How long before Jeff Weaver makes a start for the Brewers?

[jhart05]

"Stop babying these guys, already."

 

 

I really don't think they are babying the starters. They are just not good enough to be able to go 7 or 8 innings.

 

When a pitcher gets lit up in the 5th or 6th inning, or goes over 100 pitches before the 7th, he is pitching poorly and needs to be taken out.

[xisxisxis]

Also, Maddux doesn't get a pass here. I've heard before that it is frustrating for young players to work with him because he is constantly tinkering with them. No first-hand proof, just what I've heard second hand.

 

I've heard similar things about Maddux, also second hand.

 

 

But if you think about it, how many promising young pitchers have come up the last 4-5 years, and how many of them have panned out? Not many young pitchers have gotten better under his tutelage.

 

Let's not restrict it to Pitchers. Do Hardy and Weeks look like they've improved. Fielder had a great year last year, but looks like crap this year. Hall is all over the map, Braun is a figment of last years imagination, and even Hart isn't doing as well as might be expected. The sample size might be small in 2008, but there are more than a few top prospects that are showing little to no advancement in the majors (in their frickin prime years). This organization is based on prospects as the model for success and if there isn't a significant improvement in their performance once they hit the majors we may never have that competitive window. I've always thought Yost was the worst manager for a set of young prospects, but maybe I've been too limited in my criticism and Maddux and the other coaches have a significant role to play too.

[naivin]

xisxisxis[/b]]I've always thought Yost was the worst manager for a set of young prospects, but maybe I've been too limited in my criticism and Maddux and the other coaches have a significant role to play too.

 

I think you left out one, make that two, very important groups...the players themselves. Don't they carry some responsibility here? Also, Doug Melvin and the people responsible for assembling and potentially overrrating some of the talent.

 

Believe me, I'd love it to be as simple as replacing the manager and a couple coaches, but that is a drastic oversimplification.

 

In a situation like the Brewers are in now, it is not only a question of why they may not be firing on all cylinders, but also a question of whether or not they even have all the cylinders. They way things look right now, I'm not sure we aren't a cylinder or two short.

[rluzinski]

This is the one thing i hate about Baseball stats guys, you go with projections over production.

 

You say that like projections ignore production. That's the only thing they look at! They just use a statistical approach to ensure that the most recent, small-sample performances aren't weighed too heavily. If you think Bush is a true 7 ERA pitcher based only on his terrible results this year, you've fallen into that trap.There's nothing magical or controversial about projections.

 

I don't have any problem with people being skeptical with the conclusions certain methods come up with. I do have a problem with people arguing against the method itself when they haven't spent the time to learn about it first.