Sheets watch, Part 2: Had surgery 2/10, Brewers may need to pay for it

[Fear The Chorizo]

On paper I personally think every single team in the NL Central got worse this year than they were going into last year.

 

I completely agree. And, the Reds and Brewers are the two teams that have enough young, pre-prime years talent to be able to improve enough to offset their paper regressions. I also think the Brewers and Cardinals would have the most to offer in a trade to substantially improve their team during the season.

 

On paper, I don't think the Cubs have regressed enough to question them as the division favorites - throw in a few injuries that expose their currently glaring lack of depth and add a key trade by the Brewers or even Cardinals, and who knows?

 

It does stink that the Sheets' injury appears to have cost the Brewers a shot at draft compensation for him - then again, I feel worse for Sheets. To think that last season at the All Star break he was probably looking at contract offers approaching twice the amount of his last deal, and now he'll have to probably sit out the entire 2009 season without earning a penny, and probably lose his chance at another big payday.

[pitchleague]

I heard the news on XM 175 on the way home today. Kind of depressing but not a surprise at all. During the interview (I guess it was just an audio clip that I actually heard), Ben sounded semi-upbeat but also semi-distraught over how his elbow had been hurting him for a while.

 

Holden Kushner was running rampant about how he feels the Brewers should not be on the hook for the surgury. He wasn't Brewer's property anymore. The Brewers tried to give him arbitration and he rejected it, pretty much cutting his ties to the organization. He conceded that, yes, the injury did occur while a member of the Milwaukee Brewers but he left the team to try to get a payday.

 

It's kind of like if I hurt my arm directing my children's choir during the Christmas show then moving to Wisconsin to look for a job, only to discover that my flexor tendon needs surgery from directing too much. My old school district certainly isn't going to pay for that, even though the injury occurred in Arizona. Sure, I should have contacted Workers Comp or something, you could argue. But I didn't.

[Hate those Rodents]

This is a good lesson for us and the team. Don't count on arby to yield you a bunch of picks. Many other teams have been screwed over, though none as badly as us this year. Still, I can see this being ok if we learn from it.

[twobrewers]

I've been saying since December Sheets would miss the start of the season.

 

There was just no way he was going to get so little interest if he was able to pitch.

 

Of course, I say lots of things....

[logan82]

and there was nothing to think this injury was as bad as it turns out it is. Texas had a 2 year offer that Sheets accepted. All he had to do was pass the physical.

[Oldcity]

Radio guys were making such a big deal out of the fact that the Brewers might have to pay for the surgery. Could it really cost that much money? Is it even really relevant?

[KCBrewerfan34]

Guys Ben Sheets gets no money from us, its time to cut the chord, this makes Melvin look like a genius, just think if DM would have listened to all of the GM's on this board. OUCH!!!

[logan82]

At the start of the offseason who would have thought we would get better draft pick compensation for Brian Shouse than we would for Ben Sheets.

[Ennder]

Guys Ben Sheets gets no money from us, its time to cut the chord, this makes Melvin look like a genius, just think if DM would have listened to all of the GM's on this board. OUCH!!!

Melvin offered him arbitration without a physical apparently and the people on this board weren't suggesting they should sign him without testing his arm, I fail to see how this point has any validity to it.

 

Also the article makes it sound like he could pitch but since nobody has really been interested he is going for the surgery hoping for a mid season return and a bigger contract next year, which I guess makes sense.

[nate82]

Radio guys were making such a big deal out of the fact that the Brewers might have to pay for the surgery. Could it really cost that much money? Is it even really relevant?

Should be no more than an expensive minor league contract.

[razzzorsharp]

I still say a 3 year 15 million dollar deal even if he misses the first year. Then again, it's not my money nor I am nearly as smart as even the worst GM in baseball or have the slightest bit of info that Melvin has.

[KCBrewerfan34]

Ennder go look at that Sheets thread its littered with sign Sheets sign Sheets! and there are people who still want to throw $15 million at Ben. It's hard to let go but just let him go guys.

 

 

 

GO Brew

 

 

(edit: multiple exclamation marks --1992)

[AdvantageSchneider]

Worst. Offseason. Ever.

 

I would think 1-2 would be

 

Paul Molitor leaves

Jeffery Hammonds 3 yrs- $21M

 

3rd place would be the year we gave Teddy Higuera a 4 year contract

 

I imagine I'm leaving out quite a few other off seasons. Not in my top 3. Maybe we should do some sort of ranking.

[logan82]

Ennder go look at that Sheets thread its littered with sign Sheets sign Sheets!

Most of that was under the assumption that his injury was only minor and didn't need surgery let alone 9-10 months of recovery after that surgery. As to the calls for still giving him $15M+, well he's a really nice guy, but I don't think anything more than a minor league contract would make much sense. I hate to see the guy go, but there isn't much to be gained from our continued relationship with Sheets. Maybe hope he signs with us in 2010 and can pitch.

