Hall upset with playing time

[TooLiveBrew]

Branyan is a favorable matchup only against some righthanded pitching. Many good righthanders have him for lunch.

 

 

Please provide some support here. This just sounds made-up.

[Brian the Automator]

Brian, if I were convinced Branyan had value, then I'd move Hall to SS and get Hardy out of there. Branyan is a favorable matchup only against some righthanded pitching. Many good righthanders have him for lunch.

 

Hardy has batted with 60 runners in scoring position this season. He's knocked in 6 of them. To me that is a much more astounding stat than Hall's splits. That is the kind of production you'd expect out of a pitcher not an every day player.

You really didn't answer the question about Hall's 2007 vs. RHP. And here are the logs vs each pitcher. Nothing in there tells me that many good righthanders have him for lunch. There's a couple that do, but there's also several that he's tore up. What are you basing this on?

 

 

 

 

 

[Thurston Fluff]

JJ doesn't have the huge differance in his splits so platooning him wouldn't have the same effect as Hall.

JJ's three year (2005-2007) splits:

 

vs LHP .297/.359/.558

vsRHP .251/.308/.383

 

With Braun, Hart, Hall, and Hardy there is a reason this team kills LHP and can't hit RHP.

 

I was looking at this year's performance since Hall's platooning this year appears to be based off of this year's lack of performance coupled with the perfect Platoon mate.

[uecker9]

According to those logs Branyan is 33-181 vs. RHP in the NL Central, with 85 Ks and 11 HRs. Or am I not reading them right?

[endaround]

JJ doesn't have the huge differance in his splits so platooning him wouldn't have the same effect as Hall.

JJ's three year (2005-2007) splits:

 

vs LHP .297/.359/.558

vsRHP .251/.308/.383

 

With Braun, Hart, Hall, and Hardy there is a reason this team kills LHP and can't hit RHP.

I was looking at this year's performance since Hall's platooning this year appears to be based off of this year's lack of performance coupled with the perfect Platoon mate.

There is not enough to go on for this year alone especially since Hardy isn't hitting any handed pitcher worth anything.

 

[Brian the Automator]

According to those logs Branyan is 33-181 vs. RHP in the NL Central, with 85 Ks and 11 HRs. Or am I not reading them right?

I'm not sure, did you compile that by hand?... and if so, what's the min number of PA's per pitcher that you're going off?

 

 

 

[rluzinski]

Tell me how often a guy gets on base and how much power he hits for. Whether he tends to have groundball outs or flyball outs or strikeouts is almost completely irrelevent. Heck, you could argue a guy like like Kendall, who grounds into a lot of outs is worse than a guy who strikes out a lot.

 

Just fans confusing what they don't like to watch with what hurts the team more.

[shelmark]

Who would you rather have at the plate against RHP right now, Hall or Hardy? I think it is a legitimate question. Does Hardy produce as many runs as Hall, despite the average difference. Looking at some stats, in the last two years Hall is batting .103 when he gets to a 1-2 count. He is batting .150 when it gets to an 0-2 count. So, it seems that one thing Billy might want to change is his approach when behind in count. Right Field Billy!! Also possibly shorten up the swing and maybe, dare I say it, choke up. I see Hall is batting over .300 this year when he leads off the inning. Would batting him leadoff for a week be a crazy thing. Make him think differently about his role. Tell him to hit the ball the other way; if he flunks that test then he can go back to supersub.

[uecker9]

I'm not sure, did you compile that by hand?... and if so, what's the min number of PA's per pitcher that you're going off?

 

Yeah, mostly single digit PA's, small sample syndrome, eh? It looks like he hits the Reds pretty well too, so that's cool. The Cubs though, not so much.

[Thurston Fluff]

There is not enough to go on for this year alone especially since Hardy isn't hitting any handed pitcher worth anything.

 

It depends on the circumstances. If the criteria is a short term fix until a long term answer comes along I would think basing that off results this year would be at least worth taking into account. Especially when taking into account players who are in the developmental stage oftheir careers. Add into it Hall has a platoon mate that makes htis move sensible. since Hardy has been about the same from both sides of the plate this season he should either be benched in favor of someone better or he plays and we hope he improves.

[endaround]

Except if we are only going by a single year, Counsell is far outproducing Hardy against RHP. Counsell vs RHP: .255/.369/.345 Hardy vs RHP .248/.307/.333

[Thurston Fluff]

Except if we are only going by a single year, Counsell is far outproducing Hardy against RHP. Counsell vs RHP: .255/.369/.345 Hardy vs RHP .248/.307/.333

 

If that trend continues you will see counsell get more time vs righties. When given the choice betweent two bad options there is nothing wrong with going to the hot hand or the guy having a better year over a short period of time IMO. I realize all the arguements about small samples and the dangers of predicting future outcomes based off that. I also realize sometimes a player needs to get his act together and start to produce or other options will be explored. Complacency can change someone from having a bad year to someone who is just bad.

