How do you look at Prince?

[DuWayne Steurer]

In many many ways Prince's words, mannerisms and actions kind of hint at "angry young man". I don't know the guy, I don't spend time around him, it's just one person's opinion based on the very limited exposure.

 

Prince always seems to have a chip on his shoulder. Some people can use that as fuel to light their fire, but Prince seems (to me) to just carry a grudge towards life in general.

 

Obviously he's a great physical talent, I'll be sad when he leaves Milwaukee. I don't begrudge anyone the desire to make as much as they humanly can. I just think that comments like "I'll get mine", along with his demeanor in general hint to me that he still has some growing up to do.

 

Now, I don't care about any of that, I'm just a baseball fan and fan of the Brewers. But I'm bored at work and the topic sparked me to post.

[Gobias Industries]

Weight: It will always be something people watch with Prince. It was when he was drafted, it was last ST, it was with his father. I think the whole vegetarian thing wasn't so big of a deal, except that he changed his eating habits and then came into ST overweight. Probably would have done the same eating steak, but people see the two related... Also, because of his weight people wonder how long of a career he will have.

 

Money: Living in a small market with mostly blue collar type workers, I think people generally detest the "show me the money" attitude. Its not that they shouldn't get paid (or even the amount), but the attitude of it all. As others have said with last spring's contract extionsion offer, then complaining about the renewal, he displayed that attitude (I'll get mine). Braun's signing didn't help, since that showed the opposite attitude. Its not the $$, but the attitude about the money.

 

Agent: Who doesn't despise Boras? Why would good Prince deal with the prince agent of darkness? Plus its pretty obvious that the Brewers won't be able to afford him after arbitration is done.

I agree with you on almost every point, but I'd have to argue that the casual fan doesn't have any idea who Boras is. I consider most of my friends casual fans (they probably consider themselves diehards) and I'd bet money they wouldn't know about him. Actually, I think a lot of people don't know how the pre-FA years work. I've had at least several people ask me "do we still have Fielder?".

 

I think probably the biggest thing that hurt him with the fans was when he became a vegetarian. People used that as the source of the problem for his weight gain (crunching doritos over his salad lol) and his early season power outage.

[joepepsi]

I wonder if Prince's weight gain is symptomatic of an attitude all the young Brewers stars seemed to carry into last year. Hart, Braun,Weeks, Hardy, and Prince have been guaranteed starting jobs in Milwaukee since the mid minors. It was the right call to make in the rebuilding years, and Ned seemed to be the right manager for the job. He showed patience and support the first year or two.

 

Last year, these guys came in, all off of pretty good seasons and were guaranteed starting jobs. When they struggled it didn't matter, they still played every day. This is pure conjecture on my part, but it appeared all these guys save Hardy, started the season with a touch of complacency. Their jobs were guaranteed; performance didn't matter to Ned, they still played every day. Rather than being kids were constantly being pushed to get better, and pushing themselves to improve, they seemed to have the swagger of veterans who maybe didn't do enough preparation in the offseason. They thought they were good enough to get by on talent alone. What they found out was the league was onto them, and at various times throughout 2008, each one struggled to make adjustments.

 

My hope for 2009 is that these guys are working on getting better this winter. That they aren't satisfied with last year's performance and want to, borrowing a cliche here, take their game to the next level. My other hope is the new manager approaches each game with an eye to putting out the best lineup for that day, not just penciling in the same group because they are the "starters".

[Thurston Fluff]

On the field I look at him a little like a rich man's Jose Valentine. A guy who does some great things then screws up an easy play to make all his heroics seem smaller than they should. He's far better a player than Valentine was but both could make you so happy and so mad in the same game. Off the field I am a little disappointed in his whining about his salary and stuff like that but overall don't really care as long as it doesn't effect his performance on it. Other than that he seems like a good family man who treats most people with respect. What more can you ask of him? I'm happy he's ours and when he leaves will not be angry with him. Just won't cheer for him in another uniform like I do in ours.

