Sheets watch (closed in deference to new thread)

[nate82]

You guys feel better about the current rotation than I do. I guess it might be OK to start out with the current 5 in April, but I just don't see how they are going to crank out 30-ish starts each through September.

I'm not completely OK with the rotation it does need work but I don't see the Brewers going after a starting pitcher. Since most of the guys worth taking a look at are going to cost a draft pick and are probably out of the Brewers price range. Unless one of the players comes at a deep discount I don't see the Brewers signing someone. Sheets would have been one of the players that the Brewers would have went over the expected budget whatever that maybe.

 

If there isn't a trade for someone I doubt Melvin will make a move to get a starter I don't see many pitchers available for the Brewers to realisticly get in a trade. Maybe Wolf will come at a discount and the Brewers will sign him. Wolf would be OK to put between Bush and Parra. Wolf would make a nice #2 or #3 pitcher for the Brewers if the price and years are right though.

[TooLiveBrew]

IF Brittle Ben had pitched well when CC was here maybe the Brewers would have won the division, but he failed to produce good outings time after time.

 

You seem completely incapable of being objective when it comes to Sheets. That line is so far off I just won't even bother re-posting the same free stats (aka facts) that you/I/anyone have/has access to... and have been posted time & time again in response to exaggerations like yours. He pitched a great season in 2008, and without him the Brewers don't even sniff playoffs.

[Tbadder]

Suppan, Fielder, and Cameron's contract will preclude the Brewers from resigning Sheets unless Mark is willing to lose a lot of money next year.

[endaround]

And by a lot you mean some. Mark A is not Bud, he has yet to lose any money year to year with the Brewers.

[PeaveyFury]

IF Brittle Ben had pitched well when CC was here maybe the Brewers would have won the division

 

Sheets post All-Star break: 3.47 ERA, 2.5 to 1 K-BB Ratio, less hits than IP, 2 complete games, etc. He pitched quite well when CC was with the Brewers.

[Patrick425]

Looking at Brian Anderson's blog http://babrewer.mlblogs.com/ , I don't see where he states that Sheets said that he is going in another direction. Here is what Brian said in his blog:

 

Free agent Ben Sheets appears to be headed in a different direction but the door is never closed until he is signed.

Yes, it's still a bit of a long shot, but it doesn't sound like Sheets told the Brewers he already made the decision not to return.

[PeaveyFury]

Yes, it's still a bit of a long shot, but it doesn't sound like Sheets told the Brewers he already made the decision not to return.

 

Yeah, that really doesn't sound like anything different than what we had heard weeks ago at the winter meetings.

[Invader3K]

"Yo and Parra are at this point the arms that will lead the Brewers...and I feel they are ready to handle it."

 

That's where I have to disagree with you. I just don't get how anyone can say either of these two youngsters are ready to lead a rotation when neither of them have barely even pitched a full season in MLB. Gallardo has started a total of just 21 MLB games, where Parra has done a bit more with 31 career starts. Also, it's like people forget Gallardo was gone almost all of last season, and while to his credit he made an unprecedented recovery and pitched well to help us at the end, I think it's a pretty huge gamble to expect that to not have an effect on this next season. If Gallardo and Parra both scuffle early, we will be sunk, having no real stopper, unless Dave Bush or Jeff Suppan or Seth McClung can magically begin to string together quality starts.

 

Of course if the Brewers "ride" Gallardo as the #1 and he gets hurt again, people on this board will blame the Brewers who "should have known to baby him after his injury last season."

[naivin]

Well, let's put it this way, if Gallardo and Parra aren't they guys, the Brewers are cooked.

 

No doubt IP will be something that needs to be watched with Gallardo, but from everything we've seen, the guy has tremendous stuff, and the make up of a 10 year veteran.

 

Parra certainly wore down at the end of last year, but appears to have the stuff and theoretically should be able to pitch more effective innings this year. I guess we'll see.

