8/27/08 Brewers (Parra) at Cardinals (Wainwright): 7:15 PM CDT

[JET15]

These games are a lot more relaxing when you start to realize, we are going to the playoffs this year

***

Fine Fido, talk to me September 28th. We are making the playoffs this year.

What are you talking about? Your statements are ridiculous. I know it's your new thing to attack people who aren't totally convinced of this team's greatness, but just stating something mathematically untrue as a fact, doesn't necessarily make it so. But if you've convinced yourself already, then you should probably just stop watching and stop bothering people who still realize these games still have ramifications.

I agree completely. Just ask the Mets

[sheethead]

Rickie Weeks (terrible, even before today's pathetic performance) = .228/.335/.380

Cubs Starting Rotation = .225/.388 (OPS, I am too lazy right now to figure out their collective OBP - I will give that one to talented kid Rickie)

[BrewCrewForever]

Look I get it. There are a lot of people on this board who believe Rickie's "potential" will finally show someday. And you know what, it might. And if it does I will be the first to say I was wrong. But I just don't see it. He strikes out to much, has a low OBP and BA for a leadoff hitter or any hitter for that matter and his defense is very sketchy. Especially his double play turns. I would much rather see Durham for the rest of this year and find a new solution for years to come.

[sargennm]

I live close enough to Busch that I could actually hear the fireworks after the game. I seriously hate the Cardinals, their fans and their bush league antics. I wish the Brewers were playing them again this year. We took 10 of 15 from them anyway. Quit you're yapping St. Louis. Baseball karma is coming to get you.

[rotoherb]

It just occurred to me that this was the first game that was blown by the bullpen when they started an inning with the lead since they blew a five run lead in the ninth inning against the Diamondbacks back on July 3rd. That seems pretty amazing considering the pitchers that the Brewers have in the bullpen.

[sargennm]

I would much rather see Durham for the rest of this year and find a new solution for years to come.

Even if he could have gone tonight, he doesn't have enough left in the tank to go every night. He's said as much and so has his former manager. What are the other options? Counsell? Hall? Weeks isn't a great player, but he's the best option they have on a part-time basis.

[rluzinski]

Look I get it. There are a lot of people on this board who believe Rickie's "potential" will finally show someday.

 

His draft position and pre-professional career expectations mean nothing to me anymore. Water under the bridge. I'm just trying to measure Week's performance against other MLB 2B at this point. I still think he's below average but that doesn't mean I'm going to call every out he makes pathetic, either. Despite is disappointing year offensively, I think he's still above average for a 2B.

 

Defensively? Ummm.

[BrewCrewForever]

Pujols Fires on Villanueva

 

Check out the link about to TH's JS blog. More crap from Pujols. What an idiot.

[IslandsAC]

I lost A LOT of respect for Pujols tonight. And then even more after reading those pretentious quotes on TH's blog.

[hawing]

So, the "lesson" is...what? Don't show emotion when Albert wouldn't approve?

 

If our Carlos had a history of fist pumping or pointing at the sky every time something goes his way on the mound, I'd frankly be irritated by it too. (Like I am by that other pitcher Carlos: whoo, I struck out Geoff Jenkins to end the first!) But I don't think that's been the case.

 

I'm with Islands; Albert's comments put a dent in my perspective on him. Not classy.

[MillerParkSouth]

http://community.sportsbu...ust-28th-daily-drink.aspx

 

This has a pretty good perspective on it. Albert needs to shut his mouth. He watches his home runs a lot too and yet now he's an authority on class in the league? give me a break.

[Grateful cub]

Carlos pumped his fist in excitement, which is clearly in violation of the way the Cardinals have decided the game of baseball is supposed to be played. Pujols yelled at him from the on-deck circle, Prince and Carlos yelled back, and the home plate umpire had to separate them.

Albert might be a tool like Fielder but Carlos clearly did more than pump his fist. He looked at Albert and said something. Nothing worse than homers who can't even state things as they happen but have to put it in a light favorable to their team. Call a spade a spade for godsakes. I may like the cubs but if we get a lucky call, I say we got a lucky call. If Zambrano acts like a fool, I say he acted like a fool. Seriously, nothing worse than homers.