[Nottso]

I like Prince, but Braun has become my favorite Brewer. I am absolutely the quinitissential Milwaukee area, blue collar type guy, and as has been stated, the attitudes about the money make a huge difference to a guy like me.

 

I also think that Prince has a greater handle on "baseball as a business" than most of his counterparts do, due to his literally growing up in a MLB clubhouse. I would imagine that he has a very firm grasp on where and how he intends for his career to play out. I don't know that that grasp includes or precludes the Brewers, but I'd imagine he has a master plan, and he intends to follow it. Just my opioinion, such as it is.

[fortwaynebrewer]

Impatient and vain is how I see prince. Whether it is prince's fault or Yost's he had a terrible 2 strike approach and always swung for the fences with risp with 2 outs. Quit trying to be the hero already and hit the ball like we know you can.

 

Career splits link:

 

http://www.baseball-refer...?n1=fieldpr01&year=00

[sheetswannabe]

I usually look at him through a McDonalds window..

 

In all seriousness, I think hes a good guy and loves the game. Huge talent for a huge man. He just needs to control himself more.

[CheezWizHed]

One other point, however minor, was that he replaced a fan-favorite player. Not that people don't like Prince, but Overbay had a cult following and made a fun atmosphere everytime he came up to bat. I don't think too many people blame Prince for pushing out O, because of talent. But Prince doesn't have the cult following that O did.

[CheezWizHed]

I agree with you on almost every point, but I'd have to argue that the casual fan doesn't have any idea who Boras is.

Yeah, you are probably correct. But if they only know one agent's name, its Boras. In fact, I would be hard-pressed to name another ML agent (hopefully Josh-agent39 will join those ranks soon)

[logan82]

Casey Close

 

I don't remember Fielder doing as many interviews last year. Seemed like he kept to himself and I think that may have hurt his popularity. I don't think any differently about Prince than I did at the end of the 2007 season. I think he is a really good hitter who plays bad defense and will probably have to be moved to DH around the age of 30 if not sooner. As always, I hope he proves me wrong and plays good or great defense.

[moofnelson]

How do I look at Prince? Through a wide-angled lens.http://forum.brewerfan.net/images/smilies/smile.gif

 

 

[kramnoj]

Like it or not, Prince is the face of this franchise and the single reason why the Brewers are back on the national media's map.

 

I don't think this is true. Look at the player the Brewers are using to promote the 9-packs: http://milwaukee.brewers....specific_MIL_9packs010909

 

The Brewers have Braun under contract through 2015. He's clearly the face of the franchise.

 

As far as the single reason that the Brewers are on the national media's map? I don't think you can support that. The CC trade was a huge boost for the Brewers image nationally. The Braun signing made national news. The playoffs obviously can't be ignored.

[RightFieldCoder]

Impatient and vain is how I see prince. Whether it is prince's fault or Yost's he had a terrible 2 strike approach and always swung for the fences with risp with 2 outs. Quit trying to be the hero already and hit the ball like we know you can.

 

Career splits link:

 

http://www.baseball-refer...?n1=fieldpr01&year=00

I'm amazed at the split difference when the team wins vs the team losing. I'll have to look at other Brewers to see if they have such a gap.

 

I thought of Prince as one of the guys who would turn this franchise around. I thought there was a 50% chance he would spend the majority of his career in Milwaukee, like Jenkins did. The minute I found out he had signed Boras I started to emotionally detach from him as a player. I realized there was no way he would be in Milwaukee by the time the 2012 season came around, so I cheered him as much as a guy like Carlos Lee. The contract Braun signed along with both of their remarks at the beginning of the year caused me to look at Braun as the face and leader of the team. I still cheer Prince and wish a HR every time he's up, but now the jersey of "The" guy has lost the 2.

[DHonks]

http://www.theonion.com/content/files/images/Burger-Hotdog-2-R.jpg

[razzzorsharp]

I see him as a player that lets his emotions get to him and cares very much about his team and winning. I like him and I hope he is around for the next 6 years.