 

I'd prefer to have a stud in front of them, but it sure doesn't look like that's going to happen, so the only alternative is to try to develop some depth behind them (although I guess I'm not sure where that is gonna come from either).

[Oldcity]

IF Brittle Ben had pitched well when CC was here maybe the Brewers would have won the division, but he failed to produce good outings time after time.

<------Blood boiling, smoke emanating from ears, slowing counting to ten... Okay, I'm good.

[tomwopat]

I can see where this is going already:

 

1. Sheets and the Brewers finally begin to talk

2. Brewers offer a bargain basement deal to bring Sheets back for 2 years at a reasonable rate

3. Sheets uses the Brewers deal to get a bid from another club at $500,000 more

4. Sheets signs with other club.

[bklynbrewcrew]

Melvin really needs to make more of a concerted effort to resign Sheets. We really need a top of the rotation type of starter and Sheets is it. If we dont resign him we need to make a trade instead of signing a 4th or 5th starter type like Looper or Garland who wont make us contenders. To count on Gallardo and Parra as our numbers 1/2 is very dangerous and not the way to go if we plan on contending again this year.

 

I really question how Melvin is putting together this staff at this point. Our rotation is full of question marks and the bullpen is gonna have to pitch a ton of innings if we have McClung and Suppan in the rotation. Also if Parra doesnt improve his control he will have many 5 inning starts as well. Overall Melvin really needs to improve this staff and not with another back of the rotation guy.

[Invader3K]

Melvin really needs to make more of a concerted effort to resign Sheets. We really need a top of the rotation type of starter and Sheets is it.

How many times does it have to be said? "If he doesn't want to come back, he ain't gonna come back." It's not like Sheets is the only decent pitcher the Brewers can ever possibly hope to acquire. He was with the team for a decent number of years, and maybe it's just time for both sides to move on. It happens in sports and life.

 

I would be fine if they can bring Sheets back somehow, but the writing on the wall seems to indicate it just isn't in the cards. I don't see why many here just can't get their heads around that.

[bklynbrewcrew]

If they cant bring back Sheets they need to make a trade for a top of the line starter like Peavy. To go into next season with Gallardo and Parra as 1/2 is just not wise. I think Gallardo is a legitimate ace but after last seasons injury we cant expect him to throw 200 innings. Parra needs to lower his walks if he is to reach his potential but we really shouldnt expect him to be a legit number two starter.

 

Bush has a chance to be a solid 3/4 but Suppan is nothing special and McClung is incapable of pitching more than 5 innings on a consistent basis. I just dont see how this team makes the playoffs with this current rotation and overpaying the likes of Looper or Garland is nothing more than depth instead of what we truly need which is a top of the rotation guy. That is why I think Melvin should try his best to make amends with Sheets or look at the trade market instead of signing a journeyman 5th starter type.

[sveumrules]

i 'd like to trade for a young starter. you'd like to trade for a young starter. i'm sure the brewers would love to trade for a young starter.

 

the question becomes, how many of those deals have gone down this offseason? i remember all of zero.

 

you can't deal if no one else wants to, just like you can't sign a free agent that doesn't want to be in milwaukee. i guess in both scenarios you can force the issue and make something happen, but that type of desperation typically results in overpaying.

 

i'd prefer melvin to stand pat instead of making a move just for the sake of making a move.

[jjfanec]

If they cant bring back Sheets they need to make a trade for a top of the line starter like Peavy. To go into next season with Gallardo and Parra as 1/2 is just not wise. I think Gallardo is a legitimate ace but after last seasons injury we cant expect him to throw 200 innings. Parra needs to lower his walks if he is to reach his potential but we really shouldnt expect him to be a legit number two starter.

