Sheets watch (closed in deference to new thread)

[Invader3K]

The "You can't invite yourself back," comments were quite a while ago. I'm not sure how they're relevant to the current situation.

[kramnoj]

The "You can't invite yourself back," comments were quite a while ago. I'm not sure how they're relevant to the current situation.

They are relevant because they were the opinion of Sheets, and I don't believe he has said anything or done anything to show that the opinion has changed. Sheets wants a multiple year deal and the Brewers aren't interested in giving him one. It's that simple. I'm not sure why we should be looking for some rift when there isn't any evidence of it.

[brewtank34]

I am a firm believer that all of this Sheets back to the Crew talk is just nonsense as he has shown no interest in coming back and DM has indicated that we aren't going to add payroll...especially to someone who is as injury prone as Sheets. Do I want him back, Yes! But I also understand that there's gotta be reasons why the Crew won't even offer him some dough...even in this market. They obviously know something about Sheets' health that the majority of the other owners know as well. My guess, is that he's not going to be ready for the beginning of the season. This of course is 100% speculation. With Oliver Pear-ez just signing for 13 million a year, Sheets is going to be looking for at least 14/year as Sheets is no doubt a better pitcher than Pair-Ez. In this economy, most owners can't take a risk on Sheets at that price.

[Ennder]

I don't think you can really read anything into what Melvin says, he doesn't like to show his hand. Just like earlier this year when he said he wasn't really interested in spending a lot of money on a closer and suddenly we have Hoffman.

[trwi7]

Just like earlier this year when he said he wasn't really interested in spending a lot of money on a closer and suddenly we have Hoffman.

Heck, he actually came out and said he wasn't interested in Hoffman.

[brewtank34]

Good points....but for this situation, nothing has shown any of us that either party is willing to budge, leading me to believe our April 7th 2009 starting rotation is going to be Sheetsless.

[ILuvDaBush]

I still think the Brewers make too much sense. With all these teams backing off, it's obvious his best course of action is to take the Brewers up on their one year offer with incentives, and try again next offseason. If he pitches like he did last year, he would probably earn $14-16M, especially by starting the All-Star Game. He knows the team. He knows the division.

[RyDogg66]

The only question I have is, if Sheets does not sign with Texas, then who does he sign with?

[yoshii8]

The only question I have is, if Sheets does not sign with Texas, then who does he sign with?

I could see the BoSox, Yankees, Mets or Dodgers signing him to a deal, his upside is so huge and they always seem to have more money to spend. I like the fact that Melvin still won't admit that they have closed the door on Sheets, I think there is still a slight chance that he comes back to Milwaukee (fingers crossed).

[rluzinski]

If all Sheets can get is a 1 year deal with little guaranteed money, there are probably several teams that would offer that right now, the Brewers included. Sheets may still be a month or more away from accepting such a deal, however. I (and apparently Sheets and his agent) think that he can do better than that, though. He may have to give up on a a multiyear deal but she should still be able to get a nice chunk of guaranteed money.

[RyDogg66]

The only question I have is, if Sheets does not sign with Texas, then who does he sign with?

I could see the BoSox, Yankees, Mets or Dodgers signing him to a deal, his upside is so huge and they always seem to have more money to spend. I like the fact that Melvin still won't admit that they have closed the door on Sheets, I think there is still a slight chance that he comes back to Milwaukee (fingers crossed).

At this point, unless there is an injury, I dont see the Red Sox or Yankees signing Sheets, unless Ben wants to pitch out of the bullpen, which cant be that good for his future earning capacity.

 

The Mets seemed as though it were Perez or Sheets and they just overpaid by quite a bit for Sheets. The Dodgers have Kershaw, Billingsly and Kuroda at the top of their rotation and seem close to signing Randy Wolf for the #4 spot. Sheets could make sense as a fifth arm in the rotation but they are also committed to Jason Schmidt who is supposedly healthy this time.

 

That leaves the only other team that has kicked the tires as the Texas Rangers. I do not see any other team but the Rangers coming in on Sheets at this point.

[fondybrewfan]

What about the Nats? They had been rumored to be going after various high priced FA's so they probably have the money. Their rotation is pretty crappy with Lannan, Olsen, Cabrera, Hill, Balester, and Chico. A couple of those guys would be better served in the bullpen or in AAA.

 

Baltimore also seems like a team that has some money to spend given the rumors this offseason.

 

If Sheets is still around 2 weeks from now, I have a feeling he is going to start contacting teams about possible 1 year deals. There are probably at least 5-10 teams that would go one year at less than $10M if the opportunity arose. But since Sheets hasn't shown any interest in taking a 1 year deal those teams haven't surfaced yet.

[bklynbrewcrew]

Either Sheets medical reports are very negative or something crazy is going on here; when has there ever been a pitcher of this caliber unsigned in February with virtually no teams interested. If I didnt know better I would think Sheets is a lousy pitcher.

