Blog idea: Manny Ramirez to Brewers

[Invader3K]

Here's an article someone linked to on the JSOnline Brewers blog, that was generating some amusing discussion:

 

http://fantasysportsexper...2/best-fit-for-manny.html

 

"After looking at all thirty teams and their current situations I have found the team that would be the best fit for Manny.

 

The Milwaukee Brewers"

 

Of course it will never happen, but it's a fun idea to talk about, I think. The writer in the blog makes some questionable statements (like suggesting the Brewers should keep Cameron and trade Hart if they did acquire Manny), but there's some decent supporting arguments in there.

[ILuvDaBush]

He is the best bat on the open market, but I doubt a Boras "Biggie" would sign a FA contract in Milwaukee. There just are not enough endorsement deals to be had. Also, it would add another large ego to the clubhouse, when it already has two divisive characters (though I do have to chuckle at the idea of ManRam/Prince v. Braun/ManPa).

[superbraun]

I don't think that Melvin would want to deal with Ramirez's or Scott Boras's attitudes.

[twobrewers]

I can't even imagine how Milwaukee would be a better fit than the Dodgers.

 

He is the best bat on the open market, but I doubt a Boras "Biggie" would sign a FA contract in Milwaukee.

The Brewers don't really need a bat. (Well, maybe a LH bat) And Gagne signed with Milwaukee.

[sheetskout]

I don't think that Melvin would want to deal with Ramirez's or Scott Boras's attitudes.

+1!! If Ramirez were ten years younger than maybe Melvin would push through a Boras negotiation, but not for an aging player like Ramirez...

[Invader3K]

Melvin has worked with plenty of Boras clients before, so that really shouldn't be the issue. The big ones would be affordability and potential locker room disruptions. I don't think it would be a good fit at all, but boy, he'd look good in that lineup.

[endaround]

Ramirez wants more than one year and over three years (maybe even over one given defense) Hart projects much better

[PKBadger]

This idea is pretty much a pipe dream...however, if Sabathia was considered a "special case" because he would increase ticket sales and legitimize the Milwaukee Brewers franchise, I don't see how you can argue that Manny Ramirez isn't that exact same "special case".

[endaround]

The difference is that Sabathia would improve the Brewers, there's a good chance Ramirez would not. Assuming the most likely scenario where Ramirez replaces Hart, Rmairez's bat projects soem where between 2-3 wins better. That's huge. However, Braun is likely an average RFer causing the Brewers to lose half a win in RF from Hart. And Braun is a plus left fielder while Ramirez is abysmal, causing the Brewers to go from like +15 runs to -25. So unless the return for Hart is great, signing Ramirez makes the team worse.

[hawing]

Such a signing would certainly remind ESPN that the Brewers exist. But I don't think that's reason enough to even contemplate it.

[nate82]

If Manny only wanted a 1 year contract I would take Manny for 1 year but to be honest I would rather have the Brewers sign Bonds than Manny.

[BrewCrewForever]

I like Manny, think he is a great player. But I don't think I want to put up with him on my team. I don't mind his antics when he is doing it on a team I have no vested interest in, but I would not want him to be a Brewer. I would much rather keep Braun, Cameron and Hart as our OF.

[logan82]

Considering that Manny is probably one of the worst if not the worst outfielders and plays in the easiest outfield position, I could see the overall defense slippage as being more than the offensive upgrade.

[RightFieldCoder]

The fact that the blogger believes Dave Bush is our #2 starter makes me question how much thought and effort went into his post.

[edod]

The fact that the blogger believes Dave Bush is our #2 starter makes me question how much thought and effort went into his post.

Blog aside, how is he not? Parra is too inexperienced to really be tagged the #2, Sup can only be called a #2 by his salary and Yovanni isn't #2 because he's currently considered #1. Different thread maybe.