[sargennm]

Carlos pumped his fist in excitement, which is clearly in violation of the way the Cardinals have decided the game of baseball is supposed to be played. Pujols yelled at him from the on-deck circle, Prince and Carlos yelled back, and the home plate umpire had to separate them.

Albert might be a tool like Fielder but Carlos clearly did more than pump his fist. He looked at Albert and said something. Nothing worse than homers who can't even state things as they happen but have to put it in a light favorable to their team. Call a spade a spade for godsakes. I may like the cubs but if we get a lucky call, I say we got a lucky call. If Zambrano acts like a fool, I say he acted like a fool. Seriously, nothing worse than homers.

You are flat out wrong. Go back an look at the tape. It's clear Albert instigated the situation. P.S. If you don't like reading about Brewers fans being passionate about the Brewers, don't troll.

[logan82]

So Cuzzi sucked behind the plate. What a surprise.

[trwi7]

Albert might be a tool like Fielder but Carlos clearly did more than pump his fist. He looked at Albert and said something. Nothing worse than homers who can't even state things as they happen but have to put it in a light favorable to their team. Call a spade a spade for godsakes. I may like the cubs but if we get a lucky call, I say we got a lucky call. If Zambrano acts like a fool, I say he acted like a fool. Seriously, nothing worse than homers.

Pujols was the one who started walking towards him pointing his bat yelling shut the (bleep) up. Only after that did Carlos start yelling back. Get your facts straight next time.

[Grateful cub]

Carlos pumped his fist in excitement, which is clearly in violation of the way the Cardinals have decided the game of baseball is supposed to be played. Pujols yelled at him from the on-deck circle, Prince and Carlos yelled back, and the home plate umpire had to separate them.

Albert might be a tool like Fielder but Carlos clearly did more than pump his fist. He looked at Albert and said something. Nothing worse than homers who can't even state things as they happen but have to put it in a light favorable to their team. Call a spade a spade for godsakes. I may like the cubs but if we get a lucky call, I say we got a lucky call. If Zambrano acts like a fool, I say he acted like a fool. Seriously, nothing worse than homers.

You are flat out wrong. Go back an look at the tape. It's clear Albert instigated the situation. P.S. If you don't like reading about Brewers fans being passionate about the Brewers, don't troll.

 

Anyone who didn't see Carlos pointedly look at Albert to show him up and say something when he was celebrating is blind or just an idiot. TRW7 I'm surprised that you couldn't see reality here. It's one thing to root for your team and it's another to be a complete homer and only see what you want to see. The the whole world thinks Carlos instigated something but you guys thought it was Albert who got upset for no reason. Even one of the biggest morons in baseball, John K in baseball tonight, said he was rooting for the Cards after that bs Carlos pulled. If someone like that can see it, how come you guys can't? Did it seem like Pujols got upset for no reason? Do you think he would get upset for someone fist pumping in celebration of getting out of an inning? He does that all the time.

 

Give me a freaking break. You guys just make yourself look foolish. We have plenty of people who do that on our board.

aka Dstone5553

[trwi7]

Kruk doesn't know a damn thing. We don't know what was said by who and who said what first. What we can see from the video is Carlos celebrating, Pujols then walking towards him telling him to shut the (bleep) up and then Villanueva yelling something back. I'm certainly not going to blame Carlos for yelling something back when he was getting yelled at first.

 

Kruk is a tool. Does he still think it was a three game series or did someone clue him in?

[Grateful cub]

Kruk doesn't know a damn thing. We don't know what was said by who and who said what first. What we can see from the video is Carlos celebrating, Pujols then walking towards him telling him to shut the (bleep) up and then Villanueva yelling something back. I'm certainly not going to blame Carlos for yelling something back when he was getting yelled at first.

 

Kruk is a tool. Does he still think it was a three game series or did someone clue him in?

Agreed--he is a tool.

 

And so are you if you actually believe that Pujols had that kind of a problem with Carol just celebrating. Seriously trw? You honestly believe that? I'm shocked that you are being such a homer but whatever, I am just trolling on the enemy's board to see if they have any smart fans out of bored curiosity (and there are a few) so I guess I don't have much of a right to gripe.

