Any chance of Gallardo in September or October? -- Latest: Yo will start this Thursday according to BCR (reply #234ish)

[TheCrew07]

No athlete has ever come back and played at full strength within 6 months of an ACL reconstruction... The knee operation didn't happen immediately following the injury either, it was 2 or 3 weeks later. While anything is possible, it would literally be a miracle. Therefore, it's best to forget about Yo for 2008 and focus on what we have.

[kramnoj]

No athlete has ever come back and played at full strength within 6 months of an ACL reconstruction... The knee operation didn't happen immediately following the injury either, it was 2 or 3 weeks later. While anything is possible, it would literally be a miracle. Therefore, it's best to forget about Yo for 2008 and focus on what we have.

What are the examples? I genuinely don't know. Hockey and hoops are the seasons that are longer than 6 months, is there anyone who wanted to try to come back and couldn't?

[TheCrew07]

I'll try to explain my personal experience with this as well what's presented at various clinics I've attended.

 

Strength has to be built back up in the knee which takes time, and it's different for every person. Lots of tedious stregthening excerises with bands and body weight, then light jogging, then half speed, 3/4 speed... you get the idea. Straight line movements are easiest, the lateral movements are the ones that take time and confidence. The knee is "sound" in 6-8 months, then the athlete has to rebuild the lost muscle strength in the leg and gain their confidence back. It's difficult to explain, but they just don't go "all out", or least the 6 kids I've worked with haven't. It takes a long time for them to get confidence back and just play, so everything they do is just plain slow until they get it in their head that the knee won't be a problem. It's difficult to explain, there's just no burst in their movements.

 

Typically a player can be back playing in games in 9-10 months, but it usually takes much longer for them to get back to full speed, and that depends entirely on the individual, as that part is entirely mental. On the mental side the extreme case I was involved with personally was a girl basketball player. She was averaging double digit points and rebounds before the injury and a great defender for the team as a sophomore. She blew out her knee in early December and by April she was rehabbing every morning on her own (impressive dedication I might add) without any assistance, light jogging and stregthening phase. I kept an eye on her while we did plyos and weightlifting with the other kids, but she did a fantastic job sticking to her program. We just expected with her dedication and work ethic she'd make it back in record in time, and she did. The problem was that she was so slow it looked like she was moving in quicksand. We thought she'd get better as the year progressed but she didn't, and she was the exact same player a year later as a senior. Her stats basically were cut in half the rest of her career, and she couldn't guard an 80 year old man in a wheelchair, she just wouldn't push the knee at all.

 

I'm sure Yo won't be that timid, but if he starts compensating for a lack of confidence in his knee and it throws off his delivery... well now he's looking at problems in the other joints in the same leg. Sometimes when an athlete favors one leg they create an issue in the other leg, with a pitcher maybe an issue with arm if he starts trying to over throw if he isn't generating enough push initially. It's best in my opinion to just him progress at his own natural pace, and not help him create any further issues by rushing him.

[bullox]

The knee operation didn't happen immediately following the injury either, it was 2 or 3 weeks later.

Doesn't make a difference at all but the injury happened May 1st and the surgery was May 8th. Just clarifying.

 

[pitchleague]

I'll just add what I wrote in the Sabathia trade rumors section earlier this afternoon:

 

this may not be the appropriate thread for this, but I wish people would stop asking about Gallardo and his "coming back" date in the fall. It will not happen. If it does, (a) he is a modern medical miracle, a freak-of-nature, if you will, and (b) he will likely be VERY ineffective after having no real arm strength from not throwing all summer. And, I guess, © he will greatly be at risk to re-injure that knee and/or do something structurally to his arm.

 

He will be back in full swing in the spring. End of story.

and

 

It's absolutely fine if you and others feel that it's fun to think about it. I, for one, do not think of any fun out of putting a potential future ace into dangerous situations when his health is not 100%. Heck, it won't even be 80% in October. I just have too many memories of pitchers trying to come back way too early from an injury and it backfires horribly on them.

 

Just because an injury feels like it is healed and you are having no problems with it it doesn't mean that it IS healed. I don't know how many times I felt great after a few days of antibiotics for a chest infection, but the infection will return even worse if I don't do ALL the rehab (antibiotics). Maybe it's a bad analogy but so many physiological problems need proper and COMPLETE healing or you risk making things worse or causing incomplete healing which will, then never heal properly.

Sure, it's fun to dream about but I will seriously quit this board and become a Royals fan with Ben Hendrickson's dad if Gallardo pitches at all during the 2008 regular season or post-season (winter ball is another story, although I highly doubt that, too.)

[kalle8]

a professional athlete is aspected to be 100% after 4 to 6 months since acl surgery.

 

there are cases in which the rehabilitation is much more quicker.

 

Roberto Baggio (one of the greatest italian soccer players) returned after 100 days.

 

http://www.nonsoloparole.com/Public/accadde/dettagli.asp?ID=391 (in italian)

 

i asked tom h. what's the status of Yo, hope the next mailbag'll give an answer...

[badger07]

Jerry Rice suffered a torn ACL in week 1 '97, was back in action by week 15 (although he did get hurt in week 15 as well).

[foamboy1]

Joe Thomas was playing left tackle in the Big Ten six months following surgery.

 

Edit: So this ends up being post #1000. I had higher hopes for myself on this milestone.

[jwill535]

but as others have mentioned by the time he would be able to pitch he would have for 4-5 months and by that time there won't be any minor league games for him to rehab in. So at best you would be getting Yo at 60% and risking permanent damage to his knee and possibly his shoulder(see Sheets) for some possibly innings.

