Braden Looper signed: 1 year w/mutual option, worth between $5.5 mil and $12.25 mil; Rottino DFA'd (replies #150/151), will report as long as he isn't claimed (reply #181)

[giffted1]

While I like this move because of the obvious depth added, am I the only one who would rather see McClung start and Looper in the pen?

You're not the only one. At the very least I'd like there to some competition for the back end of the rotation. My reasoning is pretty far out there...I think something "clicked" with McClung in the rotation last year. He didn't try to throw the ball through the backstop when he started, and his walk rate went down as a result. I think that McClung and Looper would be similar starters, but Looper is easily the better reliever.

[And That]

Well, how could you possibly say DiFelice is better than McClung when he has only appeared in a total of 15 MLB games? Maybe he'll end up being a better pitcher, but I think it's too early to tell.

But he might be - that's the point. Someone saying "I don't even have to defend my position that McClung is better because I'm just right" is flat-out ridiculous.

 

FWIW, the CHONE projections:

DiFelice... a 3.60 ERA, a 9.6 K/9 and a 1.16 WHIP

McClung... a 3.97 ERA, a 9.0 K/9 and a 1.41 WHIP

[homer]

Not that this means squat but DiFelice's WHIP is Nintendo like since 2007 - something like 380Ks and 45 BBs.

[Weirdos19]

Who knows what will happen with the bullpen. None of us do. But, another quality arm is exactly what the doctor ordered. We all agree on that.

 

Also, it may give us a chance to move a reliever that is out of options.

 

Sort of off topic- Does anyone remember late last year when it was McClung that was brought in to get big outs? He was the best reliever we had last September, bar none. To think that he may be DFA'd is crazy. A trade would happen first.

 

McClung is actually my sleeper pick to be the closer in 2010.

[Yeti73]

I feel bad for Yeti. I had unreasonably high expectations for him in the starting rotation and he probably will still get a few starts this year. Still this is a good move in that it gives our BP even more depth. Yeti, Newhouse and Hoffman in the 7, 8 and 9th are as good as any in the league. We saw how the Cubs were pretty shut down last year if they had a lead going into the 7th (except for that great comeback win the Crew had against Wood). When Samadrjia (sp?), Marmol and Wood were on, they were lights out. I'm forgetting who Samarjdia replaced in the 7th inning.

[Darnell Junior]

I like the signing, but obviously it's not overwhelming. Another 3-5 starter is always a good thing, whether or not you wanted a 2. Let's just hope that Macha has the sense to start the 5 best pitchers, instead of Suppan and the 4 best. I suspect we're done for the offseason but you never know. As we stand I like our chances, with a slightly above average and deep rotation plus a lineup full of young hitters bound to improve. I'd say our team is about the same as last year pre-Sabathia. I'll hope for another addition but I won't be dissapointed if this is it.

[Dmiles23]

I also like the signing, as it adds depth. But the first thing I thought when I saw we were in the process of signing Looper, "Oh no... that means I have to stare at his ears 30 times this year!!" That guy rivals John Wooden in the biggest ears record book. And to make it worse, his ear lobes are attached... and it just looks goofy. Ok, sorry... that may have been uncalled for.

[strawbossisevil]

Just a question Darnell, who is clearly better than Suppan right now for the rotation? I really can't comprehend all this talk about sending a guy to the bullpen who will probably put up an ERA in the upper 4s over 200 (more or less innings).

 

He's overpaid, but that doesn't mean he doesn't belong in the rotation.

[Ennder]

In Suppan's first 60 starts as a Brewer he put up a 4.56 ERA. The last 5 starts somehow have people thinking he is just terrible.

[Oldcity]

McClung is making no where near what Vargas would have made that offseason. That comparison is ridiculous.

 

McClung makes three times the minimum, hardly a "decent amount of cash". McClung is a solid bullpen arm, one who also is able to put up solid numbers as a fill in starter. There is no way that he isn't worth what we are paying him IMO. And I don't think any "savings" we'd get from cutting him, could go to a more valuable piece for our current team.

Why is "savings" in quotes? Cutting McClung would save about a million bucks. Is that fake money to you?

 

I wasn't necessarily advocating cutting McClung. I was just saying the Brewers have done it before. The money was more with Vargas, but the premise is the same.