[Brian the Automator]

Agreed--he is a tool.

 

And so are you if you actually believe that Pujols had that kind of a problem with Carol just celebrating. Seriously trw? You honestly believe that? I'm shocked that you are being such a homer but whatever, I am just trolling on the enemy's board to see if they have any smart fans out of bored curiosity (and there are a few) so I guess I don't have much of a right to gripe.

I find it troubling that a Cubs fan with 16 posts doesn't handle himself better than this, knowing that he's obviously on "enemy soil".

 

As far as the altercation goes, here are the facts as we can determine from the footage:

 

- Carlos Villanueva pumped his fist after getting the final out in the inning

- Carlos Villanueva and Albert Pujols had an altercation following that

 

Everything else is he said/she said/speculation.

 

Here's my speculation, for what it's worth:

 

- Carlos Villanueva pumped his fist after getting the final out in the inning

- Carlos probably did something here that was derogatory towards the Cards, or at least was construed as derogatory towards the Cards

- Pujols took exception, because he's the "leader" of the team

- Carlos and Pujols had a pissing match

 

Now, knowing what happened so far in the game with Braun getting deliberately plunked (at least, that's my opinion, since Wainright had zero control issues all night), my guess is that Albert was on the watch for shenanigans. Given that Albert has taken the role of calling other players out for "disrespecting the game" in the past, he instigated the shouting match with Villanueva. Personally, I think it's hypocritcal for him to do that because of his home run admiring, but whatever. I think Carlos and Pujols were both "at fault" here because they were all lathered up about this very emotional game. Honestly, I think fans are trying to blame one side or the other more, depending on what team they're cheering for. Given the complete lack of real facts, I don't think ANYONE is looking at this objectively (myself included).

[sargennm]

Kruk doesn't know a damn thing. We don't know what was said by who and who said what first. What we can see from the video is Carlos celebrating, Pujols then walking towards him telling him to shut the (bleep) up and then Villanueva yelling something back. I'm certainly not going to blame Carlos for yelling something back when he was getting yelled at first.

 

Kruk is a tool. Does he still think it was a three game series or did someone clue him in?

Agreed--he is a tool.

 

And so are you if you actually believe that Pujols had that kind of a problem with Carol just celebrating. Seriously trw? You honestly believe that? I'm shocked that you are being such a homer but whatever, I am just trolling on the enemy's board to see if they have any smart fans out of bored curiosity (and there are a few) so I guess I don't have much of a right to gripe.

Go take a look at the thread in the Major League forum about this. Puljos has had confrontation with so many other pitchers/teams it's quite clear he's the one who tends to instigate these things. Carlos has some culpability, but to act like he is at total fault and people on this board are idiotic homers (pretty ironic coming from a trolling Cubs fan) is patently false. Again, if you don't like what we have to say, go back to the Cubs board.

[1992casey]

Again, if you don't like what we have to say, go back to the Cubs board.

 

Please don't post statements like that.

[Grateful cub]

Here's my speculation, for what it's worth:

 

- Carlos Villanueva pumped his fist after getting the final out in the inning

- Carlos probably did something here that was derogatory towards the Cards, or at least was construed as derogatory towards the Cards

- Pujols took exception, because he's the "leader" of the team

- Carlos and Pujols had a pissing match

 

Now, knowing what happened so far in the game with Braun getting deliberately plunked (at least, that's my opinion, since Wainright had zero control issues all night), my guess is that Albert was on the watch for shenanigans. Given that Albert has taken the role of calling other players out for "disrespecting the game" in the past, he instigated the shouting match with Villanueva. Personally, I think it's hypocritcal for him to do that because of his home run admiring, but whatever. I think Carlos and Pujols were both "at fault" here because they were all lathered up about this very emotional game. Honestly, I think fans are trying to blame one side or the other more, depending on what team they're cheering for. Given the complete lack of real facts, I don't think ANYONE is looking at this objectively (myself included).

Makes sense. Fans trying to blame a side depending on what team they are cheering for is what's annoying... but I'll get over it. You guys have a great team and I doubt anyone is looking forward to facing you.