Sheets to start in the All Star game?

[Oldcity]

TLB, for whatever reason I call Clint Hurdle "Bootspur." No idea why. I just started calling him Bootspur Clint last year. It seemed to fit.

 

 

(split post when the thread was split --1992)

[TooLiveBrew]

Also TLB, for whatever reason I call Clint Hurdle "Bootspur." No idea why. I just started calling him Bootspur Clint last year. It seemed to fit.

 

I don't know why either, but I love it. There is now at least one other person in this world that will think "Bootspur!" each & every time he sees Clint Hurdle.

[JohnBriggs12]

ERA isn't the only measure of effectiveness. Sheets has a better WHIP (1.04) than Volquez (1.17). In fact, Hamels, Sheets, Wainwright, Dempster, Webb, and Peavy, all have better WHIPS than young Mr. Volquez. Volquez does lead in K's but is K/BB ratio of 2.44 is well below Sheets' 4.

 

You might start a rookie if no veteran is deserving, but there are several veterans having outstanding years, including Sheets.

 

Another factor is availability, and Sheets figures to make starts on 6/29, 7/4, and 7/9, meaning he'll have 5 days of rest for the July 15th game. Volquez figures to start 6/26, 7/1, 7/6, and 7/12, so he'll have 3 days less rest.

[cwolf2012]

Sheets' last start actually got him pretty close to Volquez in VoRP. I still say start the best overall pitcher (which is Volquez) and not someone else just because he's a veteran.

 

http://www.baseballprospectus.com/statistics/sortable/index.php?cid=204030

[PrimeTime955]

John Briggs,

 

Saying that Volquez shouldn't start because he's a rookie is just an absolute ignorant stance. I don't care if a guys is a 50 year veteran or a rookie he deserves to start. He has an absolutely sick era that is like .80 runs better then any other pitcher in the ENTIRE league, along with 10 wins and is leading the league in K's. Quit being a homer this should go to Volquez hands down.

[And That]

Saying that Volquez shouldn't start because he's a rookie is just an absolute ignorant stance.

"Absolute ignorant stance" probably isn't a phrase that lends itself to civil debate. Disagreement is fine, calling someone ignorant is not.

 

[fondybrewfan]

John Briggs,

 

Saying that Volquez shouldn't start because he's a rookie is just an absolute ignorant stance. I don't care if a guys is a 50 year veteran or a rookie he deserves to start. He has an absolutely sick era that is like .80 runs better then any other pitcher in the ENTIRE league, along with 10 wins and is leading the league in K's. Quit being a homer this should go to Volquez hands down.

He also pitches in a band box and is in a division with other band boxes. I keep expecting him to have bad stuff one night and just get shelled but he never does. I know it will happen but he is just incredible. How that trade worked for both teams is just amazing. The trade could potentially be a trade of a MVP for a Cy Young.

[MickeyDavis]

If they let him go on regular rest in his next start, he'll pitch the Sunday before the AS game, and get the game off.

B&B talked last night that he will actually be fully rested. We have one day off before the AS game and Ned will give Ben the extra day as he has all season.

Ben will pitch 6/29 at Minnesota, July 4 at home and July 9 at home. And unless one of the two remaining Atlanta games are rained out, there can be no rain outs in Minnesota or Milwaukee.

Ben will be fully rested for the AS game.

 

 

 

 

 

[PrimeTime955]

Saying that Volquez shouldn't start because he's a rookie is just an absolute ignorant stance.

"Absolute ignorant stance" probably isn't a phrase that lends itself to civil debate. Disagreement is fine, calling someone ignorant is not.

 

I'm not saying he's ignorant in general, just on this statement that he's making that Volquez shouldn't start because he's a rookie. I apologize if this classifies as name calling, I didn't mean it like that, I just severely disagree with the reasoning behind his argument. So John Briggs...I apologize, but can you tell me what being a rookie has to do with deserving to start the game because you have had the best first half?

[istanbultaye]

because there are a lot of rookie pitchers in the history of baseball who have come up to have outstanding success and then have their careers spin into the depths of despicability is one reason. That said, if a guy is head and shoulders above everyone else, they do deserve it regardless of service time. But, if two players are close, the veteran should get the nod over the rookie.

[PrimeTime955]

because there are a lot of rookie pitchers in the history of baseball who have come up to have outstanding success and then have their careers spin into the depths of despicability is one reason. That said, if a guy is head and shoulders above everyone else, they do deserve it regardless of service time. But, if two players are close, the veteran should get the nod over the rookie.

 

Who cares if their careers "spin into the depths of despicability?" Player A has better stats then Player B. Player A should start the All Star game regardless of service time.

 

And Volquez is heads and shoulders above everone else. He has a .80 better era then the second best era, the most K's in the league, and the second most wins.

[endaround]

Voloquez's VORP: 37.5

 

Sheets' VORP: 35.5

 

Sheets has pitched 10 more innings in the same number of starts (one less game)

 

It depends if you think the All Star game should be the "Game for players who had 1/2 of a good season" or if you weigh in past performance.

[Invader3K]

One other thing that's always bugged me about All-Star voting...shouldn't people technically factor in the second half of last season? You're basically only voting based on half a season of performance otherwise. What if a guy had a crummy first half last season, and amazing second half, and then a very good first half this season? Shouldn't he still get strong consideration (assuming he's near the top of his position)?

[1992casey]

Posts centering around Ben's contract status have been moved to the "Sheets testing the market" thread.

[PrimeTime955]

One other thing that's always bugged me about All-Star voting...shouldn't people technically factor in the second half of last season? You're basically only voting based on half a season of performance otherwise. What if a guy had a crummy first half last season, and amazing second half, and then a very good first half this season? Shouldn't he still get strong consideration (assuming he's near the top of his position)?

No, then they would call it the second half of 2007 and first half of 2008 All Star game. That makes about as much sense as saying Volquez's minor league stats should be considered when checking his numbers for the All Star Game.

 

endaround wrote:

---

It depends if you think the All Star game should be the "Game for players who had 1/2 of a good season" or if you weigh in past performance.

 

 

Why would you weigh in past performance for this seasons All Star Game? It should go to people who deserve it THIS season because the ASG is THIS season.

[jeffy]

PrimeTime955 wrote: Who cares if their careers "spin into the depths of despicability?" Player A has better stats then Player B. Player A should start the All Star game regardless of service time.

 

I think the point is they can be inconsistent. The rookie going out to start the all-star game may not pitch as well as the veteran that has been there before. If it were game 7 of the WS and you could choose a healthy Ben Sheets or Volquez, who would you pick? Who would most managers in MLB go with? If given a choice between the two for the remainder of the season, who would most managers pick?

 

Total runs allowed per nine innings are a bit closer than ERA between Sheets and Volquez, as the latter has benefitted from having 5 runs declared "unearned" while Sheets has only allowed a single "unearned" run. Not every unearned run occurs through no fault of the pitcher and a good pitcher avoids allowing runs whether "earned" or not. While Volquez has more strikeouts he also has far more walks than Sheets and has also hit 6 batters (0 for Sheets). Total baserunners allowed (H+BB+HBP) by Volquez 117 and by Sheets 108 and Sheets has pitched 9 more innings. Sheets also has 3 complete games and was one out away from a 4th.