6/14/08 Twins (Perkins) at Brewers (Suppan): 6:05 PM CDT

[strawbossisevil]

Maybe I'm just not smart enough, and I admittedly don't follow the minor leagues really at all, but if these guys are so good, why aren't they on the team right now? It's not like this team is flawless or not at all in the need of help.

Probably for a number of reasons:

1) All are still defensive works in progress. Especially Gamel. I've heard that Salome and LaPorta have been doing much better.

2) Keeping their arby clocks from ticking.

3) With Branyon crushing the ball, bringing up Gamel would be superfluous. Bringing up LaPorta would mean moving Hart to center midseason and that would probably not sit well with Cameron, so they are probably waiting with him until at least September in order to preserve team unity. Also, Kendell has done a solid job defensively this season despite his weak stick, so there is little reason to rush Salome. Plus Gamel and Salome are very young. Its best to let those guys go up a level at a time.

4) We can both agree that Braun and Fielder are stud players. But even they spent their time in the minors in order to be better prepared for a transition to the major leagues. And in the case of both, they waited behind players who were not as good as they were. (Overbay and Counsell)

 

[UndraftedFA]

I think the bullpen was managed pretty well tonight. Tavarez was obviously tired, but he was still probably the best chance for a ground ball; which they needed. I agree with the TV crew that something must be wrong with Mota. I am sure he was in the game otherwise. Ned has a 162 game schedule to manage. Must we forget that last summer's swoon was mainly due to an an overworked bullpen? You don't throw Mota out there if it is only going to continue a spiral down for him. Much like Bush batted instead of Hardy.

 

Ned did a fine job in this game. Spreading Torres out over 3 different innings was good. Hart's error lost this game. There was no Yosting tonight.

[Bruce Ciskie]

1) All are still defensive works in progress. Especially Gamel. I've heard that Salome and LaPorta have been doing much better.

2) Keeping their arby clocks from ticking.

3) With Branyon crushing the ball, bringing up Gamel would be superfluous. Bringing up LaPorta would mean moving Hart to center midseason and that would probably not sit well with Cameron, so they are probably waiting with him until at least September in order to preserve team unity. Also, Kendell has done a solid job defensively this season despite his weak stick, so there is little reason to rush Salome. Plus Gamel and Salome are very young. Its best to let those guys go up a level at a time.

 

 

1 - So we have more bad defensive players coming? Just what we need.

 

2 - So we're still cheap. Great.

 

3 - Cameron sucks. I'm not worried about his feelings. I want to win. Kendall has been okay. I'm fine with him sticking around, even though he's not much of a hitter.

[B2k1121]

Mota has been bad his last few outings. If he came in and blew it there would be plenty of people saying "Ned should know that Mota hasn't been sharp lately, this is on him."

The fact that Tavarez wasn't sharp THE PREVIOUS INNING should have trumped the fact that Mota hasn't been sharp lately. Tavarez couldn't even get through the bottom half of the Twins' bad order. How was he going to get through Mauer and Morneau?

I'm not standing up for him saying it was the right move to keep Tavarez in, i'm saying no matter who was pitching it would have been blamed on Yost, not necessarily by you, but you better believe there would have been other people complaining about Yost if Mota blew it.

[Bruce Ciskie]

Yost blames Hart's error on the grass.

 

Really.

 

Oh, and Mota was okay to pitch two innings in back-to-back games (day game after a night game at that), but he needed a second straight day off. Ack.

[strawbossisevil]

1. They are a work in progress. Doesn't mean they'll be terrible in the long run. That's why you give them time in the minors to work those things out.

 

2. And we have to be in order to compete in a small market. Like it or not.

 

3. He does, but is benching him for the rest of the season going to create to much drama on the bench? And could that drama harm the team? Plus he is a plus on the defensive end. Our team speed in the OF would go down quite a bit if we replaced Cameron with LaPorta. That would mean that our pitchers would give up more hits, which puts greater stress on an already stressed pitching staff. Plus asking Hart to pick up center mid-season is probably a bit of a stretch.

[brewers19]

I'm not standing up for him saying it was the right move to keep Tavarez in, i'm saying no matter who was pitching it would have been blamed on

Yost, not necessarily by you, but you better believe there would have been other people complaining about Yost if Mota blew it.

 

Maybe. But there would've been absolutely no one who would've said that Ned should've left Tavarez in as the alternative.

[jjfanec]

I have seen a lot of people blaming a hart miscue on here for the loss. I did not see the game. What happened?

[brewers19]

The grass did it.

[hawing]

Either Corey or "the grass" misplayed a ball in the top of the 9th, which contributed to the Twins scoring their 4th run. Without their 4th run, Russell's blast would have been not only exciting, epic and legendary, but also game-winning.

 

If the Brewers have an ounce of marketing sense in them, they'll have Branyan player tees available, preferably by our next game. God bless the Muscle.

