How to spend the Sabathia Money

[paul253]

Now that he has turned down $20 million per year, whats the best way to spend that money?

I think they should offer Hoffman a 2 year deal worth $9 million per, its a little less that what Wood signed for. Then offer Abreu a 2 year deal for $11 million per year. I dont know if either of those numbers will be enough, but it should be a good start at least. Abreu has to know he isnt going to make what he made last year, which is why the Yankees didnt offer him arbitration. We then trade either Cameron or Hart, preferrably Cameron, for pitching, even if its just a prospect. That frees up more money to sign a starting pitcher like Braden Looper Jon Garland, or Randy Wolf. Then we sign another utility infielder. I was hoping it would be Loretta but now maybe bring Counsell or Durham.

The team would look something like this

Catchers: Kendall, Rivera

Infielders: Fielder, Weeks, Hardy, Hall, Lamb, Counsell

Outfield: Hart, Abreu, Braun, Kapler, Gwynn

Starters: Gallardo, Parra, Wolf, Bush, Suppan (weak rotation to say the least)

Bullpen: Hoffman, Coffey, Julio, Stetter, Riske, Villanueva, McClung

[sgtcluels]

Reports from the Brewers office indicate that the money that was tagged for Sabathia was extra, and above what they intended to spend. Sounds to me like there is only about 10 million of the CC money available, not the entire amount.

 

I'd pass on Hoffman, he's not what he used to be and is trending downwards. Pitching in PETCO probably helps his save numbers.

[rluzinski]

Melvin has already stated that not signing didn't mean that $20 mil was available to sign other players.

[Postseason2006]

Please no more Craig Counsell. That ship sailed two years ago.

[nate82]

I would rather sign Dunn than even think about offering a contract to Abreu who is declining offensively and defensively. Defensively Dunn is just about the same if not a little bit better than Abreu. Offensively Dunn is better by a lot. Offering Hoffman a 2 year deal worth $9 mil per isn't something I would like to do. I would rather offer Fuentes 3 years at $8 mil per year which is what I believe will get it done unless the Cardinals come in higher and then they can have him. It won't take $9 mil per year to get Hoffman more around the $5-7 mil per year for about 2 years.

 

I would then sign starting pitchers who would sign a 1 year deal. Pitchers like Pavano, Penny, and others. Targeting a pitcher like Johnson or Sheets for 2 or 3 years would also be a good idea. Having a rotation of Gallardo, Parra, Penny, Bush, Sonnanstine would be good enough for the wild card. Trading Hart to the Rays for Sonnanstine plus a low level prospect could happen. If the Brewers sign Dunn they would need to keep Cameron because of his defense.

 

A lineup of

1.Weeks

2. Cameron

3. Braun

4. Fielder

5. Hardy

6. Dunn

7. Hall/Lamb

8. Kendall/Rivera

 

Would be an improvement over last years offense. Iribarren, Rivera, Lamb/Hall, Kapler, and Nelson on the bench.

 

Bullpen: Swindle, Riske, Suppan, Villanueva, McClung, DiFelice, Hoffman/Fuentes.

 

The bullpen would be an improvement from last year and the starting rotation would be no worse than what we had up to the point where the Brewers traded for CC.

[jjfanec]

I'd pass on Hoffman, he's not what he used to be and is trending downwards. Pitching in PETCO probably helps his save numbers.

Actually, his numbers last year were much better on the road than at home last year. Overall, Hoffman had a WHIP just over 1 while striking out a batter an inning. His home runs given up spiked so that is a cause for concern but other than that everything looked good.

[trwi7]

In fact, two sources familiar with their plans said, general manager Doug Melvin can't shift any of that $100 million into other pursuits. So if the Brewers are to sign even a lower-budget free-agent pitcher, as they'd like to do, they'll have to first move one of their other salaries, possibly someone like shorstop J.J. Hardy or first baseman Prince Fielder.

Link

[MessiahRp]

We should have considerable money available though with Sheets, CC, Torres, Gagne, Mota, Shouse, etc off the books right? Where is our team salary at compared to last year? I think we should be able to spend something this offseason.

[trwi7]

We should have considerable money available though with Sheets, CC, Torres, Gagne, Mota, Shouse, etc off the books right? Where is our team salary at compared to last year? I think we should be able to spend something this offseason.

People always mention this but fail to mention the raises coming to Fielder, Hardy, Hart, Weeks, Bush, Suppan and Hall.

[rluzinski]

Signing Abreu and moving Hart to CF would make our overall defense in the outfield just terrible. I don't think the 40 point OBP upgrade of Abreu over Cameron would make that move worth it (they project to have about the same SLG), even if Abreu signed a smaller contract like that.