[TheCrew07]

I can see why people like that Fielder plays hard on the field, it's admirable quality. However his diving to make tags is just not a smart play, and never has been. How many 1B at any level have we seen dive to make tags, or come off the base to make a tag when they didn't necessarily have to? There's nothing fundamental or smart about those plays and while they are "good effort" plays, I hope I never see him do that again. It's not safe for the pitcher, the batter, or Prince himself when that mass of humanity is flying through the air, it's a recipe for disaster. His poor decision making in the field has already cost this team more than many around here are willing to accept.

 

I don't think Prince's offensive woes early last year had anything to do with weight gain and everything to do with swinging off of his back foot trying to hit home runs. I do believe his weight gain has negatively impacted his play in the field.

 

I believe he's a premium offensive player who's a defensive liability and will never sign with Milwaukee long term and as such I see him as a prime candidate to help the organization address it's lack of SP depth. I'm not sure why a team like LAA wouldn't be interested in moving some pitching for him.

 

I don't know anything about his character off the field, I don't know him personally, but he isn't someone I'd champion to kids as someone they should try to emulate. The only player in the field that fits that mold for me personally is Hardy as he's fundamentally sound all the way around. I'm into guys that get the most out of what they have and I don't see that from Prince.

[GAME05]

amazing how attitudes shift so quickly. two years ago he could do no wrong, but then he has a down year (for him) and all his issues get magnified.

 

to a small extent, Molitor became something of an antihero when he bolted for Toronto. maybe something of the same deal.

 

though we're middle of the road, Milwaukee will always be viewed as that small market that has to be careful about money, and we have that general dislike of big-money, big-market philosophies. Fielder and Boras represent that, plus the small-market curse that as soon as you develop a talented player, they leave for another team.

[Invader3K]

I don't think Molitor was hated here when he left for Toronto...I think more people were mad at Selig and Bando for giving him such a low ball offer that he had no realistic choice but to leave. Molitor got a pretty huge reception when he came back to Milwaukee, actually.

[sheetskout]

Prince is a special, special hitter and unless a potential deal is overwhelming, I would love a long-term deal.

[8brewcrew]

Anyone notice Prince's new tat? He got another one put on his neck. Are his tattoos looked down upon by some people? Especially the ones on his neck? I know a lot of players (Josh Hamilton especially) cover up their tattoos out of respect to baseball. Prince doesn't seem to try to do that. Same goes for Corey Hart though, but the fans love him.

[logan82]

Pitchers have to cover their tattoos. I see nothing wrong with tattoos. I don't think it makes any difference to most people.

[8brewcrew]

I agree with you Logan about tattoos, I have no problem with them. However, I feel like society judges people with tattoos on their neck as being "thugs". Prince's new tat stretches onto the back of his head. I can't imagine that improves his image. If you were the brewers, who would you rather have as the face of the franchise, Braun or Fielder? Braun has a much "cleaner" image than Prince.

[Invader3K]

I think most people are used to the idea of professional athletes having a few tattoos in 2009.

[phxMILWfan]

I posted this in another thread but I thought maybe this was an appropriate place as well. I had noticed that Prince's ABs directly following a Ryan Braun HR were usually horrible. Usually a K or a weak ground ball out. I think that he would go up to bat pressing trying to keep up with Braun whether it is contract related or just wanting to be a team leader. Here is what I found:

After a Braun HR
BA .188 / OBP .235 / K 9 / HR 1 / RBI 1 /

Every other PA
BA .280 / OBP .380 / K 125 / HR 33 / RBI 101

I know it's a relatively small sample size, but it is 1 whole season. Hopefully the 2 year contract does something to get his mind in the right place. I know this does nothing to help his defense but I also think that people are quick to criticize Prince. His numbers are great. Looking forward to everyones opinions.

[Ennder]

That is interesting but yeah you were right with the sample size thing. If you just pull a random 40 ABs you could end up with almost any results from it, hard to draw any real conclusions from it.