[Fatter than Joey]

I imagine I'm leaving out quite a few other off seasons. Not in my top 3.

Lost Jack Z

Lost Jim Powell

kept Dale Sveum

Boned on Sheets+CC picks

 

It's starting to piss me off.

[AdvantageSchneider]

Lost Jack Z

Lost Jim Powell

kept Dale Sveum

Boned on Sheets+CC picks

None of those things will directly hurt our chances this year. And really only the picks will have a long term impact on the club. Compared to losing Molitor, we went from what 92 wins to 13 years of losing baseball. Hammonds stunk if up for 3 years and ate up a ton of cash we could have used.

 

The guys that replace powell and Jack Z, might be even better. Those aren't even negatives, yet.

[Fatter than Joey]

Those aren't even negatives, yet.

 

Signing Hammonds wasn't a negative in the off-season he was signed in either. I am talking about real time suffering.

 

Losing Molitor really stung at the time it happened -- I'll certainly agree with that one.

[dlk9s]

Losing Molitor really stung at the time it happened -- I'll certainly agree with that one.

Plus, my aunt and uncle were building a house across the street from his. I was dreaming of going to visit, then having Molitor invite me over to play catch. Bando killed me.

[SeriesFinale]

Ennder go look at that Sheets thread its littered with sign Sheets sign Sheets! and there are people who still want to throw $15 million at Ben. It's hard to let go but just let him go guys.

It's littered with that because, as ennder said, no one knew at the time the extent of the injury, including, apparently, DM, who offered him $12m arbitration for this season (of which he'll miss half in a best case scenario).

 

Even now, a couple of us don't think it would be the worst move ever if they could somehow lock him up for 2-3 years with a low-money, low-risk, high incentive deal--and it's not like it's only Brewers' fans suggesting this, either. At the right price, I'd take some more mileage in late '09 and '10 from a Ben Sheets even at 75%, since we're not going to get any picks from his departure now.

[edod]

If the Brewers are on the hook for his surgery costs, I certainly would want control over him for 2009 <1mil. Late season push, he gets to ride that into 2010 free agent market.

[Invader3K]

I'm shaking my head as to why my post was deleted yesterday.

 

Anyway, like I tried to say, I think this off-season has shown how dangerous it is to plan on possible comp picks panning out. It's been a pretty rough off-season and I'm looking forward to spring training to at least kick in. Hopefully Gallardo and Parra both look good and we can forget about Ben Sheets for now.

[Thurston Fluff]

I still say a 3 year 15 million dollar deal even if he misses the first year. Then again, it's not my money nor I am nearly as smart as even the worst GM in baseball or have the slightest bit of info that Melvin has.

 

I don't think Sheets would sign for an average of $5 million over three years. If he has surgery and gets five or so starts to show he is healthy he will get way more than that next winter. He is not hurting for money. He already has millions in earnings so it isn't a bad time to take a risk and see if he can't still get that last big contract. IIRC Chris Carpenter went to St Louis after an injury and made out alright after the showed he was healthy.

 

Compared to losing Molitor, we went from what 92 wins to 13 years of losing baseball.

 

If we only lost Molitor that year it wouldn't be as bad as this year but we lost Scot Fletcher and Chris Bosio as well as a few other guys that I can't think of off the top of my head. That year is always remembered for losing Molly, and rightfully so, but we had huge roster change from competent major leaguers all over the field to Sal Bando's assembled group of janitors and grocery store clerks in baseball uniforms.

[Invader3K]

I don't see how anyone can reasonably project Sheets to pitch at all in '09. It's already February, and most estimates say he won't be able to play for 9-10 months. That would put him into November at the earliest. Yeah, maybe he will make an amazing Gallardo-like recovery late in the season, but I really wouldn't hold my breath.

 

The Brewers just aren't in the position where they can pay injured guys year in and year out just on the slim chance they can perform. We're not the Cubs.

[brewerguy71]

If the Brewers are on the hook for his surgery costs, I certainly would want control over him for 2009 <1mil. Late season push, he gets to ride that into 2010 free agent market.

Its a workman's comp type of issue. If you get hurt on the job and leave that job, the company that you worked for, while being injured is still due to pay for medical costs. And if you are a "free" agent and do not work for that company anymore, they have no right to retain you for your services for simply fulfilling their duty as an employer at the time of your injury.

 

 

(fixed code --1992)

[Invader3K]

bg71, I think edod wasn't suggesting the Brewers would automatically retain Sheets' rights, I think he's suggesting they should try to sign him to a low contract for 2009 in case he makes a miraculous recovery and is able to pitch again this coming season.