[dadofandrew]

Counsell has played more of late at SS. Hall's OBP is about .200 vs. RHP, just off the charts bad. Some of it is bad luck, but I'd blame his lack of discipline and bad approach for most of it. Tonight, he swung wildly at the 0-1 pitch, then cut way down and blooped a hit in 0-2. If he starts doing that, his OBP will rise 100 points in no time. Branyan is what he is (another Doug Melvin minor league signing that is now helping), but he'll never match Hall's 2006. The question may be whether or not an extremely wealthy Bill Hall ever will...

[LouisEly]

I don't think this was entirely about hitting. I personally watched Hall pee away two games in Boston with three errors, and he's made a couple costly more since then. I guess Hardy's, Weeks', and Cameron's offensive performance has been more tolerable because they have played decent defense, but when you are performing poorly at the plate AND in the field your behind needs to get parked on the bench for a while.

 

Why he was allowed to start at 3B in the third game of the Boston series is beyond me, having committed three errors the day before. Maybe it was the two singles he got. Maybe I can see why Hall is confused about being benched now, because if he didn't warrant being benched on Sunday of the Boston series I don't know what warrants benching. But Billy, if you want to play you have to perform. At the plate and in the field.

[TooLiveBrew]

I guess Hardy's, Weeks', and Cameron's offensive performance has been more tolerable because they have played decent defense, but when you are performing poorly at the plate AND in the field your behind needs to get parked on the bench for a while.

 

Both Weeks & Cameron have been very good the past two weeks, which is a good indication why talent should be trusted over the small sample of the first month of a season. Hardy had a couple big hits tonight.[..EDIT: which doesn't mean what I implied. J.J. has a long way to go to make up for a very slow start, as do Rickie & Mike. They're the best options we have, so I vote to bank on them succeeding]

[logan82]

In my opinion the errors he makes aren't the biggest issue. It is how he makes errors. It is the mistakes like not covering third so that Hardy had to get the guy at first instead and trying to get a double play when you should try to get the guy at 1st instead. Playing ground balls off to the side instead of stepping in front of them. Mental and fundamental mistakes.

[Glennron]

In my opinion the errors he makes aren't the biggest issue. It is how he makes errors. It is the mistakes like not covering third so that Hardy had to get the guy at first instead and trying to get a double play when you should try to get the guy at 1st instead. Playing ground balls off to the side instead of stepping in front of them. Mental and fundamental mistakes.

That's a good point, logan. I guess I never really thought about Hall's throws to first, but after watching Branyan field at 3B, he just looks more sound and smooth with his throws.

[Dragonbait]

To me Billy seems to take the grounder with plenty of time... wait a while.... then throw really hard and make it closer than it shoud...

[Tbadder]

I like how Hall admitted he had to turn things around. His public outburst was legit, and explainable (?), but the relization that he had to get better might have been cathartic. I expect to see the rehabilitation of Bill Hall in the next 4 or 5 weeks.

[TooLiveBrew]

To me Billy seems to take the grounder with plenty of time... wait a while.... then throw really hard and make it closer than it shoud...

 

I agree -- Branyan has been the opposite of this so far, and it's quite refreshing.

[jeffy]

To me Billy seems to take the grounder with plenty of time... wait a while.... then throw really hard and make it closer than it shoud...

 

I agree -- Branyan has been the opposite of this so far, and it's quite refreshing.

 

Perhaps he has found that this just works better for him...who knows, maybe he found that if he does not take a second to settle himself his throws are wild.

[TooLiveBrew]

I have no problem with that notion, except that Hall takes the time so he can unleash a throw about as hard as he can muster. Imho there's just no need for that, and it will lead to less accuracy. Branyan, otoh, appears to not rush himself, but then make an accurate yet more modestly-sped throw to 1B. So far, his throws have been right on target -- can some Nashville observers weigh in further on Russ's D?

[jeffy]

Hall takes the time so he can unleash a throw about as hard as he can muster.

Maybe he wants the ball to penetrate deep into Fielder's glove so that it stays there http://forum.brewerfan.net/images/smilies/wink.gif http://forum.brewerfan.net/images/smilies/laugh.gif

 

 

[logan82]

I don't know about you guys, but I don't see anything "soft" about this platoon so far.

[brwrsfan]

I'd agree, but it's only been a few games. But it's been a pretty strict platoon at this point.