 

Personally I'd rather have McClung in AAA starting, but I don't think it's a huge deal either way. I'd be very willing to give DiFelice a starting spot if they cut McClung. DiFelice's walk rate the last three seasons is incredible.

[edod]

Unless there's a huge rift (which there very well may be), I'd make Sheets that pitcher. Step up and pay for the surgery, give Sheets the facilities to rehab, and give him an 100% incentive-laden, 1 year deal. If he's ready to go by July, fantastic, you've just added a top-of-the-rotation starter for the stretch run. If he's rehabbing all year, you're only out the cost of the surgery and let's say minor league pay.

I couldn't agree with this more. But would Ben's side do it?

 

I'm pretty happy with the signing despite being a big McClung fan. I think he'll still get his shot as I have a vary deep seeded fear that one of the top 3 will not make the entire season. I agree that McClung made steps forward towards the end of last year. He was pumped and performing in very tense games; he's battle tested at the very least.

 

I think our starting rotation is quite unspectacular (unless someone breaks out), but very solid. This puts more weight on the offense, which is were it should be considering the allocation of funds. The offense was OK last year, but way below where it could have been and without a good showing this year the team will not compete. I think we have to realize that this team got to the playoffs with pitching last year and as it looks now, that will not be the case in 09. You could argue that the Brewers wouldn't have needed Sabathia if the offense had carried more of the load. The offense was slow to come around and disappeared in the last month, right when Sabathia was dominating. It's their year to shine or else.

[CheezWizHed]

Signing Looper fills our biggest hole. Now we need a real backup OF, not just a LHB that plays OF...

 

I would be shocked if McClung didn't make the team, but I was hoping to see what he could do as a SP... Probably will get the chance yet.

 

Small sample size, but I seem to remember talk about DiFelice being a ROOGY. That was why they picked their spots carefully when they used him and didn't leave him out there too long.

 

BA OBP SLG OPS

vs RHB as RH .170 .220 .213 .433

vs LHB as RH .333 .357 .778 1.135

 

[TooLiveBrew]

DiFelice actually had very good success v. LHB in the minors once he added the cutter. minorleaguesplits.com is where I usually go, but not sure if they still have his splits up anymore or not.

 

Glad to see the Looper signing, as he seems to be that one arm that remained for Melvin to add... ensuring the requisite depth for a 162-game MLB season. I hope as many of the groundballs he induces go to J.J. as possible. http://forum.brewerfan.net/images/smilies/smile.gif

[Team Canada]

McClung's not going to be cut. You don't sign a SP for depth and then summarily cut another SP (candidate). Vargas was useless outside of the rotation, where McClung clearly is not. Apples and oranges.

[And That]

DiFelice's minor league splits are much closer, over a larger sample.

[BADGERJOBOB]

Well not the most thrilling of signings. Definitely doesn't have any upside at 34. Definitely doesn't have a track record of success as a starting pitcher. I really like sinkerball pitchers but you need a good defensive team behind sinkerball pitchers, something we don't have here. Adds depth which is good. Too bad that depth is as a number 5 pitcher. He looks like a Suppan like signing in terms of ability which is not a good thing. The deciding factor on this signing will be the years and price. Hopefully its the 2 year variety with a club option on a third and no more than $7 million for 2 years. Anything more than that and I would really have to question Melvin's decision making.

[brewers4eric]

Without seeing the numbers, I like the signing. In most years, you'll use at least 8 different starting pitchers. Given the relative inexperience of the starting candidates, we're also likely to burn through a long list of relievers over the course of 162 games and the playoffs. Looper isn't spectacular, but he has experience in both roles. Send him out to the bump and see how he does.

 

The pitching staff is a question mark, but the team is going to live and die by the three run bomb. The list of candidates is deeper than it was yesterday, and the charter flight from Nashville to Milwaukee is going to be busy.

 

I'm probably more interested in the corresponding move to clear a spot on the 40 man roster. I would think that Gwynn would be the easiest skill set to replace. I would like to retain Rottino, as his versatility is nice to have as a third catcher, but my guess is that he is the odd man out.

[endaround]

I said if they brought in another pitcher McClung still could be cut. Say a Hall for Wasburn deal and to pay Washburn McClung gets cut.

[splitterpfj]

This is a wise move, the team just simply did not have enough starting pitchers to begin the season with.