 

Is there anywhere that lists the percentage of RH starting pitchers each team had to face last year? Baseball Reference? I know pwople want to add a LH bat but I wonder how much balancing the lineup is really worth.

[GoudaBrew]

Yikes. This might be a depressing off season. From being a possible landing spot for CC, to avoiding the free agency pool altogether in a matter of hours. Maybe Melvin isn't just using GM-speak when he says our holes will be filled via trades.

[MessiahRp]

Now that he has turned down $20 million per year, whats the best way to spend that money?

 

I think they should offer Hoffman a 2 year deal worth $9 million per, its a little less that what Wood signed for. Then offer Abreu a 2 year deal for $11 million per year. I dont know if either of those numbers will be enough, but it should be a good start at least. Abreu has to know he isnt going to make what he made last year, which is why the Yankees didnt offer him arbitration. We then trade either Cameron or Hart, preferrably Cameron, for pitching, even if its just a prospect. That frees up more money to sign a starting pitcher like Braden Looper Jon Garland, or Randy Wolf. Then we sign another utility infielder. I was hoping it would be Loretta but now maybe bring Counsell or Durham.

The team would look something like this

Catchers: Kendall, Rivera

Infielders: Fielder, Weeks, Hardy, Hall, Lamb, Counsell

Outfield: Hart, Abreu, Braun, Kapler, Gwynn

Starters: Gallardo, Parra, Wolf, Bush, Suppan (weak rotation to say the least)

Bullpen: Hoffman, Coffey, Julio, Stetter, Riske, Villanueva, McClung

 

I'd much rather take low cost deals on Hoffman and Brad Penny and then spend 4 years/$44-48 million for Adam Dunn then pay for Wolf or Abreu. In fact we should still be able to do so within the confines of the lower payroll we should have with all those players that came off the books.

 

Then with Dunn in the fold, I seriously entertain offers for Prince or Cameron as well as Bill Hall. My thought process being if we were to move Prince for another top flight starter or some close to ready prospects, we have Dunn to play first. Or should we have Dunn maybe use him as a corner OF and move Corey Hart to CF.

 

Honestly if we got Dunn, I'd more than entertain Prince/Hall/prospect for Beltre/Putz/pitching prospect. I know people think that teams will give up the farm for Prince but I don't think that will be the case. Sure he'll make a ton in FA but he has Boras for his agent, slumped a bit last year, scares people off with weight/defensive issues and there are a bunch of solid corners IFs to be had.

 

Rp

[MessiahRp]

We should have considerable money available though with Sheets, CC, Torres, Gagne, Mota, Shouse, etc off the books right? Where is our team salary at compared to last year? I think we should be able to spend something this offseason.

People always mention this but fail to mention the raises coming to Fielder, Hardy, Hart, Weeks, Bush, Suppan and Hall.

 

True but I still think the money off the books will be more than total arbitration gains... Fielder and Hardy (probably Hart) should get hefty raises I'm not so sure about Weeks and everyone was aware of Suppan and Hall's higher salary this year (which is why I am 100% against backloaded contracts... if we're always building with an eye towards competing in the future, backloading contracts hurts us badly in those future years).

 

Rp

[bork]

I may be off on the arby numbers, but I get around $70 million with the current players. Add a closer, a utility infielder, and a backup outfielder, we're probably a bit over $80, which I assume is about it for this year.

 

Fielder $7,500,000.00

Weeks $2,500,000.00

Hardy $5,000,000.00

Hall $6,800,000.00

Hart $2,500,000.00

Rivera $400,000.00

Gwynn $400,000.00

Braun $745,000.00

Kendall $4,600,000.00

Cameron $10,000,000.00

Nelson $400,000.00

McGehee $400,000.00

Lamb $400,000.00

*Counsell $400,000.00

 

Suppan $12,500,000.00

Bush $4,000,000.00

Riske $4,500,000.00

McClung $2,500,000.00

DeFelice $400,000.00

Dillard $400,000.00

Stetter $400,000.00

Coffey $800,000.00

Julio $950,000.00

Gallardo $404,000.00

Parra $400,000.00

Villaneuva $450,000.00

Total $69,749,000.00

[yoshii8]

In fact, two sources familiar with their plans said, general manager Doug Melvin can't shift any of that $100 million into other pursuits. So if the Brewers are to sign even a lower-budget free-agent pitcher, as they'd like to do, they'll have to first move one of their other salaries, possibly someone like shorstop J.J. Hardy or first baseman Prince Fielder.

