New Grass at Miller Park - can UWM finally play on it?

[knowitall]

Here are links to an articles from JSOnline regarding the new infield grass used in the 2nd half of the season, and now the outfield will also be redone with the same type for the 2009 season. Apparently this stuff is "like a pool table" and is pretty strong.

 

My question is will the grass be firm enough so that the field can be used by UWM? I talked to Vanden Berg very briefly a couple of years ago and he stated that they don't want UWM on the field too much because the old grass was simply not strong enough for that much use. It is an absolute shame that UWM cannot use the park in fall for workouts and in spring for practice. Also, there is more than enough open time at Miller Park in April and May for UWM to schedule home games around the Brewers schedule. As far as I'm concerned, even though the Brewers have the right to control the facility, but with the stadium tax and UWM being public, it seems like accomodations should be made by them for the best interest of the university. Hopefully the new AD at UWM will be pro baseball and try to work something out.

[clancyphile]

I wish they'd gone with FieldTurf instead.

[DougJones43]

Even if this grass is better and more durable than the old stuff, I don't see why it would be a good idea to put extra wear and tear on it with a college baseball team. Unless letting UWM play there brings in lots of money, everything in the Brewers' power should be done to keep the field in the best possible condition for when the Brewers play on it.

[MHgb]

How many fans does UW-M draw? A couple thousand? Does a stadium that holds 45,000+ need to be operated for that? College World Series, maybe. UWM vs. UWW/UWO/etc.? Probably not.

[knowitall]

Even if this grass is better and more durable than the old stuff, I don't see why it would be a good idea to put extra wear and tear on it with a college baseball team. Unless letting UWM play there brings in lots of money, everything in the Brewers' power should be done to keep the field in the best possible condition for when the Brewers play on it.

I know that the Brewers should come first, but I don't think its unreasonable to play 15-20 games at Miller Park seeing as though the stadium was paid for by tax payers of the stadium district. And since about 29,000 of their children attend the university, I think they deserve a decent place to watch and game. I just don't see this as being interference or causing undue wear and tear, and don't think it should be about how big the place is or how empty it might look. Its a perfect place to play up here in the north.

[temke]

i hate to nitpick, but i dont think all 29,000 students at UWM are from the 5-county tax area.

 

also, most athletic programs pride themselves on the fact that their operations run on zero taxpayer dollars.

 

they also only usually play about 15-20 home games total.

[knowitall]

i hate to nitpick, but i dont think all 29,000 students at UWM are from the 5-county tax area.

 

also, most athletic programs pride themselves on the fact that their operations run on zero taxpayer dollars.

 

they also only usually play about 15-20 home games total.

The point is that UW-M should be able to rent the field now, and pay for it from its athletic budget or booster club. Just don't see the objection because there is no "undue wear and tear" as the stadium district board calls it. Heck, the Brewers are trying to bring in extra revenue by renting the place out - why not baseball?

[JJHardy7]

I know that the Brewers should come first, but I don't think its unreasonable to play 15-20 games at Miller Park seeing as though the stadium was paid for by tax payers of the stadium district. And since about 29,000 of their children attend the university, I think they deserve a decent place to watch and game. I just don't see this as being interference or causing undue wear and tear, and don't think it should be about how big the place is or how empty it might look. Its a perfect place to play up here in the north.

 

I went to UW-M and know a lot of the baseball players that were there while I was there and they're good guys, but this is a terrible idea to play 15 - 20 home games at Miller Park. I don't say this to be a jerk, but just from a cost view this doesn't make a lot of sense. Miller Park would have to have workers for the game and I doubt they'd get enough crowd to even break even. The Brewers are trying to bring more revenue in, but I don't think they view it as a charity/break even thing at this point. If the bottom line made sense, UW-M would be playing there, but the fact is most don't care about UW-M baseball at all (I don't say that to be a jerk, but that's a fact) and it won't bring money in. Even the UW-M basketball teams had crappy attendance the years they went to the dance. The major problem was that UW-M students had to travel downtown to see games and there wasn't always a bus provided -- I don't see students trying that hard for baseball. It's a good idea, but I just don't think UW-M draws more than 5,000 fans (at the very most) and combine that with operating at a horrible efficiency level I don't think it makes sense. Maybe a game or two, but that'd be all and the only reason they'd get that is because UW-M is a sponsor of Miller Park. It wouldn't be a income maker.

