Bush has to STAY (was Bush has to go)

[TooLiveBrew]

Of course that's two stellar Bush outings (easily his two best, I think) that I had to miss bc they were day games. Rather he do well, though. Hats off, Dave Bush -- absolutely brilliant on the hill today!

 

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[Glennron]

Of course that's two stellar Bush outings (easily his two best, I think) that I had to miss bc they were day games. Rather he do well, though. Hats off, Dave Bush -- absolutely brilliant on the hill today!

 

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To be honest I think he pitched better on Saturday night against Pittsburgh than he did against Toronto a few weeks ago, but either way he's been pretty lights-out at home recently. So who of Bush/McClung/Suppan goes to the bullpen? I'm hoping McClung...

[owbc]

I'm really excited that Bush is finally pitching up to his potential. The road wins will come eventually.

Maybe some of our other underachieving talents (Rickie Weeks?!?!) can start to step up as well.

[endaround]

McClung should be the one because he tires at around 80 pitches and with his control issues that could be the third inning. And he just isn't that good.

[Postseason2006]

When Bush is ON, he's one. When he's not on, he's AWFUL.

[BrewCrewForever]

I have to tip my hat to Dave Bush. I really bashed him hard early in the year and he has really turned it around. 13 K's today? That is just crazy, I hope he can keep of this kind of consistency. I would have to imagine that McClung will be the one going to the pen when Suppan comes of the DL now.

[hauser42]

Bush is certainly on a hot streak right now and has to be road for it. When Soup is back I say McClung to the pen to help out in the 6/7 inning. Suppan is not going to be much help in the pen unless he is the long man/spot starter. C-Vill needs to take over the 8th for this team.

 

 

Blue Jays sure could use Bush now with the injuries their staff is racking up.

[Tbadder]

I love what Bush is doing now, but it does kinda prove how stupid this game is.

[MadisonBrewerBlue]

if this was the stock market.....suppan is odd man out..mcclung has done his job as a number 5 and bush has been lights out right in the past few weeks

[germanking]

http://forum.brewerfan.net/images/smilies/laugh.gifWith all the talk of Bush's ability to possibly be a #2-3 type starter, I think we now have small sample size proof that he is a true #2. Since he has been the #2 starter he is 1-0 with 3ER and 14 IP all runs on the solo shot meaning he is not walking as many. So, in theory, Nedly just needed to bump him up in the rotation 2 years ago and we would have made the playoffs last year being the dominant starter he is today as our #2 and only be 1/2 game back of the Scrubs right now.

I think I deserve a small pat on the back being only half serious at the time. And technically he is still our #2 starter looking at it from 2 ways. 1) He is still pitching after Ben Sheets or 2) We have Sheets and C. C. who are both #1's and we don't play by "actual" spots in the rotation.

 

But seriously, Bush has been dealing lately with 3 dominant starts and only 1 hiccup since I made that last post. I think I read on espn.com's summary of the game where a note was made at the end where Yost said he is considering using Bush at home and McClung on the road for starts. Unorthadox, maybe, brilliant, we will see.

[RU Rah Rah]

It is kind of scary to think that Bush somehow has "figured it out." The rotation would just be sick if he continued dealing like this.

 

Will he? History says . . . well, probably not. But I don't see any way you can relegate him to the pen at this point.

[homer]

History says Bush is somewhere in between his last few starts and the beginning of his season. I'll take that from a 4th starter.

[foamboy1]

It would be interesting to hear what Bush changed, or how he explains this run....it's been nothing short of phenomenal. I'd feel better to hear that he made an adjustment than he's doing the same thing and just getting a different result. I'd feel like we can expect "more good" in the future than reverting back to what we were used to.

[danzig6767]

It would be interesting to hear what Bush changed, or how he explains this run....it's been nothing short of phenomenal. I'd feel better to hear that he made an adjustment than he's doing the same thing and just getting a different result. I'd feel like we can expect "more good" in the future than reverting back to what we were used to.

Maybe his velocity is up a bit, but Bush is a softer throwing pitcher that relies almost entirely on command for success. Sabathia and Sheets in most starts can leave pitches over to much of the plate and not get burned bad because both have fastballs in the 94-98 range and Sheets has a filthy curve while Sabathia has a filthy slider.

Bush though if he has a few guys on base, he can't hang a curve or groove a 87mph fastball over the middle of the plate without getting burned badly for it. Nearly every starter in the game that lacks special stuff are walking a tightrope each time they take the mound. When i watch Bush pitch, if he keeps his fastball on the corners and down at least when he misses the corners, he usually cruises through the lineup. When that fastball splits the center of the plate or his curve just spins belt high, the ball finds the bleachers.

Hopefully Bush and the coaches found something that has improved his command, but my guess is that Bush is simply in a groove like a hitter gets in, look no farther than JJ Hardy. It's no coincidence that the majority of the better starters in the game have high end stuff, thus it allows them to not have their best stuff some nights and still can manage to go say 6 innings with only 3-4 runs given up. When guys like Bush or Suppan though miss their spots, things can turn ugly in a blink. As great as Bush has been pitching, it would hardly be a surprise if he got shelled in his next start, his margin for error is slim.