Link

I find it hard to belive that this is true, why would Melvin be meeting w/ Hoffman and Fuentes agents? I believe that they probably won't go out and spend $20 million on free agents this off-season, but I see no way that they won't spend any of the money. I would be willing to bet he took this from Melvin's statement to Haurdricourt about not being able to go out and spend the whole $100 million on someone else.

[mkesportscom]

$1 bratwurst. Beer sold by the liter. The "Bonnie Brewers" polka squad in lederhosen.

[paul253]

$1 bratwurst. Beer sold by the liter. The "Bonnie Brewers" polka squad in lederhosen.

Thats the best idea i've heard all offseason.

Adam Dunn cannot be that much better in the outfield than Abreu. While Abreu is getting up there in age, he did still swipe 20 bases last years, so his legs arent exactly shot. His OPS would be a huge boost over what either Cameron or Hart did. Remember Abreu put his numbers up in the AL East against guys like Becket, Dice-K, Halladay, Burnett, and Kazmir. He also wouldnt require the long years that Dunn would. Yes the defense would suffer, but Hart has speed and has played center before, and while its not ideal, its not the end of the world. After watching last season, I am convinced the Brewers couldnt care less about defense. Eliminating Sheets contract alone should cover the cost of the raises to Fielder and Hardy, and we also got ugly contracts like Gagne, Turnbow, and Counsell off as well. Trading Cameron would save $10 million, which would about cover Weeks and Hart and the raise to Hall and Suppan.

Whatever happens, they need to sign a closer. You cant go into the season expecting to compete when you have guys like Coffey, Jorge Julio, or Seth McClung trying to finish games.

[nate82]

Adam Dunn cannot be that much better in the outfield than Abreu.

Oh but he is. http://www.baseballmusings.com/archives/030110.php, http://www.baseballmusings.com/archives/030127.php, and more defensive stats, some more.

 

Abreu defensively has been declining and his offensive stats he would bring to the Brewers would off set his defensive deficiencies. Dunn would bring in more value than Abreu.

[AdvantageSchneider]

The only problem with Dunn is he hates Milwaukee/Miller Park. So I doubt he'd want to come here unless we wanted to overpay him. Even then he might not sign.

[RU Rah Rah]

In fact, two sources familiar with their plans said, general manager Doug Melvin can't shift any of that $100 million into other pursuits. So if the Brewers are to sign even a lower-budget free-agent pitcher, as they'd like to do, they'll have to first move one of their other salaries, possibly someone like shorstop J.J. Hardy or first baseman Prince Fielder.

Link

I am going to scream if the team trades JJ Hardy and keeps Rickie Weeks. That is absolute Bizarro World territory.

[PilprinBuddha]

Unless we get some starters, what is the point of adding a closer. We should have gotten one last year.

 

Losing CC doesn't depress me, but the whole duct tape and mirrors message that Melvin is throwing out there reminds me why its so tough to be a Brewer fan sometimes.

[rm121978]

I'm guessing payroll this year will be around $75m. And probably the same next year as well. Let more of the young guys get some experience and then "go for it" again in 2011.

[valpocrewsader]

Can someone summarize how much salary the Brewers are shedding and gaining in 2009 as of right now? The "Salaries" page of the main BF.net site already has taken most of the players lost off the list.

 

Sheets - $11 ?

CC - (pro-rated) $3 ?

Torres - $3.2

Gagne - $10

Mota - $3.2

Shouse - $2 ?

Cappy - $3.7

Counsell - $3

Branyan/Durham - $1

 

~ $40 million. Am I close? Am I forgetting anyone?

 

How much do we estimate in arby raises?

 

Bush + $1.5

Fielder + $5

JJ + $3.5

Corey + $2.5

McClung + $1

Rickie + $1

 

~14.5 million. Am I close? Forgetting anyone?

 

Whose contracts are resulting in raises this year?

 

Hall + $2

Cameron + $4

Suppan + $4.5

 

~10.5 million. (For a total of about $25 million in raises. Ouch.)

 

So that's about $14 million to spend if this year's payroll matches last year's. I guess let's pray that it does -- not much left to spend on players for 2009. And a sliver of that has been chewed into already by signing Julio and Coffey. I'll cross my fingers for a Cameron, Hall, or Fielder trade, I guess.

[clancyphile]

Unless we get some starters, what is the point of adding a closer. We should have gotten one last year.

 

Losing CC doesn't depress me, but the whole duct tape and mirrors message that Melvin is throwing out there reminds me why its so tough to be a Brewer fan sometimes.

Well, what can be done in the international scouting arena (Japan/Korea/Taiwan/Australia) with $20 million a year? Or even half that figure?

 

It's obvious: The Brewers get blown out of the water by the big-market teams in FA, so it's time to get outside the box. It's time to get sources of talent and get ahead of the curve for once.