Peavy is a great idea except he would have to waive a no trade clause to come here and he has not done that. This is not Melvin's fault. Really nothing with the current state of our rotation can be blamed on Melvin. He went after CC, it did not pan out. The other big name guys had serious issues, like Burnett's contract/injury history, Lowe's age, Johnson wanted to stay out West, Smoltz probably had his choice of teams and picked a contender like Boston, Jamie Moyer is old, Sheets does not seem to want to come back, etc.

What was Melvin supposed to do? The only option is to trade someone and create another glaring hole on the roster. The only guy who we would even think about trading who is worth a top end starter is Prince, but who plays first, bats behind Braun and is left-handed? I guess we could trade Hardy, but who plays short, Escobar needs another year. The blame seems to lay not on Melvin, but if it falls on anyone it maybe should be Jack Z for not developing any starting pitching near major league ready. Sure, we drafted Parra and Yo, but we traded for Bush and McClung, and signed Suppan. Small to mid-market teams need to develop pitching and we just have not done that, our we need guys to have career years so we can trade them for pitching, but Hart struggled down the stretch, Weeks has not panned out, etc, leaving us with few pieces to trade.

[bklynbrewcrew]

I definitely agree that a big part of the problem is that we havent developed enough starting pitching. I just think that it is foolish to think we can contend witrh this current rotation and adding an expensive bottom of the rotation starter is not going to fix that. If we can trade Fielder for some pitching and sign a guy like Dunn to play first we will be fine. I would just hate to overpay Looper because all he really adds is depth.

[Patrick425]

Apologies to MillerParkSouth.

 

According to sportsbubbler http://community.sportsbu...em-up-friday-1-16-09.aspx Brian anderson went in and edited his previous comment about Sheets:

 

 

After causing quite a stir with his comments about Ben Sheets informing the Brewers that he was going a different direction next season, Brian Anderson has edited his comments. They now say:

Free agent Ben Sheets appears to be headed in a different direction but the door is never closed until he is signed.

[azcheesehead]

Trade Fielder to the Pads for Jake Peavey or the Jays for Halladay. We all know Boras isn't going to let Fielder play in a small market when he comes up for free agency. Then go and sign Adam Dunn as a stop gap until the Brewers realize that Mat Gamel is a first basemen or until he is major league ready. They have the space to make all of these moves. Unless Prince comes into camp at a decent weight (which would be nothing short of a miracle after last year) his numbers may decline and getting anything for him of a #1 pitcher caliber could be tough. You gotta make the move now.

[GoudaBrew]

The Pads would, in no way, want Fielder. Adrian Gonzalez is a great baseball player and Prince is getting more pricey every year.

 

I would be interested to see if Peavey would have interest in coming here. Cameron and Hoffman are former teammates so it might be possible. But the Pads would want 4 solid prospects back, not a first baseman they don't need and can't afford.

 

edit:

Of course for us to be able to afford Peavey, we might have to dump Cameron's contract somewhere.

[Invader3K]

Reading the Dunn thread in the Trade Rumors forum, it sounds like that door is shut. So some of these trade and signing ideas are becoming pretty unrealistic.

[joepepsi]

I'd trade Escobar, Gamel, and any two other top prospects for Peavy. He is essentially under contract for the next 5 seasons (counting the 2013 club option).

[Menace II Sobriety]

I'd trade Escobar, Gamel, and any two other top prospects for Peavy. He is essentially under contract for the next 5 seasons (counting the 2013 club option).

 

I have to disagree with you on this one, that is basically saying if this was 3-4 years ago you would trade Prince, Braun. Weeks & Parra for Peavey. That sounds like a hefty price tag. Sure Peavy is under contract but near the end it gets to 16M per season which is a lot to give up when the crew drafted so heavy on pitching the last few seasons.

[Teatoe993]

Oliver Perez seems to be the about the only other top line starter left on the market besides Sheets. Has there been any talk about where he may end up? Any interest from Melvin? In my opinion Perez is a bit too inconsistent to justify the money he'll probably get.

[PeaveyFury]

Perez would also cost us our 1st rounder.