[Baldkin]

Plain and simple it would be way too expensive for a college baseball team that draws under 10,000 fans to rent out Miller Park 15-20 times a season. Once or twice, maybe.

[Buckhunts]

There is absolutely no way this will ever happen, at least not 15-20 games. The best they can hope for is a game or two during the season. Think about it. After the season is over, the grounds crew really only has a month and a half before they have to put the tarp on the entire field for the winter. So they would prefer to maintain the field and get it healthy so when they uncover it in March, it won't look like hell. And from that point they want the field to look the best it can for opening day, which makes complete sense. Talk to anyone in the front office and they will tell you yes we want to maximize revenue, but if it means compromising the field, they will always err on the side of caution. This is the same reason why they will not have a concert on the field in the Spring. Does anyone remember the guy who tried to start a petition to get U2 to play a concert in Miller Park on St. Patrick's Day?

[knowitall]

All points are valid, but UW-M does not play baseball to make money. For lack of a better description, collegiate athletic departments have a mission on non-revenue sports to provide them for the betterment of student athletes in the state, the student body, and the community. Every single sport other than mens basketball and football lose money from a budget perspective but thats part of the deal. I will give you that fall is off limits because of maintenance, but you could get 20 games there in spring and some practices without wearing out the field. The grass is still dormant yet until April, and by then the Brewers are on it already. I just don't buy that it is inconvenient or excessive wear and tear, but sounds like I'm the only one out there!!! The Brewers could give back a little - don't you think???

[Patrick425]

I'm not sure how often this is done, but there are HS games that get played at Miller Park:

 

http://www.prepsonthenet....sreader.aspx?article=1567

 

http://www.gazetteextra.com/millerpark051107.asp

 

http://www.madison.com/tct/blogs/prepwork/300555

[TuesdaysWithRillo]

Random Lake has played at Miller Park twice in the last 5 years. That's where I went to HS. I got a chance to see my brother hit a double at Miller Park!

[JJHardy7]

The Brewers could give back a little - don't you think???

 

The Brewers could give back by letting them play there once or twice. 20 games is way too much and the Brewers would more than be giving back -- they'd essentially have another 'home' team playing 1/4 of the home games at Miller Park that the Brewers do. I would be interested in seeing how much money it would take for the operation, how much money tickets would cost, and how much money UW-M would have to give the Brewers. UW-M might be better off not playing at Miller Park since they most likely would get to keep a much larger percentage. I know the baseball team isn't out to make money, but I'm sure they would like to run as close to break-even as they can.

[dadofandrew]

A game or three is fine, especially if UW-M is still a sponsor. More than that, they need to shell out some rental payments.

[Buckhunts]

I just don't buy that it is inconvenient or excessive wear and tear, but sounds like I'm the only one out there!!! The Brewers could give back a little - don't you think???

What do the Brewers owe UWM? As for the grass, they typically don't take the tarps off the field until mid March. So you think they should play 15-20 games in a 25 day period?

[knowitall]

I just don't buy that it is inconvenient or excessive wear and tear, but sounds like I'm the only one out there!!! The Brewers could give back a little - don't you think???

What do the Brewers owe UWM? As for the grass, they typically don't take the tarps off the field until mid March. So you think they should play 15-20 games in a 25 day period?

Lets put it this way - the Stadium district, which is run by a board that is supposed to be looking out for the taxpayers of the five surrounding counties in it, leases the stadium to the Brewers. The Brewers have been open to allowing high school baseball teams and UW-M use the facility for a fee. There are two issues in the past that have prevented UW-M from using it more. 1. The Brewers gouge teams big time for rental of the field - $10,000 per game is just way too much when the Metrodome only costs less than $1000 (not 100% sure on these numbers). 2. The grass was crappy and wears down, thus the complete resodding with new and improved turf this fall.

 

Now that the grass is supposedly more durable, there is no reason anymore to keep a baseball team off of the field in spring. So the next point is having the Brewers charge a reasonable fee for usage, which to me would be about $1000 per game - cripes even $2000 a game. You only need lights, bathrooms, and some field prep and a few other things, it just can't cost that much. My point is that I think the Brewers owe a public D1 university in its same hometown the opportunity to lease the field at a reasonable price when most of the kids and families at the university helped pay for the field they are using. Its just being a good citizen I suppose and helping out one of the "baseball fraternity brothers" if you will. This happens frequently in minor league towns where the city and a college team share a publicly owned stadium, and a good example would be the Metrodome, even though the Gophers play some games on campus when the weather warms up.