 

[rluzinski]

Threads like these need to be pinned to the top of the major league forum. What would have been the harm of going with Weaver just to see what he could do? I mean, he couldn't do worse than Bush right? Ack!

 

The real Dave Bush isn't as bad as he was when he had a 6.56 ERA when this thread was started and he's not as good as the insane 2.85 ERA he's put up since then. He was obviously not right for the first couple of starts from the season but but he's gotten back to pitching pretty decently overall. He's a flyball pitcher, so he's got more than a couple starts left where he gives up multiple HRs and gets hammered. Overall, though, we should expect perhaps a 4.5 ERA from him going foreword. Good enough for me.

 

How many players per season should be DFA'd or sent to the minors according to baseball fans that end up being valuable to their team that same year?

[BrewCrewForever]

Threads like these need to be pinned to the top of the major league forum. What would have been the harm of going with Weaver just to see what he could do? I mean, he couldn't do worse than Bush right? Ack!

 

I have to admit Rluz, I was totally one of those who thought that Weaver couldn't be worse then Bush. I stand corrected, Weaver would have never pitched has Bush has lately. Hats off to Bush, I just hope he can somewhat keep this up. He has the stuff, its keeping the ball down and avoiding the big inning. 13 K's is crazy though, WOW!

[TuesdaysWithRillo]

I was also in favor of Weaver getting a shot, but how can I blame myself? Despite Bush's recent success, the fact still remains that he cost us a lot of games in the first 2 months of the season because he gave up several innings of 3 runs or more. And who's to say he won't revert back to that because he's done it time and time again throughout his career? It's ok to ride Dave Bush now that he's hot, but what do we do when he starts reverting back to what he's been prone to?

 

Bush's career numbers show that he's a 4.5 ERA pitcher because he can go on hot stretches like this, but why can't we get some consistency out of the guy? I feel a lot better having him as our #5 starter because he fits the profile perfectly.

 

Can somebody please explain why Dave Bush can't pitch on the road but he's a God at Miller Park? It's not like Miller Park is a pitcher's paradise. You gotta love the enigma of Dave Bush.

[Beast Light]

I was definitely anti-Bush earlier in the season but not once did I ever think that Weaver was a viable option. The guy has done absolutely nothing in recent years and got smacked around in AAA. I would put DeFelice in the rotation over Weaver in a heartbeat.

 

Although I was anti-Bush, I always liked the guy and wanted to see him do well. It is great to see him put together such a nice run. I just hope it can continue. If he can keep this up, it will, in a way, counter the Harden trade that the Cubs made.

[rluzinski]

I was also in favor of Weaver getting a shot, but how can I blame myself?

 

Because objective projections showed that Bush was still easily better than Weaver (and that isn't saying much).

And who's to say he won't revert back to that because he's done it time and time again throughout his career?

 

Bush has a 4.56 career ERA. We probably would expect him to revert to that guy, more or less. A back-end of the rotation kind of pitcher.

 

Baseball fans typically WAYYYYYY overweight recent performance. That's why they can say a guy sucks/rocks/sucks/rocks all in the same year.

 

Can somebody please explain why Dave Bush can't pitch on the road but he's a God at Miller Park?

 

Because there is no rational explanation for it (I'd expect Miller Park to be bad for Bush), I just chalk it up as one of those weird splits that aren't predictive. They aren't hard to find in baseball. It's a crazy split, though.

[LUKE232323]

It seems like Bush throws harder at home. I have nothing to back that up at all and someone will probably bury me with a spray chart faster than Prince can house a tofu burger.

[TuesdaysWithRillo]

Because objective projections showed that Bush was still easily better than Weaver (and that isn't saying much).

Objective or not, Weaver has had a better career than Bush with a better track record so I wasn't shooting the moon with that opinion.

 

Baseball fans typically WAYYYYYY overweight recent performance. That's why they can say a guy sucks/rocks/sucks/rocks all in the same year.

So was I overweighing his 5 ERA last year?

[logan82]

Bush last year was our best starter at giving the bullpen rest(other than Sheets) by going 6+ innings. Better than "inning eater" Suppan.

[rluzinski]

Objective or not, Weaver has had a better career than Bush with a better track record so I wasn't shooting the moon with that opinion.

 

Jeff Weaver has been terrible for 3 years now. Hell, he has a career 4.72 ERA.

[TuesdaysWithRillo]

Jeff Weaver has been terrible for 3 years now. Hell, he has a career 4.72 ERA.

Yes he has, but Bush had a 7 ERA going at one point with a 5 ERA from 2007 on his belt. I was open to anything at that point. Luckily Dave Bush figured out how to pitch again. Although guys with 86 mph fastballs tend to go on streaks like that because they need pin point command or they are worthless. We saw the same thing with Capuano. When he was on, he was ok, but when he had his B stuff, our team usually lost.

[brewizard]

Just thought I'd bring back this thread for some perspective. Did anybody predict Bush would be Milwaukee's first post-season winning pitcher since 1982!?

 

Overbay for Bush was a good trade, no?