[kramnoj]

but as others have mentioned by the time he would be able to pitch he would have for 4-5 months and by that time there won't be any minor league games for him to rehab in. So at best you would be getting Yo at 60% and risking permanent damage to his knee and possibly his shoulder(see Sheets) for some possibly innings.

 

He doesn't have to pitch in actual games to rehab. Team conduct simulated games to do minor rehab for pitchers. And since he would only come back as a reliever (if at all), he doesn't need months to build up endurance to throw 100 pitches.

 

At this point we don't know. We certainly don't know enough for somebody to dismissively say end of story. It's July 7th. Gallardo has about 2 months to see where his knee is to see if it makes any sense at all to try and get in shape to pitch about a month after that. I would have to guess that Gallardo is motivated to join this team in the playoffs if that happens, even in a minor role. But I don't see any possibility that the team will let him come back if there was any chance of messing up the rehab.

[jwill535]

There is a HUGE difference between a rehab start and pitching a simulated game. You have to remember that this is going to be his plant leg and unlike other sports more then likely will not be able to pitch with a brace on. While I would gladly eat crow for this, expecting Yo to be back this year it a huge pipe dream.

 

To those that mentioned Thomas, it was 8-9 months after his surgery that he played, and even then he wasn't 100%. He was hurt Jan 1 and had surgery within a week of that. Camp starts mid August and during that he barely did any contact drills. His first real contact was the game week which was the beginning of September.

[kramnoj]

There is a HUGE difference between a rehab start and pitching a simulated game. While I would gladly eat crow for this, expecting Yo to be back this year it a huge pipe dream.

 

To those that mentioned Thomas, it was 8-9 months after his surgery that he played, and even then he wasn't 100%. He was hurt Jan 1 and had surgery within a week of that. Camp starts mid August and during that he barely did any contact drills. His first real contact was the game week which was the beginning of September.

 

The simulated games are probably irrelevant anyway, as I believe that is for starters not relievers. I think the pipe dream comment is pointless as I don't think anybody here expects Gallardo to be back. We have the thread starter asking for status, and we have some people saying it's not impossible. Who do you think expects Gallardo back?

[DannoMac21]

ESPN mentioned in the CC trade article last night that Gallardo's rehab was going along very well and that it's a 4 month process and there's a chance he could return late in the season. Doug Melvin was just asked about it in the news conference and said it was "too early to tell". What do you think the chances are of him returning?

 

Imagine this rotation...Sheets/Sabathia/Gallardo/Parra/Suppan

 

That's easily the best rotation in baseball. We can only hope.

[kramnoj]

I was glad to hear Melvin's response as well. Right now "too soon" is about the best we could hope for. RW23, even if Yo comes back, I don't think he would be put in the rotation. But if he does come back, he could be a nice addition to the bullpen.

[chowyo123]

Melvin just mentioned that there may be a chance Gallardo is back in September. He was on Mike and Mike for about 5 minutes.

[Brian the Automator]

More Yo talk today ... Will Carroll was on XM today and mentioned that Gallardo was throwing from 45 feet.

[yfinn6]

Wow. I don't even want to get too excited about this because of the potential letdown, but that's good news. At the least it means his rehab is going better than expected, regardless - IMO - if he pitches again this year it's good news.

[tnweill]

More info from Will Carroll on Gallardo at Baseball Prospectus:

 

In all the hype surrounding the impending C.C. Sabathia trade, there are a few interesting injury notes. Sabathia comes in as the No. 2 starter for the Brewers, taking over the spot they thought Gallardo would be filling, except that Gallardo's currently out after surgery to repair his ACL. there was some discussion that he could be back before the end of the season, and while it sounded crazy at the time, the Brewers may have something here. Gallardo is already throwing from 45 feet and could be back by September. It's a long shot, but the idea of Gallardo slotting in, perhaps even in the bullpen, is intriguing. It will be difficult to build up his arm strength enough to move him right into the rotation, and the team usually looks to the long term, but Gallardo did heal quickly from his spring knee surgery. There's a chance we'll see him again in 2008, but this is almost completely dependent on whether Sabathia is the difference maker that the Brewers think he is.

[Chio151]

Wow, way to go Gallardo. I would love to see him in some capacity late in the season.

 

But, I fully expect him to be our #1 next year with Parra as the #2. If Sheeter resigns, all the better.

[TauPentaRei]

No athlete has ever come back and played at full strength within 6 months of an ACL reconstruction... The knee operation didn't happen immediately following the injury either, it was 2 or 3 weeks later. While anything is possible, it would literally be a miracle.

Luke Skywalker had a new forearm and hand like, the same day after it was cut off by a light-saber.

 

I am continually amazed at how modern medicine has not kept up at all with science fiction.

[Fear The Chorizo]

I'm still thinking of it as a pipe dream, but the notion of the Brewer rotation with Sheets, Sabathia, Yo, and Parra around mid-September does have a nice look to it.

[Sheets4theHOF]

what about the possibility of pitching with some kind of knee brace to severally limit the potential for reinjury?

[Brian the Automator]

what about the possibility of pitching with some kind of knee brace to severally limit the potential for reinjury?

Once an ACL's repaired, it's good as new, stability-wise. The things limiting Gallardo are his strength, flexibility, and the fact that he hasn't been pitching.

My wife had her ACL reconstructed in March. Her strength and flexibility were really close to 100% in a couple of months. Pain's still an issue for her, but that's because they had to rip out her patellar tendon instead of using a tendon from a cadaver like most ACL's these days are done.

 

[southpaw121505]

Going on record right now: He'll pitch this year.

[trwi7]

Even if he can only pitch out of the bullpen that would be a huge boost for the club.