 

As far as 20 games, UW-M plays all of its February and March games on the road, but returns home for the conference schedule in April and May. They play 55 games, and at least half of them are played during April and May. Thats when they would really need the ballpark, and its already being used by the Brewers then. So I just don't see this as being a big deal and everyone wins - even the Brewers from a PR standpoint. This isn't going to hurt the field.

[milwaukeesportsfan]

I graduated from UWM in 2002. I had a friend on the baseball team, and I went to a few games, and there were not many fans there at all, and most of the fans were family members of the players. It was disappointing, too because UWM had a very good baseball program. My freshman year, they beat Rice in the NCAA tournament. At the time, Rice was the #1 team in the country. That year, I actually called the coach to see if I could try out for the team, but he told me they already had too many scholarship athletes, and they were going to have to cut a couple of them, so they were not accepting walk on tryouts that year, which kind of sucked, but oh well.

 

I actually went to a UWM game at County Stadium, but I can't remember how many people were there. Also, if memory serves, I think UWM actually played a game at Miller Park before it officially opened.

[JJHardy7]

Now that the grass is supposedly more durable, there is no reason anymore to keep a baseball team off of the field in spring. So the next point is having the Brewers charge a reasonable fee for usage, which to me would be about $1000 per game - cripes even $2000 a game. You only need lights, bathrooms, and some field prep and a few other things, it just can't cost that much.

 

This is exactly where I think your idea doesn't make sense. A game or two fine, but I just feel that it does cost much more than $2k and not get any money back in terms of ticket sales. Think of all the workers that will need to be there for say 5 hours or so and that money is easily gone. What's the point in opening up Miller Park 25 times a game for a few thousand fans? If they could get it half full, the Brewers would be able to make some money on concessions and such and it'd probably be an easier selling point. I also don't like the idea of having UW-M play there all that much before the Brewers even play there. I'm willing to bet the field crew needed during that time would be a ton more expensive than not having any games played on it. I also think it might be a good idea to see how this grass holds up first before promising any games -- before the Brewers even take the field.

[knowitall]

I would say 2010 at the earliest anyway becasue the 2009 schedule is out, so the field would have taken for a year already. I doubt that you will need many workers for a UWM game, hardly any in fact. Plus, there is no wear and tear to worry about anyway because nobody really is on the infield grass anyway during a game or even in warm ups or bp, just the outfield grass, which is basically just light running around.

[Buckhunts]

You clearly feel passionately about this. If the my college (Marquette) would have had a baseball team, I would have been pushing for something like this as well. But the facts are the facts. The Brewers treat their field like gold. They don't want anything to compromise the integrity of the field. Yes, they say the field will be more durable, but I think they mean the outfield won't look like an elephant is sleeping in three spots on the field for days at a time, not that the field can (or should) take more games. Baseball teams want their field to look like heaven on earth on Opening Day, and try to keep it that way for as long as possible. Obviously, it probably won't happen, but the bottom line is that professional baseball fields are for professional baseball teams first, and they get to decide who uses the field and who doesn't.

[acwilber]

Hey, that's my Prepsonthenet story! I covered those games and the Miller Park workers are nazis in making sure the high school kids stay off the grass for anything but the game. Even when they run to the bullpen, they make them use the warning track. Not sure how that will change with the new grass, but they are always trying to get it as much light and rest as possible.

[acwilber]

Oh as a side note, those high school teams don't pay to use the field per say. They are each given a certain number of tickets to Brewers games to sell. It's the reason I've stepped on home plate at the park.

[bucksbeat]

I can see the Brewers point on this. The cost and the wear and tear of the grass in the wet, soggy months of April & May. Sure it's a stadium that taxpayers helped build but facts are facts, none of us have any special privaleges in regard to the field. Darn. The stadium is there to generate revenue, UWM would generate about as much as the Brewers selling tickets for people to come and listen to Mark Attanasio read a book.

[knowitall]

The cost and the wear and tear of the grass in the wet, soggy months of April & May.... The stadium is there to generate revenue...

 

In regards to wear and tear - there is virtually none with decent grass. The infield is hardly stepped on and the outfield is a non-issue.

In regards to revenue. The Brewers get all the revenue for sub-leasing, not the stadium district. There is nothing in it for the taxpayers to gouge teams for field usage.

 

(pared back quote --1992)