5/17/06 Phillies (Floyd) @ Brewers (Bush), 7:05 PM CST

[badgerfan.tgf]

Quote:

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We did not need to use Turnbow with a 3-run lead to start the 9th.

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Closers ALWAYS come in with a lead of 3 or less runs. Now if you're saying that since Turnbow had pitched the last three games and he needed rest, then I agree but otherwise Turnbow's coming in ten times outta ten.

[PeaveyFury]

Turnbow and Shouse get a blown save.

 

?

 

Shouse is credited with the blown save. Turnbow gets a hold.

[BrewBomber]

Wrong.

 

3 runs charged to Turnbow=blown save

[LaprilOne]

Yost made a move, it did not work. It was a risky, but not a totally weird move.

 

You guys who use "moron" and "idiot" are way off. But then again, it is easy to criticize from afar.

 

I was at the game, and it appeared T Bow was struggling. I recall at one point five balls in a row. He just did not look sharp, he looked out of sorts. Perhaps Yost saw that, and, you got to think Maddux had some say in it.

 

Shouse blew it, but I think the "moron" charges represent emotional and faulty logic.

[JoeH33]

Quote:

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Wrong.

 

3 runs charged to Turnbow=blown save

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Nope

 

Turnbow gets the hold and Shouse gets the blown save.

 

Box Score

[endaround]

Yes last thing that should happen is holding Yost responsible for his decisions.

[brewguy03]

Hi all,

 

First time poster, long time reader...

 

Turnbow got a hold because he left the game when the Crew were still leading 7-5. Shouse gets the blown save because he allowed the tying runs (inherited runners to score) while he was in the game, even though all the ER's get credited to Turnbow.

 

That's my understanding of the "blown save" stat.

[RightFieldCoder]

fwiw to defend Darron as not as bad as anyone else, watch the top of the 5th of 5/16's Astros/Giants game. The Giants announcer actaully says he has no idea why the Astro pitcher would throw at Bonds. Duh, there's about 713 reasons why I would throw at that guy.

 

Just came back from todays game. Dumb, dumb, dumb move by Ned. If TBow needed rest, then you should have left JDLR in or brought in Capellan/Wise/Kolb. I don't care about L/R, I want my best pitcher in there when the game's on the line.

[jloos19]

Brewbomber, Turnbow gets a hold, it doesn't matter that he gave up 3 runs. Shouse gave up the inherited runners, and that means it's Shouse's blown save.

[LaprilOne]

Yes, endaround, I do hold Yost responsible. His decision did not work, however, Shouse is the one ultimately responsible guy.

 

Nonetheless, sometimes, moves do not work. Yet, why is he a "moron" or "idiot" for that move?

 

If we micro review everything, is not he then a "genius" for pinch hitting Rillo?

 

My vent is the name calling, each decision has an outcome, and sometimes that outcome is bad. I just don't get the name calling

[brewerjamie15]

I was able to go to the game today. Lots of fun, I could have done without the ninth inning drama, but a win is a win.

[undertow67]

Somehow I knew Yost's decision to pull Turnbow would be discussed at length here. While I think he should have left Turnbow in to face Howard, the Phili fans seated behind me were upset to see a lefty brought in. Apparently Phili mashes against righthanders, especially righthanded relievers, at least thats the impression I got from listening to them. They were happy to see Turnbow in the 9th replace De La Rosa and predicted they would rally against him, and they were right. They felt relieved to tie the game against the lefty and were confident that they were going to win in the 10th, since we had no lefty's left. These guy's didn't seem like idiot fans, rather they seemed very knowledgable about their team, so I was relieved it never got to the 10th, so we didn't have to find out.

 

Excellent victory for the Crew tonight !

[brewerjamie15]

here's a question for you, and it's gonna catch some serious flack, but that's tough.

 

In the bottom of the ninth, when Manuel walked Billy Hall to get at Jenkins and the lefty on lefty matchup, would you have thought about possibly pulling back Jenks and using (if he was available) Hart? What about Cirillio? I can't think of who else was on the bench, but I'm just wondering about Geoff and his well known struggles against lefties.

Yeah, I know it turned out that he crushed the snot out of the ball and won the game, but what if?

Put yourself in that moment and look at the numbers.

Going into tonight's game, Geoff had 36 AB's against left handers and was hitting only .167 with 6 hits, 5 BB, and 17 K's and 2 GIDP's.

Cirillio had 8 AB's vs. lefties with a .500 BA.

I don't have Hart's numbers vs. Lefties from the minors, but he had only 2 AB's vs them as a big leaguer.

I'll admit the fact that Jenks was having a good game, but I just wanna find out your thoughts.

Look again at Geoff's numbers, and think about it a bit more.

Now look at this:

With 2 or more RISP, Jenkins is hitting .364 in 11 AB's

With less than 2 RISP, Geoff is hitting .227 in 22 attempts.

 

A. Rhodes (L) came into the game with a 3.46 ERA, 13 hits allowed in 13 innings 5 ER, 10 BB (1 IBB) and 15 K's. Opponents were hitting .260 against him.

[Frisbee Slider]

Cirillo would not be available, tonight. Of course, he took over for Koskie late.

 

If you were just speaking in hypotheticals...I'd say Ned wouldn't pull Jenkins, but that doesn't necessarily correlate with what SHOULD happen.

[brewerjamie15]

Yeah, Cirillio was used, that's right. I should have added (if he were available) but I didn't. I guess we throw out Cirillo then. This skews the question even more, but it's still interesting to me though. I'm not a Jenks basher in this particular thread, I'm just looking into numbers and asking some strategy ideas. I know that some people think there is too much emphasis put on L/L R/R matchups, but in this case with jenkins history against the southpaws I wanted to dive into the subject a bit.

[undertow67]

Hart and Moeller were the only options on the bench. I think with having a short bench makes it difficault to pinch hit for anyone other than the pitcher. You bring in Hart for Jenkins and if he doesn't come through, your left with only Moeller to pinch hit in the 10th with the pitchers spot due up 3rd. It would have been nice to bring in Hart to pinch run for Cirillo also, but again, with a short bench, you really can't.

[Sheets4theHOF]

over jenks career he has hit lefties at about a .250 clip (atleast that's what i thought i heard during the game). Not great, but not horrible. He's having a good game and hart is unproven. I don't pull him in that situation. Even more so with the short bench--you could very well need hart in extra innings.

[happydays1950]

over20000 at the game last night.

[burniebrewer]

over20000 at the game last night.

 

Sure didn't look like it.

 

When my friends and I were guessing attendance, I thought it would be around 15,000 at best. I always forget about ticket sales, not butts in the seats.