Why was Gallardo a much better prospect than Inman?

[danzig6767]

If a mod wants to lock this,feel free,i just wanted to get this answered by someone better in the know thani and figured the question would likely get lost in a big multiple page trade thread.

 

I read the minor league forum,but don't do much else in regards to prospects.The numbers for Inman at simular levels as Gallardo were quite close to each other accross the board.I know Inman struggled early in AA,but if i remember correctly he was still suffering some from the case of mono and recently has pitched much better as he felt better.

 

Besides better size,what exactly did Gallardo have on Inman in regards to future projection?From what i read,Gallardo didn't throw any harder,both mainly sit in that 91-94 range.

 

I can't imagine that Melvin would have traded Gallardo while he was in AA for a free agent to be relief pitcher even if we were contending last year,so for the minor league gurus,what besides size made Inman expendable compared to Gallardo even though their numbers at simular levels were so close and there was little difference in velocity?

[TheCrew07]

Because Will is only 5' 10" and Yo through 2-3 mph harder I guess. I liked them both equally well.

[dadofandrew]

Size is a huge factor with RHP's. Saying "other than size" is like talking about a hitter with "other than his OBP". You can almost name all successful short RHP on one hand...Pedro, Oswalt, and so on.

 

Kirk Saarloos was a first round pick and he's never cashed in, just being a middling 10th/11th man on the staff.

[endaround]

Yes and the Mets were smart to trade away the short Kazmir!

[tomter38]

kazmir throws from the left side

[ajgodson]

Tim Lincecum for the Giants throws pretty well for a right-handed midget.

 

I'm not fan of Inman's, but just saying....

[JJHardy7]

Size doesn't always matter when it comes to pitching. We shouldn't try to justify this trade. If this trade was in the Trade Rumors link it would've been dismissed and got people upset. Now that it has happened we don't have to like and say Trust in Doug. It's ok to not like it and hope it makes sense down the road. Inman is 20 and you really can't say he'll never make it or that stuff because quite frankly he's done pretty well.

[danzig6767]

If one guy is 5'10 or 5'11 and another guy is 6'2,but their stuff is very simular,why would the 6'2 guy be expected to be a much better big leaguer?

 

Now i'm not saying Inman has simular stuff compared to Gallardo,i've never even seen Inman throw a single pitch.I'm just curious why a pitchers height makes their stuff less effective?Does it make their curveball or slider easier to see and hit?Does it make their say 92-93 mph fastball look slower to a hitter than if they were a few inches taller?

 

I realize most big league pitchers are 6' tall or bigger.Is this mainly because most short guys can't throw as hard as taller guys on average?Is there a history of shorter pitchers that put up stellar stats in the minors and that aren't soft tossers,then busting alot more once brought up to the majors compared to bigger guys?Or is it more that most short guys never really even excell in the higher minors,much less bust in he bigs,so there isn't alot of guys to compare this too?

[Dollarbill13]

Size is a huge factor with RHP's. Saying "other than size" is like talking about a hitter with "other than his OBP". You can almost name all successful short RHP on one hand...Pedro, Oswalt, and so on.

 

Al, I have to disagree with this comment. OBP is a measure of results and Will has put up nothing but good results at every level he's pitched at. While his height is somewhat of a concern, at some point you have to let the results outweigh the warts.

 

And regardless of whether you think Inman will pan out or not, given his peripherals he definitely has a lot of upside. And we just traded a 20 year old pitcher with upside to rent a reliever who is currently carrying a 5 K/9 ratio (significantly down from his 7.6 K/9 career mark and 8.5 K/9 in his best season) and a 3.80 ERA (5.69 FIP) in possibly the best pitchers park in the majors.

[brettac1]

1. Size

2. Velocity

3. No past injury

 

The fact that you can name those couple short RHP's so quickly is an exception that proves the rule.

[dadofandrew]

My point was, very few guys with crappy OBP's are good MLB players...ditto for short RHP's.

 

And Linsecum is good, but the good ones rarely stay healthy. I used to not feel this way, but you can't argue results.

[Dollarbill13]

I see what you're saying but OBP is a measure of actual skill while height isn''t. I'd say a better comparison for short RHPs not being successful would be like saying that big, fat, 1Bs wont age well.

 

Results wise, Inman is basically where Gallardo was last year. You can downgrade him some because of his stature but not to the point where we'd give him up for someone like Linebrink.

 

A contending team just gave up what some are calling an "elite set up man", for a couple guys who probably wont play for them this year. That probably wouldn't have happened if they felt he was still the same player he was a couple years ago.

[Bernman23]

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My point was, very few guys with crappy OBP's are good MLB players...ditto for short RHP's.

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That's a terrible analogy. One is a measure of production while the other is not. You don't win games as a result of your pitchers being of greater average height than their opponents. But having a greater OBP will factor into a win.

[danzig6767]

I understand not many short RHP are a success in the majors.I guess the question i'm trying to get at is,how often do short guys even reach the prospect status that Inman was?In the cases where it happened say the last 10 years or so,did they bust in the bigs generally or not even make it?

