. The thing I liked about MU was the support staff was outstanding. They really try to help you do your best and get through the grind. This is a bit different from what I hear at other schools, although I of course have no first hand experience. I found the school was not overtly competitive and there was an atmosphere of helping each other and teamwork. Additionally, MU seems to be moving up the charts on how its viewed, if that matters at all. I did find the diploma privilege to be an advantage, but it was most important for me to stay close to Milwaukee because of my wife / kids and job. If you are flexible in where you want to live and can save some money, one of those other schools may be OK. I did receive lots of negative feedback on N.IL from people I know. I had a few transfers from there in my MU class and they only had bad things to say about Northern.