 

I actually feel bad for Ben at this point. Obviously it was a mistake turning down arbitration but at the time nobody could have predicted that he would be in this position. I am still hoping for a miracle return to the Brewers but if not I hope he surfaces in Texas so I can at least root for him to do well.

[SoCal Brew Crew Fan]

Spoke with a friend who does scouting. He says while Sheets can pitch through his current injury for awhile, it is often a pre-cursor to a more serious injury. Many scouts feel he'll likely have Tommy John at some point...it's not a matter of if, but when. That being said, a one year deal may make some sense...it's going to be tough for Ben to get a 2 year deal.

[bklynbrewcrew]

Spoke with a friend who does scouting. He says while Sheets can pitch through his current injury for awhile, it is often a pre-cursor to a more serious injury. Many scouts feel he'll likely have Tommy John at some point...it's not a matter of if, but when. That being said, a one year deal may make some sense...it's going to be tough for Ben to get a 2 year deal.

Im very sorry to hear that about Ben. Maybe Ben would be in better shape if Yost hadnt abused him for so long.

[Thurston Fluff]

Im very sorry to hear that about Ben. Maybe Ben would be in better shape if Yost hadnt abused him for so long.

 

 

Or he kept himself in better shape.

[homer]

I'm not a doctor, but I don't think Sheets conditioning has much to do with his elbow.

[Thurston Fluff]

Nor did Yost.

[kramnoj]

Either Sheets medical reports are very negative or something crazy is going on here

 

It doesn't have to be either/or. Both can be true. The crazy thing going on is an economy that has practically frozen the budgets of quite a few teams, meaning there is less money to spend on FA talent. Teams would rather spend on the reliable mediocrity of the Garlands than spend on the unreliable goodness of Sheets. Sheets injury history, the nature of his most recent injury that has teams thinking he is a Surgical Patient Walking, his demands for a multi-year deal, it's pretty clear why he's not signed yet. Sheets will get a deal for probably $5-$6M for one year with some incentives in there, it's just a matter of time until he realizes that is his best option.

[Oldcity]

Yost didn't have anything to do with his elbow injury? Care to share your reasoning there?

[Thurston Fluff]

What part of it does Yost have in it? He certainly was not overworked these past few years was he? I think he did overwork Sheets in 02 when he went from 150 ish innings to over 200 which, for a young pitcher, is a lot. But he did not have a workload type of injury for about 6 years after that. Seems a bit odd to blame the manager for a guy who had multiple unusual injuries not related to workload then has a very common injury for a pitcher 6 years after his workload increased and suddenly that was the reason for it. Especially when said workload went down for the last three.

I think it far more likely Sheets, like so many others, broke down due to the usual rigors of his profession than being overworked 6 years ago. Seems way too easy an excuse to blame Yost for everything that went wrong but easy does not mean it's really what happened. Instead the much simpler reason is the nature of the job leads to this type of thing. See Capuano for example. He had two of them and one was well before he ever got here. I don't see a lot of complaints he was mismanaged by Yost that caused it.

I think not doing proper exercises and diet goes a lot further to hamper properly strengthened and maintained flexibility in the tendons and attachments than logging a couple hundred innings three years ago. Not to mention Sheets did put up a few hissy fits when Ned did take him out of games so even if he was overworked it was partially by his own demands.

[Ennder]

Sheets was one of the most abused pitchers in baseball in 2004 even though they knew his back was troubling him and we were cruising to a 67 win season. He was brought back early in 2006 from his injury as well, it was supposed to be roughly a year and he came back in like 8 months. Then last year after 3 partial seasons when he probably should have been babied he again was one of the most abused pitchers in baseball until the all star break.

 

Some of that is Sheets fault as well as he never wants to come out of the game but the Brewers do not have a good history of treating pitchers properly. They also pushed Capuano in his first complete season pitching him on 3 days rest down the stretch just to try to get him to 20 wins even though he broke down the year before.

[fondybrewfan]

I really don't think there is anyway of knowing what happened to his elbow. Perhaps he came back to early from injury, perhaps he wasn't doing the necessary stretches to ensure everything was loose, perhaps he just had one freaky delivery which screwed the whole thing up. I don't think it is really possible or reasonable to blame Ben's most recent injury on any one thing or person. I certainly don't think you can blame Yost, at some point the manager has to trsut the player that he is healthy enough to play. Obvioulsy team doctors cleared Ben and Ben convinced Ned (And Dale) that he was healthy enough. It turns out that he wasn't.

[Thurston Fluff]

As usual Ennder shows me I'm wrong. Thanks, learning is good.

I do think saying the Brewers organization did it is more accurate than Ned did it though. To me that has almost become the defacto excuse for everything that goes wrong, from Sheet injury to the toilet overflowing. I think fondy has the best answer for it. Nobody in particular but maybe everybody in general.

[Invader3K]

I see the Rangers signed RP Eddie Guardado, for a deal worth up to $3 million. Supposedly this could mean they won't be signing Sheets, at least according to earlier reports. Though I'm not sure how a reliever would block Sheets, unless the Rangers' finances are really that tight.