 

The team has no right to expect 200 IP this season from Gallardo, or Parra, and it would have seemed quite foolish to me to simply pen McClung in and assume he could be a 200 IP guy. Looper's not great, but he is solid, and he has been durable....you never know, any pitcher could get hurt, but Looper seems like a good bet to eat up some innings, and give the team a chance to win more often than not.

 

I like having McClung in the bullpen, and then available for the rotation if someone goes down, and I definitely prefer Looper to McClung for the rotation.

 

Waiting was the right move, guys like Garland and Wolf really don't impress me any more than Looper does.

[Darnell Junior]

Strawboss, I wasn't trying to imply that Suppan is our sixth best pitcher, it's just that last year he was being outpitched at times and it really had no bearing as to whether or not he was going to be starting. He pitched very well for long stretches last year, I just want it to be an open competition. If he wins the job, great. I wasn't trying to imply he should be in the pen automatically.

 

What I do like in having 6 viable starters is that it does enable us to "ride the hot hand" between Looper, McClung, and Suppan if we choose to do so. Those three collectively might not be that great of a trio, but if you get to choose the two that are pitching best at the time, all of a sudden those 4th and 5th pitchers are looking pretty good.

 

edited: (sp)

[kramnoj]

With this signing we now have 7 pitchers that are/have experience as major league SP (I'm including CV here as an option, some people don't). There is the chance that Cap could be available mid-season. I think Wright, DeFelice and others in AAA are decent enough for being 8th and lower in the depth chart.

 

The one thing this does that I'm not really fond of is limit flexibility in the bullpen. I think SP depth is more important, but I'm just noting the one downside I see. As I understand it, the pitchers that will be in our bullpen are pitchers that are out of options. I think it also limits us to one lefty in the pen. I'm slightly concerned that we will see a possible repeat of last year, where we have relievers that are struggling and can't send them down, leading to someone being called up and resulting in a short bench. I think my ideal bullpen would be to have 4-5 solid guys and fill out the rest with young pitchers that have options that can be shuttled if neccessary. But I just posted earlier that it is best to judge based on what is available, not what is ideal, so I think where the team is is fine.

[PeaveyFury]

I said if they brought in another pitcher McClung still could be cut.

 

Saying it repeatedly doesn't make it so, end. McClung is a virtual lock to be on the 25 man in April, barring an injury to him. You don't cut guys in spring training that put up ERA's near 4 in the previous season when you're short on pitching and/or have a ton of question marks in both the bullpen and rotation.

[pitchleague]

is this official yet? I read the first 70 posts at noon today and figured it'd be a done deal by the time I got home. But here I am, four hours later, and I don't see anything official yet.

 

If it does come to pass, I would take Looper and accept him into our happy bunch, since some help is better than no help at all. Looking at his numbers he doesn't look like he's completely lost on the mound for a starter. Sure, he's not blowing anybody away and he's not flashy but he's a fairly solid arm. I don't think he's had any arm issues/injuries either, at least not in the last few years.

 

As for McClung vs. Looper, let's wait and see what they look like starting on Saturday. A few weeks in and we'll know better what we're looking at.

[JJHardy7]

is this official yet? I read the first 70 posts at noon today and figured it'd be a done deal by the time I got home. But here I am, four hours later, and I don't see anything official yet.

 

There won't be anything official until he passes a physical. My guess is it'll be official tomorrow afternoon.

[strawbossisevil]

The point is though Darnell, is that Suppan is a guy who almost every year throws for 200 innings. He is probably better conditioned to starting than McClung is, and thus won't have as many short starts. McClung, as many of the stats people have posted, is clearly better coming out of relief.

 

So even if Suppan would be slightly worse than McClung, which is a big "if". He is better served as an innings eating 5th starter. We have no idea how he'd do in the pen, he may be horrible for all we know.

 

And as for catching players on "good streaks". It is easier said than done, because streaks are just natural in baseball to begin with and can happen with little to no fault of the player. A few balls bouncing the wrong way in a couple of games, and a guy is on a "bad streak". So determining when a good streak starts, or when a bad streak is ending is next to impossible. Now if it is injury related, that's different. Plus, starting pitching is all about getting into the pattern of pitching every 5 days. Pulling people in and out of that pattern doesn't always work well either. On top of that, it often leaves a team's bullpen a man short. Baring injury, I think Suppan should be the #5 in the rotation, and McClung the bullpen/injury replacement unless a clear upgrade over Suppan joins the team (perhaps if Capuano midseason if he comes back strong from his injury).