Bullpen, Melvin's biggest failure.

[Fatter than Joey]

Two draft picks for starters. I don't think the Brewers ever planned on signing Linebrink.

[joepepsi]

The problem with relief pitchers is almost by definition they are inconsistent. If they were consistent most of them would be starters. Villy, Gagne, Torres, and McClung are all failed starters at least on some level.

 

The conundrum with building a playoff team is a GM finds himself emphasizing experience over inexperience. So you spend millions on a bullpen of major leaguers who have had some success in the past instead of taking a risk with younger pitchers who may actually be better. This is a problem when building the bullpen because it seems past success as a reliever is not a very good indicator of future success. I think a big reason for this is because a lot of the success a reliever experiences is due to a manager who does a good job of using that pitcher and his bullpen. I'm not a big Yost basher, but he is weak on bullpen management. It's his greatest fault. Unless Melvin has mandated that the top paid relievers have to pitch in the most pressurized situations, it's Yost's fault we are still seeing Gagne, Mota, and Riske this late in the season in close games. He has better alternatives; he simply refuses to use them.

[Roderick]

If the game is on the line (1 or 2 run lead, 7th inning on) can we trust Gagne, Riske, Mota, Shouse (other than situationally), or Torres. I don't think so. And I don't think Nedley does either.

 

Well, if Ned doesn't, then why does he keep using Shouse non-situationally, Gagne in the 8th inning of close games, etc?

I thought Yost was conspriring with Melvin to keep Shouse's pricetag down for 2009. Seriously, I don't recall too many high-leverage situations that Yost has kept Shouse when multiple righties are up.

[sweepscc]

Unless Melvin has mandated that the top paid relievers have to pitch in the most pressurized situations, it's Yost's fault we are still seeing Gagne, Mota, and Riske this late in the season in close games. He has better alternatives; he simply refuses to use them.

You can probably add Torres to that list pretty soon. That's pretty much the whole bullpen Melvin gave him. Or is Stetter going to be our new closer until he sucks it up too? How anyone can blame Ned for using what Melvin has given him is beyond me. Who does Melvin want Ned to throw in there in a "pressurized" situation?

[crewcrazy]

I just have a really hard time being too hard on Melvin for building this bullpen when it's nearly impossible to determine which relievers are going to be good ahead of time. Yeah, we had a feeling that guys like Gagne and Mota were going to be problematic this year, but we had no idea that Torres was going to be as good as he's been, nobody knew who the heck Brian Shouse was when Melvin traded Enrique Cruz for him, and Villanueva is still so young it's hard to tell how he'll pitch year to year. Riske looked like a solid signing and it looks like he's producing slightly below where he has recently. It's just so hard to tell.

 

He could've gone out and tried to trade for someone, but all reports around the trade deadline indicated that teams with good middle relief were asking for ridiculous returns. I'm glad Melvin didn't roll the dice on a middle reliever trade in the middle of the season for the second year in a row -- I didn't mind the Linebrink trade much (still don't), but I don't want it to become an annual thing. Also, all indications were that there weren't even that many middle relief options out there. When guys like Doug Brocail are being brought up as "the best reliever on the market" you're not going to improve your bullpen very much -- if at all.

[fondybrewfan]

Why can't we actually develop good relievers? That is the question we should be asking. Why can't we bring up closers or at least shut down relievers in our system? Or is part of Melvin's plan to draft only SP and position players in draft and worry about relievers through FA and trades?

[joepepsi]

I just have a really hard time being too hard on Melvin for building this bullpen when it's nearly impossible to determine which relievers are going to be good ahead of time. Yeah, we had a feeling that guys like Gagne and Mota were going to be problematic this year, but we had no idea that Torres was going to be as good as he's been, nobody knew who the heck Brian Shouse was when Melvin traded Enrique Cruz for him, and Villanueva is still so young it's hard to tell how he'll pitch year to year. Riske looked like a solid signing and it looks like he's producing slightly below where he has recently. It's just so hard to tell.

 

He could've gone out and tried to trade for someone, but all reports around the trade deadline indicated that teams with good middle relief were asking for ridiculous returns. I'm glad Melvin didn't roll the dice on a middle reliever trade in the middle of the season for the second year in a row -- I didn't mind the Linebrink trade much (still don't), but I don't want it to become an annual thing. Also, all indications were that there weren't even that many middle relief options out there. When guys like Doug Brocail are being brought up as "the best reliever on the market" you're not going to improve your bullpen very much -- if at all.

I agree with everything you said here!

[zzzmanwitz]

Why can't we actually develop good relievers? That is the question we should be asking. Why can't we bring up closers or at least shut down relievers in our system? Or is part of Melvin's plan to draft only SP and position players in draft and worry about relievers through FA and trades?

Many great relievers start out as starting pitchers. Many organizations even recognize that pitchers will be RPs in the majors, but want to have them be SPs in the minors to give them regular pitching routines and more innings.

[Postseason2006]

This talk of last year is all good and all, but the point is that Melvin did little to fix this years pen. It would've been more valuable to have brought Leinbrink back than to have taken the picks. For those arguing about the value, Leinbrink on our staff this year might have been more valuable.

 

There's no question when you look at what our BP has done so far even with pitchers that have worked late into games.