 

Since i don't follow the minors outside the Brewers or prospects outside our system,i wonder if Inman is already an exception by being short and a highly thought of pitching prospect?If that is the case,is there only a small sample of case studies simular to Inman to base a higher likelyhood of failure as he steps up in higher competition?

 

If say only a small amount of short righthanders who ever pitched extremely well in the minors,wasn't just some junkball guy fooling overmatched kids,and actually reached a high level prospect status,is there much data out there to show Inman has the deck really stacked against him?Or am i wrong and history is full of short Inman's who were great in the minors and reached a high prospect status,but bombed from there on?

[jjfanec]

Jim Powell was saying on the radio that Inman doesnt have the secondary stuff that Gallardo has. Not sure if the guys hear would agree with that but Powell said it as though it wasnt really that close. He said Inman was viewed as a number 4 guy.

[Bernman23]

And what's with the 5'10" exaggerations/rationalizations. This very site has him listed as 6'1" and minorleaguebaseall has him listed as 6'0". You know who else is listed at 6'1"? Ben Sheets. Also 6'1" and under: Tim Hudson, Tim Lincecum, Pedro Martinez, Roy Oswalt, Randy Wolf, Tom Glavine, Greg Maddux, Ted Lilly, Kelvim Escobar, Bartolo Colon, Jarrod Washburn, Johan Santana. Need I say more? His height is a virtual non issue.

[BREWCREW5]

for all of the mods....

 

There has to be like 3 different "why did Inman get traded?" threads right now with different subject lines. People need to relax on here.

[danzig6767]

There has to be like 3 different "why did Inman get traded?" threads right now with different subject lines. People need to relax on here.

 

Why don't you relax Mr. Board Policeman,if a mod wants to lock the thread,he will.

 

The point of the thread anyways isn't so much about the trade.I wanted to ask a question of those who follow minor leaguers/prospects alot more than i do.I was curious how much besides his height was a factor in Inman not being as a highly valued prospect and if studies have been done on how common is it for shorter pitchers to reach a very good prospect status,followed by what then those guys did going forward.

 

There are alot of number crunchers and big time followers of the minors on this site,i'm not one of them.Their knowledge i would like to hear from if they are willing to offer it.

[Never Outhustled]

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1. Size

2. Velocity

3. No past injury

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I agree with all this, but would like to add that Gallardo also has a much better changeup, and his slider translates a little better to the Majors than Inmans curve.

 

Basically, Inman was a pretty nice prospect, with similar stuff and demeanor to Dave Bush, though he is farther along with his development than pitchers normally are at his age. He'll debut in MLB at a young age, but that doesn't raise his ceiling. He's a better prospect than Steve Woodard, but Woodard is an example of a guy earning a spot in MLB at a very young age, despite a limited ceiling.

[BREWCREW5]

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Why don't you relax Mr. Board Policeman,if a mod wants to lock the thread,he will

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The best part is, I am a cop.

 

Your question can easily be answered in the other 10 threads.

[pogokat]

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The best part is, I am a cop.

 

Your question can easily be answered in the other 10 threads.

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chill...lets leave the moderating to the moderators please...

[pogokat]

I think the main reason is that Will hasnt been viewed as a guy who can rack up a bunch of innings...he needed a break last year and i suspect that the crew probably viewed him ass a reliever in their plans...

 

as for the fastball, there really isn't that much of a difference...maybe 1 mph off the top speed, as yo hits 94 and wil is probably around 93...both work in the low 90's so that's pretty negligible...

 

i'm no scout, which should be self evident, but i viewed will as an equal to or better than prospect to yo...i liked the way he threw, and in my limited viewings in the minors, will seemed better...actually, i've been to hundreds of minor league games, and will was probably the best starting pitcher i've seen..

 

As for the height thing, i'm 6' and will is about the same...i've stood next to me and he wasn't shorter than me...

 

i really just don't think the brewers thought he was going to progress as he moved up the chain...this is a perfect example of why i know i'm not an expert...but hey, i'm learning...

 

jeremy jeffress is the new goto guy in the minors...

[Ennder]

Scouts considered Gallardo a future ace, they consider Inman a future #4 or #5 starter, agree or disagree but thats the simple truth. Inman is a B+ level prospect and Gallardo is an A according to those who know baseball.

[DHonks]

really, critiquing height is a joke anyways. Leskanic was listed at 6'1 185, and I'd guess he was more like 5'9" and 160, yet he got in 10 years in the majors throwing 99 mph with a devastating slider. Oswalt and Hudson have had nice careers. Pedro has been dominant. To be honest, I'd rather have a guy at 5'10" than 6'6".

[JoeHova]

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He'll debut in MLB at a young age, but that doesn't raise his ceiling.

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I'm not so sure that this is true. I know that a very good predictor of being a great hitter is debuting at a young age. I would assume that a similar thing is true of pitchers. There will always be guys that debut at a young age and flame out and old guys who develop late, but in general, getting to MLB very quick is an excellent sign for a player's future.