 

The blog writer's line of logic isn't too bad for an outsider (if he is one). If the Brewers could spend 23 mil/per year on Sabbathia, then they could indeed afford Manny for half the length. It would be a jaw dropping move (because it would defy all the non-financial obstacles to this ever happening) and signify going all out.

 

If I allow my self to indulge in this scenario I would argue that they might as well sign Sheets for two years as well. Two years of Manny/Fielder/Braun and Sheets/Yo/Parra at a significant deficit, then blow the team up for prospects, ala Marlins, rather than Twins/A's. I think the value of the bloggers idea is realizing the Brewers have a maximum window of two years with Fielder.

 

But the Brewers are not using that model...

[logan82]

I completely disagree with trading Hart instead of Cameron as well. I would rather keep the cheap guy we control for 3 years rather than the expensive guy we only have for a year. I would rather keep both over picking up Ramirez.

[endaround]

The problem with that is the Brewers are made incredibly worse under that scenario. So while Ramirez's bat is 3-4 wins better than Cameron's projections, Hart moving to CF would cost like 3 wins defensively, Braun to RF 1/2 a win at least and Ramirez in RF 4 wins.

[GAME05]

the only reason i don't think we'd go after Manny is because he's right-handed. otherwise i'm not totally sure we'd have quite that strong a dropoff defensively with him in LF. yeah, he's terrible, but you'd think the quality of Cameron in CF would make up for some of that with his range.

[recte44]

The fact that the blogger believes Dave Bush is our #2 starter makes me question how much thought and effort went into his post.

It could be argued that he is. It's Yovanni, then Parra, Bush, Suppan, McClung as we're currently constructed. Bush has more wins than any of the other three over the last couple seasons, so it is possible that he is our #2 starter.

[ILuvDaBush]

As Bush goes, so go the Brewers.

[Brian the Automator]

Some people like to post "out of the box" ideas simply so that people read their stuff.

[monty57]

I guess a lot of the "win differential" would be based on what to expect from Hart. If pitchers found a big hole in his swing that he can't close, he might not be nearly as good as most are projecting. For the second half of last season, Hart played like a platoon player, while Manny is one of the best bats in the game.

 

I think Manny to Milwaukee has zero chance of happening, but I find it hard to believe that an OF of Manny in LF, Cameron in CF, Braun in RF would produce less wins than the current lineup. If Hart could be moved for a good young starter, it's a good idea. I just dont see the Brewers offering up the money it would take, and I generally don't like making moves that require a second move (sign Manny and then trade Hart). If you are unable to trade Hart for a decent return, you'd be stuck with too many good OFs.

 

As far as endorsement possibilities, Manny's been in Boston and LA... has he had many "non-baseball" product endorsements?

[rluzinski]

If we simply split Hart's 2007 and 2008 season and as a rough projection for 2009, he's worth 3 wins over replacement, according to Fangraphs:

 

http://www.fangraphs.com/...erid=1945&position=OF

 

He's also just now entering his prime, turning 27 this year.

 

In contrast, Manny has averaged 3.8 WAR over the last 3 seasons and is going to turn 37 next year.

 

Manny is still the superior hitter but his defense really cuts into his overall value. When you also consider their relative age's, there just isn't much difference between the two, IMO

 

The Brewer's outfield is for 2009 is the strength of this team. I don't get why some people are so quick to want to change that.

 

If pitchers found a big hole in his [Hart's] swing that he can't close, he might not be nearly as good as most are projecting.

 

So, after hundreds of minor league AB and 1200 major league AB, the entire league found some way to pitch to Hart to make him into a bad hitter overnight? What exactly did they change that could have caused such a drastic change? I just don't think it works that way.

[dlk9s]

The easiest defensive move would be to move Braun to RF, position Manny as the deep SS, and have Cameron patrol all of LF and CF.

[ILuvDaBush]

Maybe we can teach Manny to pitch so he doesn't completely negate his offensive value with his defensive gaffes. He definitely has some Roy Hobbs-mojo going on.