[craigharmann]

For most of the game, I was enjoying myself. Then the Brewers are down in the 9th and down to their last man. Ned desperately PHs Russell, in the hopes that he jacks one. The pitch.....HE DOES! The crowd goes crazy, I'm excited, scaring the dog by screaming at the TV. But of course, we go to extras. Torres pitches great in the 10th and we don't get anything. Then Tavarez comes in and we get through the 11th. I'm thinking, so far, so good. And Prince's shot WAS a homer. What's the point in having a stupid yellow line? Nevertheless, he's at 3rd. We can win the game again, but the pitcher makes a great play on Cam's liner. After that, I had this sinking feeling it was going to bomb. Granted, there aren't a whole lot of options to bring in, but Mota was throwing in the pen and then didn't come in. BA said that a few times, and wasn't sure if Mota was hurt or what. I just get frustrated by this team. They can be fun to watch, but can be worse than beginning little leaguers to watch as well. I'm getting to the point of frustration with this team, and thankfully for the next week, I will be away from a TV where I can watch the good, bad, ugly and awful. Hopefully that helps, because it doesn't matter if guys 1-8 can crush the ball, the Brewers are going nowhere if they don't have pitching. A great effort from Soup wasted.

[Invader3K]

I was at this game last night. What a heartbreaker, and two losses in a row that I was at (I went Friday night as well). Thankfully I'm not going today, so hopefully they will avoid the sweep today and get a W.

 

I really don't think you can blame this one on Yost. The defense was a bit shaky (again), and at some point you just run out of relievers to use. The Brewers batters all seemed to be swinging for the fences the entire night. There was no opportunity to play small ball, it seemed like.

[BrewCrewForever]

I'm really looking forward to Riske and Gagne coming back soon, hopefully.

[Fatter than Joey]

Mota has been bad his last few outings. If he came in and blew it there would be plenty of people saying "Ned should know that Mota hasn't been sharp lately, this is on him."

 

False -- this is another ridiculous strawman statement. I am not a big Mota fan, in fact I think he sucks. I know Tavarez sucks as well --- but the key is Tavarez threw 30 pitches in the 11th, and I would rather have a fresh sucky pitcher in the game than a sucky pitcher who threw 30 pitches.

 

I really don't think you can blame this one on Yost. The defense was a bit shaky (again), and at some point you just run out of relievers to use.

 

Yost didn't run out of relievers, he ran out of decent ones -- that's on Melvin.

 

Both Melvin and Yost are bad at their jobs and should be canned.

[B2k1121]

Mota has been bad his last few outings. If he came in and blew it there would be plenty of people saying "Ned should know that Mota hasn't been sharp lately, this is on him."

 

False -- this is another ridiculous strawman statement. I am not a big Mota fan, in fact I think he sucks. I know Tavarez sucks as well --- but the key is Tavarez threw 30 pitches in the 11th, and I would rather have a fresh sucky pitcher in the game than a sucky pitcher who threw 30 pitches.

 

I really don't think you can blame this one on Yost. The defense was a bit shaky (again), and at some point you just run out of relievers to use.

 

Yost didn't run out of relievers, he ran out of decent ones -- that's on Melvin.

 

Both Melvin and Yost are bad at their jobs and should be canned.

The point is that people would have blamed the loss on Yost no matter what he did. It's not about whether keeping Tavarez in was the right move. Like I said before, maybe you wouldn't have blamed it on Yost if he did bring Mota in and he blew it, but someone would have.

[pitchleague]

By 2009 we could be adding Salome, Gamel, and LaPorta to a lineup that already has Fielder, Braun, and Hart.

This is true, but these players could just as easily do the same thing Rickie Weeks has done in Milwaukee--been a disappointment compared to what we all expected out of him.

EDIT: Also, I don't get the "grass" caused the error excuse (I'm assuming Ned or someone spoke of this in the press conference? I turned it off by then.). It's not like they are playing on a high school baseball field pock-marked by rocks and gopher holes like the majority of high school fields that I had to try to play outfield on back in the day. It's a Major League field for crying out loud.

 

 

 

 

[Fatter than Joey]

The point is that people would have blamed the loss on Yost no matter what he did.

 

You have no point -- only a strawman argument.

 

It's not about whether keeping Tavarez in was the right move.

 

It wasn't.

 

Like I said before, maybe you wouldn't have blamed it on Yost if he did bring Mota in and he blew it, but someone would have.

 

Then go find "someone" and argue with them. If you want to defend Yost and his moves -- that's fine, just don't create imaginary positions that you can easily refute.

[B2k1121]

My point is I can go back to every IGT from losses and there will most likely be someone blaming it on Yost. Like it not, my point is valid, because i'm right.

[Fatter than Joey]

Like it not, my point is valid, because i'm right.

 

It is easy to win strawman arguments, that's why people like yourself make them.

[B2k1121]

Like it not, my point is valid, because i'm right.

 

It is easy to win strawman arguments, that's why people like yourself make them.

It is also easy to blame every loss on Ned Yost, that's why people like you do it.

[Fatter than Joey]

It is also easy to blame every loss on Ned Yost, that's why people like you do it.

 

Again, this is a strawman argument.

 

I have never blamed every loss on Yost, or anything remotely close to that. No one here has done that. Ever.

 

I sincerely believe you are not aware of what a strawman argument is.

 

You should read this, it will help you understand what I am saying.