Hall for Teahen.

[piccione88]

Mark Teahen like Billy Hall had a very good 2006 season, and then proceeded to have a very poor 07, and 08. The fans in KC, just like in Milwaukee have turned against these players, and maybe both would benefit from a change of scenery. Teahen does not have the power, or upside that Billy has, but he does get on base better. Teahen bats lefty, without the dramatic platoon splits that billy has, and is much cheaper, 2009 will be his first arbitration year.

 

The Brewers will most likely have to throw some money the royals way, but they still will save a couple of million.

[endaround]

Teahen could just be cut by the Royals, not sure why they'd take on Hall for that.

[BrewCrewForever]

I would consider it, but then we would probably let Branyan walk. Not sure how I feel about that.

[piccione88]

Endaround, are you suggesting that Billy has negative value? If Moore looks at it that way, then yes obviously they would just hang onto Teahen or non-tender him, which I do not see hapening.

[endaround]

Yep, Hall pretty much has negative value at this point, that $8.4 million in two years is really hard for a team to take on after Hall's past two seasons.

[piccione88]

I can see alot of teams, actually the majority of teams feeling that way. There are probably a couple of teams out there like the royals who had a sluggish offense in 08 that would be willing to take a chance on Hall, if and this is the important thing the Brewers were throwing money their way as well. Say between 4 and 5 million over the next two years.

[endaround]

It would be one thing if the Royals were one decent short stop away and take a flyer on Hall, its different when you have a team devoid of talent. And given that the Royals best player, Aviles, plays SS and that they have Gordon at 3b just don't see a match.

[trwi7]

It would be one thing if the Royals were one decent short stop away and take a flyer on Hall, its different when you have a team devoid of talent. And given that the Royals best player, Aviles, plays SS and that they have Gordon at 3b just don't see a match.

 

I've heard they want to acquire a SS and move Aviles to 2B.

[dadofandrew]

KC has said publicly they like Teahen and he'll be back.

 

And yes, Aviles is kind of a Loretta type SS...weak on the range. Hall could fit at SS for them, but the money doesn't fit in their budget.

[piccione88]

Drayton Moore the royals GM has sounded like he is going for it in 2009. He was quoted as saying "We're at a point now where you will never, ever hear me say again that we have young players who are improving. You will never, ever hear me say again that we are rebuilding. That stuff is over. I'm sick of all that."

 

Does that mean they will bump their payroll up 20 million, I am not sure. Moore will probably have more freedom to make a move if he sees fit. The royals will have roughly 60 million tied up after arbitration raises. Teahen likely will get somewhere around 3 million, if we send 2 million over with Billy for the first year, it only cost the royals an extra 1.8 million. For Billy as a shortstop, I think it could be worth the risk.

[dadofandrew]

The Royals are setting themselves up for failure, as they already love to sign mediocre free agents and now are "tired of rebuilding"? They do not project to be much more than a .500 club. They have some very nice young players, but if they "reach" and try to find 90 victories in '08, they may well go the wrong way...just like what happened a few years ago, when they overachieved and dropped down for half a decade.

[ILuvDaBush]

To be honest, they're not that far away from contention. If Alex Gordon and Billy Butler finally break through, they could easily challenge the Twinkies or the Pale Hose. And as mentioned earlier, Aviles will probably be moved in the offseason to second, opening up a very large hole at short. Now I would prefer a Hardy+ for Gordon or Greinke, but Hall would seem to fit the bill of what they want. They're in need of power, and Teahan would be a good target if we traded them Hall. When they originally traded for him from the A's (the great Beltran trade, which is the only trade I remember where a rental was subsequently traded), they thought he was a Gold Glove-quality defender at the hot corner.

[CportBadger]

Bartolo Colon was another rental who got traded about a month later.

[dadofandrew]

I'd say the Royals are 15 wins or so from contention, and that's a lot. The Twins young pitching isn't going anywhere either.

[JohnBriggs12]

I wouldn't be shocked if Royals went hard after former Royal Ibanez. If they got him, then Teahen becomes odd man out. But I think they'd be more interested in Weeks than Hall. Teahen is just one year removed from a solid .285/.353/.410 season and has more value than Hall. He'd be a very handy pickup for Brewers either at 3rd or in RF but he'd need to return to his 06/07 form.

[dadofandrew]

Aviles is a weak SS though. They do not want him to stay at SS, so I doubt a 2B would interest them. Hall's offensive numbers do not look that bad as a SS, though his salary could scare KC away.

[endaround]

The Royals probably should trade Aviles. He is already 27 and his minor league career doesn't seem to support him keeping this up. Yeah he could be Uggla but most likely won't be. A BABIP of .359 doesn't inspire confidence.

[piccione88]

Hall has much more upside than Teahen, and as others noted would play shortstop. So if Hall even puts up something close to what Teahen does, he has more value to the royals.

[ILuvDaBush]

If I had to bet on his [Aviles') numbers for 2009, I'd project a pullback to performance more in the .265/.310/.400 range. That said, I think he should get to play in '09 just to see what happens, either at shortstop or at second base. He is a lot of fun to watch, and his work ethic and hustle are impressive. He is a self-made player, succeeding through work and instinct rather than pure tools. I don't see how the Royals have anything to lose by letting him play. He had the highest VORP on the team this year, and the best ratio of Win Shares per at-bat.-John Sickels

Aviles has a spot on most teams, though even I was surprised by the VORP and WS. Not sure if the Royals really are that weak or Aviles is that good. Either way, he isn't being traded.

[3Putt]

Hall has had below average defensive stats at every position he has played. If a team is going to take a flyer on Billy finding his stick then they need to hide him somewhere and shortstop isn't a place where you hide a bad defensive player.

[piccione88]

Defensive stats are not reliable. Most defensive metrics however said that Billy had above average range when he was starting at short which is the most important thing. Hall makes his share of errors, but overall he is average to above average because of the extra outs he gets because of his range.

 

Even if you dont like Hall's defense that much, you cant say that he isnt a much better option defensivley than aviles. If the royals dont sign Furcal, you could make the argument, that all things considered Hall is just as good an option as any of the remaining free agents.

[3Putt]

Hall has a slow first step which hurts him when he needs to charge balls. We saw that at 3rd and last year in CF. He's one of the least disciplined players in baseball. His baserunning, K's and defense have actually gotten progressively worse as his career has progressed. Let's eat what we have to of his salary and move him. He sets a bad example for the younger players. Hopefully at least one team will think like you do piccione and take a flyer on him. He's too frustrating to watch.

[Ennder]

Hall has decent value in a utility infielder and RH PH role. He just isn't a starter.

[dadofandrew]

His offense plays pretty well as a SS, and not too bad as a 2B. He's got value.

[Ennder]

Hall has a career line of .249/.300/.441/.741 vs righties.

 

His lines the last 2 years are

 

08 - .174/.242/.316/.557

07 - .247/.305/.408/.713

 

I don't see how any team in their right mind would want him playing every day even at SS which he is at best average at defensively. You are better off with an Omar Vizquel type player.

 

As a utility infielder who can also help out in the OF in a pinch he has some value though. Sort of a willie bloomquist type guy with less speed and more pop.